If Gief jumps you Air Throw him for free – unless of course he has U2 stocked. I’m not sure why you would worry about choosing AAs.
I’m curious why you’re using backfist after Guile High Kick rather than Flash Kick. Is there a benefit I’m missing?
um pretty much every gief i’ve played who knows they’re about to face guile use ultra 2. that’s one of the main reasons behind my thinking.
Presumably if it’s too far away you’d end up getting the 100 damage flash kick rather than the 160. So backfist is more reliable perhaps.
Guy? I know I have yet to fight a decent Guy, but I have yet to have any problems ith the ones i have faced. I seems pretty easy to stop his run mix-ups with a sonic boom, flash kick, or even a good ol fashoined backfist. Sure his ex shoulder is fast, but I feel like this match-up boils down if you can keep him out.
The one thing I do think he has Guile beat is his air throw, I am very afraid of jumping vs Guy, I’ve even been yanked out of a Flash kick before, but other than that, I just don’t see it. So what am I missing exactly?
Guys rushdown is really good, i’m sure if he sees you boom he can you a flip elbow on reaction, and while you block it, the pressure is intense and without a well-timed reversal it can be very difficult to escape. Not only is his airthrow dominant but it really hurts, and so does his ultra
Zangief is alot easier i find. With cr mk being faster it’s alot easier to get him just out of it’s range so it’s the sweetspot for stuffing his jumpins, which is probably why Giefs think they NEED ultra 2 for this matchup since their damage and survivability is nerfed
Game just came out and all this talk of ratios in matches and what is it really based on? Personal experience against random people on the net?
I’ve only played about 50 matches so far and so far Guile seems to have gotten only some minor tweeks except for the welcomed new ultra (which is expected by the list given in the developer interview a while back). The things I’ve noticed thus far is a better c.mk, better juggle state df. hk for those punish situations where you didn’t have a charge, and a usable ultra. Can one really go from bottom to top with those changes? IMO, probably not. I’ve gotten a lot of hate mail about how Guile is now S+ tier but I think its really based on two things. 1) Daigo used him so he must be a beast character and 2) people who write hate mail after a loss and attribute it to tier rankings are usually the scrubs who jump at you endlessly trying to turn the match into a combo exhibition.
There’s way too much still unexplored, it’d be interesting to see what the top Guile players have to say.
Got any logic and reasoning behind that assertion, or you just going to throw out some vague statement about how Makoto is going to be better?
Well, I got schooled by a Mak player earlier this morning. Granted, the first one that has beaten me since I’ve been playing Super, but the scary thing is that the player was a viper main, and claimed to still be learning the character.
Personally I think that once Mak gets going, it’s a little difficult to guess how to react. It’s not too bad keeping her out though, but damn, once she gets in…
Just my 2 cents.
I would chose Guile over Makoto any day, and probably over DJ some other characters even though I don’t really like charge overall.
Ex sonic boom is the best being extremely fast
Sonic hurricane ultra is almost too good, gets people for heavy damage on jump ins and its possible to get a free with by just taking a step back and when they jump towards you, boom.
Sonic boom combos seem to be a lot easier to pull off
He still has an air grab and the best combination attack going from low kick to overhead punch
Guile is NOT top tier now, people are fucking stupid. Guile is better but please try to remember he was the second shittiest character in vanilla. Excluding the new characters who im not too sure about but who look shitty - Top tier will look something like Ryu, Akuma, Balrog, Rufus, Bison, Viper, Chun, Sim. At least in the US.
Makoto is the worst character in super and she is free for guile. I’ve spent a lot of time on her in offline matches with other socal players and in training mode, she is very weak in all aspects of the game. karakusa > U1 doesn’t compensate for having 950 hp, ass damage output, no real armor breaker, unsafe everything, and no tools for getting in. Guile can ULTRA jab hayate on block, how hilarious is that? That move travels a few pixels, loses to throws and normals, doesn’t break armor, and does a massive 90 damage on hit.
Guile vs Ryu is NOT 6-4 guile. It’s certainly better, but that match was a 3-7 in my book. If ryu gets a lead, guile still has to come to him and ryu can still beat ALL of guile’s shit with low forward. Ryu still has massive mix up on guile if he knocks guile down, and he still has all his tools from vanilla. Ryu is not a simple character and you should not base the match up off xbl.
