I think he is good, I pretty much called it, he will be similar to SF4. Great overall but some horrid matches. I can already see some hard counters like Juri and maybe even Dhalsim. Anybody that can take his shots out of the game completely he’s going to find it hard because you can’t close ground with that dash. I think as a development, Sagat players may have to use knee’s to get around the screen, but we will see.
3 Likes
how about that long ass, cancelable st.lk? I got lit to hell and back with it yesterday. The guy I was playing is already ridiculous at whiff punishing. That button made me whiffing a button get punished in the most easy bake oven way.
Not good for Zeku with his shorty buttons.
1 Like
I think he’s top 10.
He’s got some shit match-ups like Juri/Menat/Guile where they either invalidate plasma, or do it better than him. But his grounded tools are amazing. His oki is the only worrying part, he can’t build momentum which is really important in V.
top 10 means he’d beat a hell of a lot of people. Who do you have Sagat beating in a clean 6/4 way?
2 Likes
Haven’t really got a whole MU chart at the ready, I just think he’s more than strong enough to fit into top 10. In the latter half, not top 5.
[][][]]]][][]
his st.lk has the exact same length as his st.lp, btw. tk whiffs from max distance canceled from st.lk but he can connect fireballs
Oh that button is legit nuts. I actually thought it might be broken yesterday I was interuppting so many characters strings because it seemed like it was pulling him back. That’s probably just the shorter hurt box though.
Honestly I think without that he’d struggle, it’s keeping him in the contest.
His anti-airs are probably the best in the game right now.
St.hk, f.hk, every version of DP and even a fucking jab AA. St.mp works too.
And his st.hk/f.hk/h.dp reach like halfscreen, and if st.hk CCs which is common he picks up massive damage.
3 Likes
Alright, I’m really feeling Falke. And not in the way you think because I haven’t bought any sexy costumes yet.
I just really love that she’s finally a character that lets me play this friggin’ game like I want to. You jump? You die. Safe two-hit combo that can be confirmed into Super with old man reactions? Check. And for some reason she also hits like a truck despite being a neutral/zoner archetype.
I’ve also decided to use Trigger II because Trigger I looks boring. Again this might be a rank thing but cancelling anything on block into overhead hasn’t failed me yet and dishes out retarded levels of damage and stun. Only downside is that she can’t really build V-Gauge without getting punched and that there’s no neutral activation for it (wtf were they thinking there?).
1 Like
probably known but fuck it, the blockstring cr.lk, st.lp, cr.mk xx lk tiger knee gives you a knee that’s 0 on block.
I’ve tried this with the other cancelable normals, and you get -2 or -1 or makes the knee whiff. So there’s something about cr.mk that makes shift his positional thing-a-majigger so that it moves him close enough for the tiger knee to hit.
This might be the reason why he doesn’t have a 3 frame normal. otherwise you’re going to eat this sequence in the corner ad nauseum.
1 Like
Sagat generally can control too much of the screen and has too much ground/AA damage for a 3 frame. The only reason Menat has a 3 frame is no EX reversal and her V Reversal is pretty much a guaranteed punish vs most of the cast. Without that 3 frame and her plus 3/4/5 on block 4 F jab she would be holding shit all day. Like Falke and Guile, if you have an EX reversal and can put reach on the screen, you dont need a 3 frame.
VT2 is competitively garbage because you basically cant go to a tournament with an unsafe on block VTC. Just wont work out. Most of her flip shit in it isn’t real any way and her staff swing move is basically just a more minus version of Cody’s trigger pipe swing with more range. VT1 gets to the point and gives her an extra stock of super powered shots to throw along with her regular ones and improves her plus frames and chip (and makes V Skill somewhat useful finally). VT1 is also pretty fun as it has some anime ass shit with the air fireball where you can bounce it off the floor and juggle people trying to jump away from the ricochet. It also makes all your staff normals cancelable into the shots which sets up some pretty cheap air jump ins into pressure. Makes f+HP go from ranged poke to pressure tool and combo converter/oki setup.
With that said having fun is most important though so if you’re having fun with VT2, definitely dont stop having fun.
hey wtf? P tiger shots are +1 on block?
you can make Lk tiger shots +0 on block too?!
hell he can make LK shots + on block. This guy has pressure for days. What in the tits is going on with this Sagat? Apparently the way he is gonna mount a come back is by making you eat a bunch of bullshit you won’t have a good answer for. This fucker is Bison with projectiles and a good anti air apparently. Why are people downplaying?
Is James Chen behind this? 
6 Likes
Well of course his High Shots are +, they can be ducked. Who the hell would be stand blocking Sagat’s blockstrings?
Well I’m definitely not going to any tournaments. Or even hit up rank for that matter.
I’ve never seen or heard of a Falke player using Trigger II so that was kind of enough info already to know that Trigger I is way better than the other. But unfamiliarity is a thing that can work out in your favour (yes, I also played Hakan).
If by S4 they give her an alternate activation for Trigger II (tapping the buttons gives you a safe activation and holding them gives you the current activation) that’d be a great buff. I also feel like she should build meter when she absorbs a fireball with V-Skill. It’s kind of baffling it doesn’t do that to be honest when every other V-Skill with similar properties has some kind of benefit for the user.
