"Sherlock Holmes II, baby!..." - Phoenix Wright Combos

So, I’m playing around more with entry into Turnabout mode with Wright. First I’m looking at TAC stuff. Any TAC into trial mode Wright ready to go will allow you to land Objection!. The question is how much you can get.

Off an up and side tag, your options are very limited. After you land the Objection!, all you can do is TAC again (in the corner you can also land a j.:m: that leads to nothing). I simply could not get j.:s: to land though I was able to land all three TAC directions, and I seriously tried every shenanigan I could think of to somehow get something more and nothing worked. This isn’t so bad as another TAC puts Wright in anchor with essentially full Turnabout meter, and if your team is built to capitalize off this, you could get big damage anyway (for instance, the team concept I’m working with is Wright/Ghost Rider/Doom which if I’m trying to use TACs to activate Turnabout my initial team config going in would be GR/Wright/Doom and final would be Doom/GR/Wright which is ideal since Wright ends up last and Doom is the best character on that team and one of the best in the game at doing a combo after a TAC). Do note the basic “TAC reset” that exists in this game though; if you think people are going to mash out counters on Wright’s TAC, you can probably (I would need another human present to test) opt not to do a TAC and punish their whiffed j.:s: with a s.:h: which would lead to a massive combo as Turnabout Wright.

On a down tag, you can link a quick j.:h: or :f: + :h: which lead to nothing (ground bounce is spent) or better a c.:h: which will wallbounce if you haven’t used it in the combo yet. Unfortunately at this point your ground bounce and wall bounce are spent which really limits combo options. You can dash (or wavedash) in and if they are already cornered start going for s.:h: stuff which is going to be limited based on hitstun scaling or just go for a basic relaunch into a TAC which is basically just bonus damage. If they were cornered as you did the down TAC, you have it much better since you can connect with a lot of stuff and not just c.:h:. As per the full list of things you can land and what combos you can do at that point, another day.

Just figuring this stuff out took me hours, and honestly it’s really tiring to explore Turnabout mode combos since every mistake requires restarting and reachieving Turnabout. Eventually if we want this character to work we’re going to need optimal Turnabout combos which I’m finding in general a lot harder to make work than I thought at first (he’s no Dark Phoenix!). For now, I’m going to do some more entertaining research.

OTG assists help Wright a lot. He can trivially use almost any of them to combo into Objection! off his grounded overhead as well as off launches sometimes and they generally let him extend his combos. We’ll have to eventually go through the help these provide, but for now, I’m going to document which let you combo into Objection! from launch into magic series:

Anywhere:

Ghost Rider-y
Deadpool-B
Wesker-B

Corner only:

Ghost Rider-B
Dormammu-B
Hulk-a (I think if you’re inhuman you can maybe hit it midscreen, but mortals need not apply)
Iron Fist-B
Sentinel-y (like Hulk-a)
Dante-B
C.Viper-B
Felicia-B

Nowhere but can follow up overhead at least:

Iron Man-y
She-Hulk-a
Shuma-Gorath-a
Super-Skrull-a
X-23-B (too little hitstun to do bare Objection!, usefulness minimal)
Arthur-y
Firebrand-a

Not useful as an OTG to Wright:

Hawkeye-B/y
Sentinel-B
Storm-B
Akuma-y
Viewtiful Joe-y

So slow as to allow stuff if called before launch:

Doom-B

So the short version of that is that for Wright Deadpool-B, Wesker-B, and Ghost Rider-y (the last making things harder but still working) are going to do the most for him in this regard. Hulk-a and Sentinel-y are so close; they just barely whiff most of the time, and I’ve seen them hit before but it’s just so hard to both get the OTG hit mid-screen (which I can’t do with any consistency at all) and then happen to nail the Objection! (for Hulk at least, it’s really non-trivial to move forward right and tag them with Objection! as the assist sends them flying back but I suspect it’s possible) but maybe they work perfectly against a few big characters or something. The entire second list will still be quite helpful to him, and the third list will be of some use. I can’t really see where the OTGs offered by the fourth list could possibly be used by Wright; most of them are way too slow for Wright other than Hawkeye-B which hits way too far forward for Wright to really use. Of course, Doom-B is a very special OTG assist due to the remarkably slow speed, but naturally it will have various uses for Wright (as it does for everyone really).

This is basically what I’ve found for the day in terms of “comboing into Objection!” research. I also tried playing around with multiple relaunches with assist support in Investigation mode, but hitstun decay seems to make it pretty impractical. With my old BnB and using Wesker-B to relaunch instead of the judge hyper, the enemy would air recover from the launch before I could land a single air normal. These assists may enable extended combos mid-screen though, but I haven’t explored that yet.