Also the guile forums fucking suck now.
^ very well said
i know how you feel.
What the fuck does the last game have to do with this one? Guile’s problems were fixed and he’s a VERY SOLID character right now. Ryu was just really solid and he was a top 2 character.
He’s still no ST or CvS2 guile. Personally I’d like the over head removed and have his st. MP hit crouching opponents and fix his flashkick. But that’s just me being a wishful thinker and I’m sure I’m alone on ruining his overhead, however, I never felt he needed one. But hey, my opinion don’t mean shit.
He still seems mid tier to me.
I agree with this dude. some people are basing this whole thing off their experience on xbl and psn. people should just wait when top players become very good with the game. no way Sagat vs Guile is 5:5, even Ryu vs Guile, no way it is 5:5. like I said, time will tell.
Guile has better footsies, and better zoning. His punishment is better due to more damage. That’s really all he needs anyway to be a contender. He will have some bad matchups, that goes without saying. But I’m not sure why people want to undermine the fact that he is really solid, and his ability to keep people out has improved by a lot. And now the threat of his baits and punisments is legit. As far as Sagat vs. Guile being 5-5, that’s not a stretch. The only thing that could possibly bring Sagat back to his glory days is angry scar, but I don’t think that’ll be enough.
Ryu vs. Guile is more than likely going to be 6-4. cr.mk is still a pain in the ass, but better Ryus just won’t throw it out. Guile doesn’t win in the footsies department in this matchup, but with better zoning and more damage you can make more out of those narrow opportunities that happen in this matchup. Ryu even had a slight footsies advantage against Guile in CE, but Guile could still beat him. I think you footsies have to be on par. However, I don’t think this matchup is going to be too bad.
With that said, I’ve only been playing online. I can’t wait to play some offline tournaments to see how well Guile holds up against more serious competitors
Herp Derp. A whole fucking lot since super is an editted version of vanilla. Super isn’t a new game. With the exception of sagat who had his dick cut off, the vanilla tiers have not been turned upside down.
Guile is very solid now, he isnt top. No argument apparently.
@brahn - The only difference i feel in guiles normals is recovery on c.mk, and it might be by a frame or so. When you consider the 120 to 100 drop in s.fierce’s damage im not sure if i would go so far as to say guile’s footsies are better. I think guile’s footsies are more well rounded now, rather than just trying to set up s.fierce. Oh and sobat might be a frame or two faster, i really cant tell. Almost all of his buttons feel the same to me.
You hit the nail on the head with your top tier picks, with the exception of Ryu in my opinion. Ryu is hardcore solid, but that’s not as impressive anymore in a sea of solid characters. His mix up is pretty good, but there are a lot of characters with great mix ups now, like Abel, who I think is going to be one of the top characters in this game.
Don’t get me wrong. Ryu will still win tournaments, but it’ll be because of the player now instead of some of SF4 Ryu’s bull shit.
i agree with all this, honestly ive been putting a lot of work into makoto recently and she is really bad she is about the level guile was last game, for example karakusa gets beaten by a normal grab it’s easily the worst command grab in the game forget about even fighting gief or t hawk with her both those matches are proly gonna end up an 8 - 2, seriously her only options vs fireballs are jump, fadc or the jump qcb kick with the smaller ark but bad hitbox. and her walking speed is a big problem with this too.
c mk is her best aa it does no damage, and she is 100% free on wakeup more so than guile or vega in iv. she has no reversal u cant wake up karakusa if someone is on top of u like how able gief or t hawk can with their command grabs u will get hit with a meatie or throw,
it’s a lot of work to win consistantly with makoto… if your playing guile and losing to her your doing a lot of things wrong and should really watch your replays and take notes on how you messed up and avoid doing it.
Just stay solid with your zoning and save meter like crazy (you shouldn’t have any use for it anyway in the mid to long range). Once she gets in, that meter you’re sitting is what’s going to save you. FK FADC the Hell out of there. You just need to be unpredictable with it though. If you get baited and whiff a FK, then she can dish out some big damage.
Still, in a best out 3 games match, I’m confident that a competent Guile player can zone out a great Makoto player more times than a great Makoto player getting in and guessing right 3 times.