neutral jump rh has the range to hit him before hes in range, if your jumping forward and he jumps you can divekick to hopefully throw his timing off and avoid it.
Only thing seth can do is to not telegraph it, and sometimes I think j.hp if timed right, can stuff guild air throw.
anyone ever feel like giving up? His health is just ridiculous. It wouldn’t be as bad if he was just hard to stun. I mean a Sakura player killed me in ONE ****ing combo. at the start of a math a Gief player stunned me with just one neutral air HP. FFS all Sagat and Ryu players have to do to win the match is just get a lucky shoryuken and it’s over. and let’s not forget the teleport/srk/ultra/tandem engine nonsense. I’d wager a good 30% of my losses have come from that. Hell even sonic booms can come out as SPDs.
Seth is the only character in this game I’m truly comfortable with, despite the flaws, but they’re getting harder and harder to tolerate. It’s like I have to play flawlessly even against far less skilled opponents. </moan>
This is one of the 2 trade offs seth has for being so amazing at everything.Your goal is to either be at perfect health or have ultra, there should rarely be a time between as they can kill you in any state other than those two. Zone when necessary, rush when necessary.
You have to be close to flawless defensively, you definitely cannot get hit by a combo then try to go rambo on your wakeup, cause if you guess wrong or get stuffed that’s stars and game over.
That being said I’ve had games where I’m down to no health and have come back to win it.
You cannot be reckless with him but instead you have to be calculating.
Why were you jumping at Zangief at the beginning of the match in the first place? I presume you got countered by the headbutt which results in an immediate stun.
Just jump back or backdash and there is nothing he can do. The only legitimate way for Zangief to hurt you/to get close to you is when he lands a lucky EX Green Hand through your Sonic Booms. In many ways, this match up is similar to Zangief Vs. Akuma. Just run away all day and make him chase you.
Aside from that, no one said it was going to be easy. Your defense, execution, and yomi have to be very, very good. Never take unnecessary risks when you do not have to. If you do, prepare to lose a lot with Seth. Part of what makes a good Seth player good is knowing against which characters you can afford rushing a little bit and taking some risks. Characters such as Claw (Vega), C.Viper, Abel, Guile, etc. belong in that category mostly because they either have awful anti-aerial options or poor stamina/dizzy points or all the aforementioned. So, Seth can jump in on them and apply pressure/stun them before they can do the same to him.
Against Ryu and Sagat, zone and stay away. Most Ryu and Sagat scrubs will try to engage in projectile wars at first. Simply absorb their fireballs (absorb two consecutive ones and avoid the third one by neutral jumping or using the LP Tendem Engine so it passes through you) and build your Ultra Combo. Against Sagat, this is obviously harder to achieve because his Tiger Shots are faster than Ryu’s Hadokens. If you have a lot of life, use the Tandem Stream as soon as you get it to punish their fireballs on reaction. Once they realize that their silly tactic does not work against Seth, they will rush in, usually by jumping forward. j.HP will take care of that. They will probably then start using early jumping attacks (i.e., j.MK for Ryu, j.MK/j.HP for Sagat) in order to clip your j.HP. Throw LP Sonic Booms so they land on it or time st.HP so it punishes them once they land on the ground. When you are trapped in a corner and the Ryu/Sagat player is about half screen away, wall jump (and do not do an anti-air attack) the moment they jump in at you. What happens is that by the time they land, you will already be above their heads and land on the other side of the screen. Of course experienced Ryu/Sagat players will not make all of these silly mistakes, but you will easily be able to beat most of them online ranging from 2000GP-6000GP, and of course expect a few hate-filled messages along the way.
Well I appreciate the advice, as others do with the same problems, but the biggest thing holding me down probably is the command thing. It seems to happen almost every match despite me putting in the correct input, I’ll even go slow and accurate and I’ll still tandem engine instead of teleporting resulting in me losing half my health or more. I’m probably just going to take a hiatus from this game until I get a stick, and if that doesn’t make a difference then I guess sf4 isn’t for me.
Playing Seth forces you to develop that “Justin Wong” mentality. Stay defensive, only take risks when it can reverse the momentum, and choose your moves based on reaction rather than guessing.
That last one is the most important…to win with this character, you must be able to ultra through jump-ins/fireballs/etc. on reaction, you must be able to DP jump-ins on reaction, and you must be able to EX lightning legs through certain moves (shoto fireballs, Balrog’s specials) on reaction.
My reaction time is nothing special, yet I have gotten pretty good at these things. This is the rare instance where playing online may actually help - if you can react to this stuff with lag, you should easily be able to do it offline.
Oh yeah, and be very careful with the sonic booms and stand fierces. Those moves do very little damage and can cost you a ton if the opponent jumps over them. I mainly tend to use them at long range, and not even then against some characters (Akuma/Gouken EX demon flip, Chun/Abel ultras, etc.).