Hi, I found a combo starting from Investigations mode (632 000 damage, 2 meters)

:l: (or c.:l:), s:m: :h:, :f: + :h:, :d::d: + :s: (stance change), :qcf: + :atk::atk: (Steel Samurai Maya Smelting!), :f: + :h:, :s:, j.:m:, j.:h:, j.:d: + :h: (opponent stuned), s.:h: :h: (lightbulb), :s:, j.:m: j.:m:, j.:h:, j.:s:, :qcb: + :atk::atk: (Order in the Court !)

The opponent is always stun after the third Hold It (tested on Iron Fist, I don’t know if it’s character specific), but it doesn’t give you enough time to stance change and gather evidence.
I hope this helps :x

Note that if you do have three good evidence when you start that combo, the :f: + :h: after the Maya hyper will put you into Turnabout which will really change how the combo works. If you leave out the j.:h: afterward, it should still work in Turnabout up to forcing the stun at which point you’d need to look to doing something completely new.

In Trial mode with 3 pieces of evidence::l:,:m:,:h:,:h:(Bulb),:u:(Jump cancel),:m:,:h:,:s:,(On ground):m:,:h:,:h:(Bulb),:f::h:(Turnabout mode):s:,(in air):m:,:m:,:h:,:d::h:,(On Ground):s:,(in air):m:,:m:,:h:,:d::h:,(on Ground):s:(in air):s:(on ground:dp::atk::atk:(Lvl3)

I’ll post a video soon, it should kill any character (it even does 100% on Thor without X factor) Also works at midscreen, you just need to dash before you press :s: after entering turnabout mode.

Also, a possible thread title?

Stepladders? Pshh, we don’t need no stinkin’ stepladders!

“Hey this is the combo thread. Post combos here please!! Thanks!!”

“The title sucks on this thread!!!”

“But… the combos…”

“NOOOOOO!!! FUCK COMBOS!!! I WANT A CORNY NAME THAT WE CAN LAUGH AT!!!”

“Can you post a combo first?”

“Lol No… BUT I WANT A CORNY NAME!!! CHANGE IT NAOOOOOOOOOO!!!”

-_______-


c.:m:. c.:h: c.:h: xx L.Paperwork, s.:h: s:h:(lightbulb) jc into anything…

I have a tough time linking paperwork into s. H. Is there a secret?

cancel it as early as possible, really.

Trial Mode
s.:h:, s.:h: (lightbulb), j.:h:, j.:h:, j.:s:, s.:h:, s.:h: (lightbulb), j.:h:, j.:h:, j.:s:, s.:h: xx :qcf: + :atk::atk: (Maya), s.:h:, s.:s:, j.:m:, j.:m:, j.:h:, j.:s:, :qcb: + :l: xx :qcb: + :atk::atk: (Judge)

Approx 730k HOWEVER your opponent will not be thrown into the knockdown due to being hit by the paperwork special and any character that is capable of combo-ing OTG will punish you. In those situations DO NOT use the paperwork.

I have some simple corner combos with Phoenix Wright here
Trial Mode:
This combos in Turnabout Mode and Kills all characters except 1,200,000+
:l:,:m:,:h:,:h: (lightbulb) j.:h:, j.:s:,:l:,:m:,:h:,:h: (lightbulb),:f: + :h:(OBJECTION),:s:, j.:m:, j.:m:, j.:h:, j.d :h:(Objection), :s:, j.:m:, j.:m:, j.:s:, :dp::atk::atk: (Level 3)

Turnabout Mode:
Kills every character
:l:,:m:,:h:,:l:,:m:,:h:,:l:,:m:,c.:h:, back dash,:l:,:m:,:s:, j.:m:, j.:m:, j.:h:, j.d :h:(Objection), :s:, j.:m:, j.:m:, j.:s:, :dp::atk::atk: (Level 3)

or if you want a simpler Version
:l:,:m:,:h:,:l:,:m:,c.:h:, back dash,:l:,:m:,:s:, j.:m:, j.:m:, j.:h:, j.d :h:(Objection), :s:, j.:m:, j.:m:, j.:s:, :dp::atk::atk: (Level 3)
Hopefully they help

Can someone post a video of this? I can’t seem to get the timing down for the j.:m:, j.:m:, j.:h:, j.d :h:(Objection) to go into turnabout, they keep air recovering before the objection hits. Thanks for the ideas though, Phoenix is lots of fun to play.