1 Like
So Sagat’s VT2 is really fun. The combo is quite technical comparatively to most, and the armour kick has huge utility vs. V-Reversals. I’ve been countering VRs with it most of today.
1 Like
I played Sagat all of yesterday. Pretty fun. Still haven’t played highland in the mirror though. Planning on going with both sagat and G as they are both my style. Sagat has the nice plasma I like without having to charge or having to be crippled with stubby normals/slow walkspeed/some other sf5 balancing crap (st.lk is gdlk)
I think the only things I don’t like about him is that his cr.mp is a bit stubby, but he has buttons that make up for that. And that he can’t cr.mp xx fireball xx super from distance. This for me is one of the old streetfighter fundamentals I really miss. But that brings me to G:
I love him. Has a command grab so I never feel inadequate upclose, no matter how slow it is. Has a midrange fireball that is very serviceable. VT1 is currently borked and I fully expect it to be greatly toned down sooner or later. Level 3 dp+k xx v skill is funny as shit.
But I REALLY like his cr.mp xxfireball xx super. Shit hits from crazy ranges and full confirms into very nice damage for something that when spaced well is decently safe.
So a command grabber with a workable fireball? I’m in.
And the one sagat fireball tip I have is obvious, but w/e:
With urien, people will jump his fireballs at obvious ranges, but they will do it on reaction so jab fakes and stuff doesn’t work. What DOES work is throwing a fierce AA fireball and watching them jump into it. Shits amazing.
Sagat has the same thing. Throw your low tigers and shit, vary the spacing and speed while making sure to mostly abuse the jab version. But when you think they will jump, throw a slow high one. The recovery is better and if they jump it on reaction it’s a free DP.
1 Like
Well in IV his high shots were minus 2 at best. So getting someone to walk block into a high shot gives you even better advantage than before (especially threatening vs big slow guys). Low shots also safer than IV.
Which brings me to something. I kinda understand why Li Joe, Champ, Wong and Floe say Sagat is stubby. He’s not actually stubby, but he doesn’t have anything that hits crouchers and does damage/converts from outside of his c.MK range. Which his c.MK although nice and long is 10 frame start up so you can’t just whip it out to check lows when 6 to 9 frame mediums and heavies are being thrown around.
I played Sagat for a bit earlier today and then went back to using Falke and I noticed what they were “feeling” immediately. Falke s.MK has big range for a cancelable button the only thing Sagat has close to that range that’s cancelable is his c.MP and c.MK. Which c.MK is only gonna combo into shots unless you have trigger.
Then Falke’s s.HP and f+HP are both heavy hitting, long ass buttons that have combo and CC potential. s.HP easily hit confirmable into KK or EX KK and start your pressure and damage. Very good damage off a single button. f+HP causes CC from ridiculous range and even though it’s minus 10 hits from so far that very few characters/things can punish it. There’s a range where you can make Cammy block it and if she doesn’t have super she has to hold it. Both buttons do nice white chip, can whiff punish depending on button and both hit crouchers.
With Sagat, once you get past s.MK range you’re not going to be able to hit the opponent with anything scary that hits them crouching. This probably gives the element of “stubby” even though he’s not actually stubby at all. Which is why randomly Falke felt like a breath of fresh air of all things when I could just hit 3 buttons from mad far away that all hit crouchers and convert into combos/CC. I think Sagat players coming into V have to understand that s.LK is his main ranged button and that for real far stuff you’re either going to have to try to counter poke with s.HK or keep chucking those low shots. Particularly LK shot to follow and keep plus.
3 Likes
Oh, and thoughts on Sagat.
His foundation is probably the most solid out of any SFV-character I’ve tried. He does, however, lack an easily accessible auto pilot(to my knowledge). This makes him quite a bit harder to play effectively, and he’s cancer to play on bad connections* since you can’t reaction DP if people are constantly teleporting.
He’ll have issues, and he’s a character that requires solid defense and a stellar fireball-game to be brought to his full potential in tournaments. And that might take some time, unless we somehow find… I dunno, a former EVO finalist that played an arguably weaker version of Sagat who’s known for the two traits described above.
Oh.
*speaking of which: the way some people manage to play at near-full capacity(read: msximum unga and hits all their combos and AAs) when characters are teleporting through rollback amazes me. Do people get attuned to the lag when they’ve played SFV online enough like they’re seeing the code of the Matrix, or am I seeing one-sided rollbacks a lot?
I’m loving Sagat and he’s actually made me want to play the game again, which is a feat in and of itself.
The depression hit me hard when trade DP into f.HK didn’t work and then I realised you can’t combo off a trade DP at all. Sad times but overall he feels just like Sagat used and that makes me happy. He’s going to have some awful match ups but his anti air game being so strong I can’t see him being terrible. Reminds me a lot of his place in SF4 where solid, patient play goes far but he’s going to have situations where he just gets run over. But hey, at least he doesn’t have to worry about unblockables from 90% of the cast now.
Edit - The people saying he’s the worst in the game or bottom 3 obviously never spent a significant amount of time playing Alex in 5. If they had they’d know that Sagat at least has some tools that aren’t utter garbage.
1 Like