It’s always easier to stand on moral high ground when everybody else around you has done something after the fact, and you didn’t participate in it for whatever reason.
funny how that works
I don’t think you’re quite getting the situation, nor understanding people’s reactions. Most people don’t think that the death penalty is a valid punishment for robbery, so it’s not that they think that just because someone robs a person they deserve to die. What is being said is that if a person breaks into someone’s house they should be prepared to die, and the person who’s robbed should have the right to kill them, “so what’s the difference?” is probably what you’re asking. Well the difference is as follows.
There’s no place on earth that a person feels safer than in their own home. Someone intruding upon that feeling of safety is scary, and triggers the most base of responses. They fear for their life. If a person breaks into someone’s home they can’t possibly think that the residents will just roll over and let their shit be taken. They know that they’ll be in for a fight, quite often the intruder is armed because of this, and every year many people die during the course of home invasions. As such it’s quite reasonable, for the resident to view this as a life or death situation. The reason why people are ok with the invaders being killed is because they were completely in the wrong for putting the residents of the home in this kind of situation. The resident is defending themselves as if their life depends on it, and quite frankly, there’s a damned good chance that it does. This is why the law pretty much looks the other way if a homeowner kills someone during the course of a break in.
Think about the alternative. What if the person who kills a burglar had to face murder charges? That would be ridiculous. It takes power away from the victims. If a person had to decide in the spur of the moment whether or not going to jail was worth it a lot more innocent people would end up dead. Their apprehension from facing a prison sentence may cause them to hesitate, and end up dead, or injured. Furthermore the law, in principle, is supposed to protect the innocent. The guy who’s just relaxing at home was innocent until someone intruded upon his space. He shouldn’t be treated like a criminal because some other asshole forced him to defend himself.
What. How does anything you just said have anything to do with what I said.
Also I’m not American.
This happened a few miles from my house, so its not just some news story to me. I’m just glad there’s less scum on the street to rob my house or hurt my children .
Dude may get in trouble, but at 80 he’s lived his life. Thanks for your service :tup:
BTW since this is SRK I have to include the obligatory fighting game reference.
Bitch got Tung Fu Rue’d
Dude was forced to Shou Ha where she fucked up.
Heh. They probably would have gone on to burglarize, beat and possibly kill more people. Hell, they could’ve come back for revenge real quick.
I dunno, man. I know she was defenseless at this particular moment… but I doubt he could have restrained her. What if she got right back up and grabbed the gun from him? He’s an 80 year-old.
He may have taken drastic measures, but I feel like he’s not entirely in the wrong. Definitely a heated moment. I don’t care if they had taken on a run. If you’re getting beaten by multiple people… you’re not gonna drop everything and go smoke a bowl when they take off. Like, “shit, that was whack man.”
“Don’t worry babe, if he pulls a gun, we just gotta get off his lawn and we’re in the safe-zone!”
This reminds me of that old dude who shot and killed a couple robbing him. He called 911 and they recorded the whole thing. He first injured them then killed them. Was cold to hear them begging for mercy and him treating it like a video game.
she wasnt even pregnant
Hell now a days you would probably get sued by said person if they were to live!
you actually can, and people have had to pay full medical expenses. that’s why people who say “shoot to incapacitate” are fucking dumb
(Welcome to a page ago, NickRocks, hence the title change. I suppose no one did post a link though.)
I’m not sure what’s more amusing about the last 50~ posts: seeing some people change their minds about this as more details come out or seeing dab00g still acting like an armchair prosecutor & trying to call this first-degree murder.
At most, this would be second-degree murder and even then that’s arguably stretching it.
“Perhaps”? Try “definitely”.
As for “in the right”, it depends on what you mean by that. Do you mean “right” in the eyes of the law, which often isn’t “right” in the moral sense anyway? If so, then as has been constantly stated by several people, including myself, self-defense laws vary (widely) from state to state. So he would have been “in the right” in Texas, but in California, he’s probably not “in the right” by this state’s definition of self-defense even if they don’t actually bother to ever charge him.
If that is indeed what you meant, then I’ll ask my own hypothetical question: Would you have been fine with this exact same case if this happened in a state where self-defense laws were more lax and this was perfectly legal, i.e. Texas?
Regardless, I personally never said anything about “right” or “wrong”. I merely said that I understand why he shot her and, in this instance, I saw no problem with it even when she might have been pregnant though I was dubious that she was. I also certainly don’t feel at all sad about her death given the circumstances.
@reh - Meh, no need to apologize. You speak English better than most of my fellow Americans unfortunately. While Hotobu already responded to this sensibly (since pedoviejo tends…not to), I just figured I’d personally respond to what I put in bold.
Yes, there’s a lack of faith in so-called “justice” system. I can’t speak for anyone else, but there’s generally a lot of bullshit laws on the books here for rather transparently political or capital interests; see: The (oh-so successful) War on Drugs. On top of that, it is sadly true that if he had merely shot to injure her, like say shooting her in the knees, then she probably would have been able to sue him (successfully) even while being charged with this botched attempted robbery. Our nation is litigious like that.
Granted, it’s not like the American “justice” system is as bad as too many other countries’ even more transparently ridiculous court systems, but at the same time it still has severe issues. Unfortunately, America tends to have a problem with never trying to objectively tackle its issues since it’s either too busy saying how great it is & outright ignoring them or heavily politicizing them into talking points.
I’m personally in a weird place because I’m not at all pro-gun, but at the same time I don’t exactly expect the courts to have reasonably jailed these people for any significant amount of time or have rehabilitated them. Well, unless they had drugs on them since we’re way harder on drug offenses (at least when the prosecuted are minorities) than we are on most other things, including killing people. Additionally, being jailed here also often isn’t really “severe punishment” even with as crappy as we can treat prisoners and as much as we joke rather terribly about something as horrible as prison rape; more often than not, being jailed is certainly better than being homeless here or even just being poor here.
All that said, I can understand why you’re discomforted about it and how jarring it might be, especially if you hadn’t noticed before that America is so gun-and-violence happy. It’s all that repression. [/says the most repressed person here]
Fair point. Methinks I need to ponder this situation more.
Maybe he was wrong but let’s face the world is a little better of with her not in it.
Nexus spell check kicks my ass every time
Idk why there is so much talk about whether the bitch was pregnant or not. As far as I’m concerned, the unborn was a hostage. I can understand the foreign SRK members having an issue, but in America, we don’t negotiate with hostage takers…
shut the fuck up
well, he could ask for his medical expenses to be taken care of, because he was beaten and shocked too.
killing her automatically deprived him of that right…think before you shoot!
then I guess I am right if I see someone mug an old man and dont intervene to stop him
if I injure him he’ll sue me. better leave this to the police. no time to play hero
Not gonna happen, becuase in order to sue, you need to sue somebody that has things. That’s why there have been cases where the asshole sues the victim succesfully