And yeah, SF practically requires a stick to play at high level, unless maybe you use Blanka or someone. =P
Josh I always see you in champ mode, I gotta play you one day in the first round where it doesn’t matter since our connection is 3 bars =[
This is the best advice a Seth player can give you. Your reaction time has to be very good in order to play with Seth. I would like to say my reaction time is very good, but my execution is flawed. Might have to do with playing on pad which makes it harder then those who play on stick. Online doesn’t help me as well. It messes with my timing which is essential to pad players. Even if you can react to your opponents moves you have to factor in the execution part which is kind of fucked up with Seth doing random teleports, EX SRK, or Super instead of Ultra.
Did we ever figure out exactly what causes EX SRK instead of teleport? Is it just time after sonic boom?
I have no clue I’m thinking it has to do with a combination of shortcuts, timing, and input delays. Basically the game will not let you do it because of all of these factors blocking the way.
Can someone who is home go to neutral after the sonic boom then do the motion for the teleport instead of using the finishing “towards” of the boom as the first motion of the teleport?
I’m just guessing here since that’s how I do it.
Any tips on how to get the Ex Shoru to link into an ex tandem? I’ve done it a few times, but the timings really sketchy and wasting 2 ex because you mistime something like that is brutal.
Also, what can be done versus dhalsim? Looking into the punish thread, i have no idea how to formulate any sort of strategy versus a good dhalsim.
You need to get six or more hits off the shoryu. From there the timing is actually pretty lenient.
What’s been working for me online is flying around the screen like a crazy man throwing out j.mp to beat his air-to-air pokes. You can cross him up from a walljump and there’s not much he can do about it. You can counter-ultra his ultra, too. When he does IAT, either teleport out, shoryu, or ultra.
You can delay the second hit of the EX Shoryuken a little bit. This will push your opponent higher to the ceiling, allowing the EX Tendem Engine to connect rather easily. You do need to connect six or more hits as Kikuichimonji stated. Do not bother using the EX Shoryuken as an anti-aerial attack if you intend to follow up with the EX Tendem Engine. That is too inconsistant to work.
Against Dhalsim you actually want to be aggressive. There is no point in zoning him because his up close game is awful and Seth can take advantage of that with his superior cross up and tick throw game. Various important notes:
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sure, Shoryuken, Ultra Combo, etc. beat his Instant Air Teleport, but that is easier said than done because you have no idea which side, left or right, he will teleport on. The easiest and most damaging option that I have found is simply st.HP, which will in reality become Seth’s close st.HP when Dhalsim’s teleports near you. As soon as Dhalsim appears next to you, just hit HP, and you have just beaten all of his options.
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when there is Yoga Fire on the screen, neither destroy it with a Sonic Boom nor focus absorb it unless you are full screen away. If you do try to do these two things, you will just get punished by one of his limbs, most likely st.HP because it has the most range. Simply block or just jump back.
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do not spam too many Sonic Booms, you open yourself to his B’n’B IAT combos, and they can really hurt Seth when Dhalsim ends it with his Super Combo. Also, do not spam st.HP. Dhalsim can punish that move with his own st.HP. You cannot do the same to him, though, because his st.HP is much safer than yours is.
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wall jumps can be good surprise attacks because they are fast, but if you overuse them expect to eat a couple of anti-aerial attacks, most notably his j.MP and b+HK.
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Dhalsim players like to jump foward and HP in an attempt to punish you for doing Sonic Booms. You can actually focus absorb his j.HP and crumple stun him (but not cleanly). If you had it charge for level 2, HP Shoryuken is free after it. They also like to jump forward and teleport back. That gives Seth a free ultra/super combo.
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a lot of Dhalsim players open up rounds with one of their limbs. Absorb it and dash back. You build your revenge meter that way, and the sooner you build your Ultra Combo the eaiser the match becomes because you limit several of his options. His Yoga Fires are particularly easy to punish on reaction with the ultra combo. It may not do a lot of damage, but it lets you get close to him and start your up close game.
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keep in mind that Dhalsim does not pose a threat when you are full screen away from him. MP and HP Yoga Fires cannot reach you; LP Yoga Fire can but is easily dealt with. Be patient against him and you will be fine. Look for ways to get in, but do not force anything because his anti-aerial attacks are very effective against Seth. Seth’s Dive Kick, which can trade with Shoryukens, Tiger Uppercuts, HP Thunder Knuckles, etc., gets beaten effortlessly by Dhalsim’s Knee (b+HK) for some reason.
As for EX DP vs. teleport, it’s actually pretty simple: The game is extremely strict when it comes to detecting simultaneous button presses. If you press one button even slightly later than the others, you get EX DP. This is also why getting super instead of ultra is common.
It’s just something you have to practice. It used to be a big problem for me, but now I’ve got it down to the point where I can do the teleport mixup after ultra every time.
And actually, against Sim air teleports, you can neutral jump and land all 3 stomps -> divekick.
I get EX Shoryu using the PPP button, though.
yeah i get the same thing occasionally. i tried testing out different shoryuken inputs in training mode but couldnt get it to happen.
Well, I’m a stick guy so I can’t really help there. =( Maybe there’s something screwed up with the macro, because I never have that happen on stick anymore.
I do still get super instead of ultra on rare occasion, though, and I’ve even seen Japanese players do that. What the hell…