SF mechanics and the Raging Demon

As I continue to browse the Akuma boards, I feel that it may be necessary to make this thread.

With the continuous stream of “Demon sucks” or “I found way to combo into ultra!” threads, instead of just repeatedly telling people what does (small list) and doesn’t (very large list), lets just teach everyone WHY.
Keep in mind that the information in this post when regarding “Street Fighter mechanics” is not 100%, but is a basic idea of the mechanics as they apply to Akuma’s Ultra.

Basic Mechanics of Street Fighter:

Attacks > Grab
Grabs > Block
Blocks > Attack

Sound familiar? Paper>Rock>Scissors (>Paper)

Now, there are some other things you can that don’t follow this pattern (Jumps, Focus attacks; attacks losing to throws [due to startup], EX properties, etc.) but this is the basic idea.

Regarding Throws:
Throws can only be performed on someone who is NOT airborne, and CANNOT be combo’d into. This is because you can only grab someone out of a neutral state.

(When I say neutral state, this can include blocking, since the other player won’t actually be blocking unless you attack.)

If they are in block stun, jumping, or *attacking, then you cannot grab them.

*Akuma’s Ultra has invincibility on startup, allowing you to grab through attacks. This is the only aspect of his Ultra that breaks basic grab rules, and it’s only because of these few frames.

The Ultra also has a nifty property unique to Akuma, where you can cancel any normal directly into Demon. This is why c.mk xx ultra works so well as an anti-air. Other uses include baiting punishes with whiffed moves into ultra, or when caught sticking something out in an ultra flash that will kill you, you can mash demon and cross your fingers to go through theirs and connect.

This basic principle applies to supers and ultras as well. Akuma’s super and ultra BOTH are considered grabs. Thus, it is impossible to combo into his super with anything other than a Focus Attack crumple.

In summary:
Cannot combo into Super or ultra, because they will be in hitstun, not neutral
Cannot Super or Ultra anyone after a FADC shoryu, because they are airborne
Cannot tick throw into Ultra, because they will jump out after the flash
Cannot reset into an Ultra, because they have time to jump out after landing
Cannot air FB into Super or Ultra, because they will be in blockstun

CAN use a properly timed Ultra as an anti air
CAN use a properly timed Ultra to punish pokes
CAN combo a **Super **or **Ultra **off of a Focus Attack
CAN use a Super at point blank range, and it will be inescapable after the flash
CAN use a Super as a tick throw; opponent cannot jump out unless it was a psychic jump
CAN use **Super **or **Ultra **to **punish **various moves (http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=179810 Thanks MuKen)

I hope this is helpful, as well as lightens up some of the false love (or hate) for the SGS.

Good little FYI for people wondering while they’re rubbing up against people and pushing them across the screen without grabbing them. Thanks for this.

I like how you made rock > paper, and paper > scissors, which is pretty much backwards. But this is a good thread nonetheless.

^ Hah. Smooth Criminal.

Haha, good stuff. I’m going to start having to save up my super meter just to try some super demon setups out. I had no clue that it was inescapable at point-blank range.

lol i think you’re in the wrong game, this is not about fishing

But there’s something called “bait and punish”.

Actually, this works with Super, as long as you’re close enough and they don’t jump right after the poke…
cr.LK --> TKD

TKD has to be slighlty delayed after the cr.LK or game will combo it with LPs of demon motion. (seems that as cr.LK cannot be comboed/linked with forward MP, game prioritizes LP…)

That would make sense, thanks. Stuffing a kara demon after any blockstring seems to work well, as long as you’re not too far…dirrrrty! :smiley:

try focus dash ultra/super, it catches jab happy people when you dash infront of them that like to mash

Great post duggish, i took something away from it :>

Sorry, what’s a TKD?

TKD = True Kara Demon? Can anyone confirm?

Yes, TKD is true kara demon.

as a little side note i found out, (i may be late) but im on a controller, and L1 (triple punch) can be used in place of the 2 light punches, and it will still work every time, doesnt help land it better, but it greatly disguises the fact your attempting it (from a neutral status neway; any other state wont really matter, cuz u cant see the light punch inputs)

what? in that case can you simply press [lp+mp, b+lk+hp]?

He means per punch, I assume. Which isn’t new, it’s the whole basis for the fastest kara demon input…

Okay, that’s what i thought…that would have been a lil ridic.

And what is this, exactly? I didn’t have much experience with him in SF3.

Basically, do the toward + mp overheard and complete the SGS before the overhead hits.

There are uses for this, the most obvious being if you’re in a punish situation where you don’t want to hit them with a stand jab.

There are tons of different ways to do this:

The way I do it is:

toward + mp + lp (this counts as both the overhead and the first jab)
mp + lp again (because pushing the same buttons twice is easier for my brain to remember)
back or toward + lk + hp at the same time

Some people do it with toward + 3p and 3p again then whatever to finish.