With Rising Fang assist: 655k (corner only), 1 bar

:m:, :h:, forward:h: (call iron fist)>down down:s:> :h:xx:h:(lightbulb), :s:> j:m:, j:h:, down:h:, :s:> :qcb:/:qcf:+:l:, :qcb::atk::atk:

Tip: You need to hit the s.:h: after rising fang hits when they are close to the ground so that the air series connects afterwards.

The air Objection is done while already in Turnabout Mode, where it’s a lot faster.

Thanks for clearing that up. So what do people think are the best (i.e. most match practical) combos to go into turnabout from Trial? So far I’ve been tagging out phoenix when he’s got 3 good evidences (covered by maya) and then I just try to start an air combo with my other character and air exchange into phoenix wright and hit down H right away after the exchange. Anyone got anything better than this?

I feel bad doing air exchanges, but not bad enough to not pull that shit out at a tournament. =)

My most common tactic as PW to guarantee a bridge to turnabout is DHCing into PW STEEL SAMURAI MAYA SMELTING!1. In my case, I specifically DHC from Zero Rekkoha immediately into PW. It’s possible to do this from investigation (Immediately switch to court, s.j. immediately into a meaty objection). This will work best with any hyper that sustains itself after the character leaves. I BELIEVE this includes sentinel drones and Storm blizzard. With tight timing I can do this from Investigation mode (Gotta switch to court and jump in my case!) but it’s stupidly simple if PW comes in using Court mode.

A result of the above is you can also do an easy combo into a hard knockdown and then team super for your objection.

The other braindead one is (Court Mode) L M H Launch OBJEEECTION. It’s gotta be quick, but this does work. I haven’t been able to follow this up, but haven’t tried too hard.

The more difficult one starts in Investigation. L M H Hold it! (Switch to Court) Maya Super xx wavedash forward twice into an objection. I’m still pretty awful at the timing, but have been able to do this a couple times. The best part is that you can follow this up with some good ol’ turnabout finger justice.

Having as many options as possible is important. Spamming objection can be useful if you’ve got the proper assist to keep you safe. I find people are very reluctant to try anything due to the consequences of being hit. Although, keep in mind that Objection can be countered (Which a lot of people don’t seem to know due to the lack of PW’s/the weirdness of the attack)

Anyway, the more methods to get into Turnabout the better.

Two things I’d like to add to the above:

One thing I’ve found fairly useful is having an assist that can help you do a stance change mid combo. This way, you can trick an opponent into attacking you with the Maya shield up and get free turnabout because of it. Specifically, my combo involves LMH, f.H + call Nemesis’ Launcher Slam, stance change while Nemmy goes at it, OBJECTION, c.H, then dash into Maya Super + hard tag. I think there are a good number of assists that can pull this or something similar off. Alternatively, you could go for a Slip Up, call OTG assist, stance change, OBJECTION!
As the game develops, I imagine folks will come to respect Maya more or just go for the grab, but in the meantime, it’s worked decently for me.

Also, when you get the Objection, you become safe. There is no punishing it once it lands(not to my knowledge, at least). So if the opponent calls a vulnerable assist or one with a big hitbox(i.e, Sentinel drone spam or meter building assists), go for them if you can. They can’t block it and they are stuck out there until they finish their attack.

I tried it a bit in the lab, and Crossover Counter(PtW) into Maya super into Objection works too, but not only does it cost two meters, it’s really only useful to punish a blocked S, if I’m not mistaken. Mid blockstring risks you getting hit, and I believe during a multi-hitting hyper like Maximum Vergil ensures you get hit.

Thanks for all the ideas, I’m finally gonna get some lab time tonight so I can try these things. I am quite enjoying playing phoenix wright though I admit his style is pretty gimmicky. Does anyone know if you hit the assist with objection but not the point (they block or dodge) if you go into turnabout? Otherwise I’ll try it tonight and post results.

You definitely do. And good lord does it make people who know about it more weary about spamming assists

I swear half the times I get into Turnabout its from hitting an assist.

Oh yeah also he should already be in turnabout mode during the second objection
I made a simple combo video. The phoenix wright combos are the last ones.

[media=youtube]Sb52ISdZDVo[/media]

Turnabout Objection stuns after two hits. Not at home right now; anyone know if Objection stun resets damage scaling/hitstun? Because if it does, PW should be able to do Objection combo loops and one-touch the entire cast without his level 3…

He can’t stun twice in one combo, I tried it a while ago with TACs. Doesn’t work.

And it definitely doesn’t reset hitstun, not sure about damage though.