Over the last 2 weeks I’ve been working on a “Balance” mod for SF4 (I use the term balance in quotes because since I’m the one doing it on my own it is subject to not only some bias (as anyone doing a mod alone would be) but also some changes might be less balanced than I originally expected on paper. Hence play testing.) Currently I have 9 characters currently content complete in terms of balance changes. This whole mod is a lot less conservative than the “AE Balance Request” thread but it takes suggestions from the character forums, the AE request thread, as well as attempts to address common complaints I’ve seen or inconsistencies I’ve noticed. There are a lot of changes, I give everyone buffs but also many characters receive nerfs in addition to buffs. If you are interested in testing the mod and giving feedback go ahead and post it here. Once there is at least a couple people I’ll post the actual files. Note, don’t just count the changes. Some characters received a lot of small changes. Some characters received a mix of buffs and nerfs, some characters received nothing but buffs. Not all buffs are equal either (For example, a buff to stun damage is generally not as good as a change to frame data.)<br><br>Currently complete are:<br>Adon, C. Viper, Seth, Cody, Cammy, Balrog (Boxer), Akuma, Blanka, and Deejay. I’ll post the patch notess (in spoilers due to size) in the next couple posts. When/if I release the files they will include a txt file with the changes listed.<br><br>
Changes For Akuma, Adon, Blanka, Cammy
Spoiler
<br>Akuma changes:<br><br>Demon flip Palm - meter gain reduced from 40 to 30 on hit<br>Demon Flip throw - meter gained reduced from 60 to 40<br>EX Hadoken damage reduced from 6060 to 5555 (still the highest out of the shotos) stun reduced from 100100 to 5050 (same as every other <br>character with a fireball except Cody) <br>EX Tatsu pushback on hit for 2nd - 5th hits reduced to the same as in Super (should prevent random fallouts now or at least far far less often.)<br>Focus attack level 3 damage reduced from 140 to 130 (same as Sakura)<br>Forward throw damage reduced from 130 to 120<br>LK Tatsu damage reduced from 70 to 65<br>Far HK Meter gain reduced from 6020 to 4020 hitbox on 2nd hit slightly expanded downward and moved forward slightly to catch more <br>characters crouching (still not EVERY character at max range)<br>Ultra 1 Damage reduced from 510 to 450. Opponent meter gain reduced from 540 to 459 (1 bar = 250)<br>Forward/Backward Jump HP active frames increased from 3 to 5<br>Forward/Backward Jump MK Active frames increased from 3 to 4<br>Neutral Jump MK active frames increased from 4 to 5<br>Neutral Jump MP active frames increased from 3 to 4<br><br>Adon Changes:<br><br>Crouching MK damage increased from 70 to 75<br>Air Jaguar Kick height restriction returned to Super status (0.35 to 0.4 for LMH 0.25 to 0.3 for EX)<br>Air Jaguar Kick stun reduced from 160 to 130<br>Ground Jaguar Kick L/M versions damage reduced to match Heavy version (130)<br>Jaguar Tooth meter gain on whiff increased from 10 to 20<br>Jaguar Tooth stun increased from 150 to 170<br>MK Jaguar tooth startup reduced by 1F<br>HK Jaguar Tooth startup reduced by 2F<br>Jaguar Crunch (forward+mp overhead) damage increased from 3050 to 4050 startup reduced from 23F to 22F<br>HK Rising Jaguar damage changed from 50100 to 7090 making FADC followups cause more damage <br>Forward/Backward Jump LK damage increased from 45 to 50<br><br>Blanka Changes:<br><br>Crouching HP recovery reduced from 25F to 22F (now -1F on hit) damage increased from 100 to 110<br>Crouching LK recovery reduced by 1F (now +2F on block +5F on hit)<br>Crouching LP startup reduced from 4F to 3F damage reduced from 30 to 20<br>3HP (amazon run) can now be canceled into super/EX FADC (Damage reduced from 100 to 90)<br>standing LK (far) Hitbox width increased and moved further forward. Damage increased from 30 to 50<br>standing MK (far) hitbox height and width increased by 0.05 <br>Neutral Jump HP active frames increased from 3 to 5<br>Backwards throw damage increased from 120/120 to 140/120<br>EX Backstep Rolling (Rainbow Ball) damage increased from 120 to 140 stun increased from 200 to 250<br>EX Rolling Damage increased from 120 to 130<br>Anti Air Rolling (Up ball) all versions damage increased by 10<br><br>Cammy changes:<br><br>close s.LP recovery increased by 1F (now +3/+6)<br>close s.MP recovery increased by 1F (now 0/+5)<br>close s.HP startup increased from 4F to 5F <br>crouching HP startup increased from 6F to 7F stun reduced from 200 to 175<br>crouching MP damage reduced from 65 to 60 recovery increased by 1F (now +2/+5)<br>crouching LK damage reduced from 25 to 20<br>forward throw damage reduced from 140 to 130<br>backward throw damage reduced from 135 to 130 stun reduced from 140 to 120<br>Level 3 focus attack damage increased from 120 to 130<br>EX Cannon Strike hitbox size reduced from 0.25 to 0.2 (Now the same size as her regular cannon spike) hit stun reduced by 2F<br>MK and HK Cannon Spike meter gain reduced from 30/40 to 20/40 no change to LK<br>Spin Knuckle startup reduced by 3F for all versions<br>LP Spin Knuckle Damage distribution changed from 8080 to 70100<br>MP Spin Knuckle Damage distribution changed from 8080 to 75100<br>HP Spin Knuckle damage distribution changed from 8080 to 80100 <br>
C. Viper Changes<br><br>Super jump recovery reduced by 3F when no action is performed (now should be 8F instead of 11F)<br>Level 3 focus attack startup reduced by 5F<br>Level 1-2 Focus attack startup reduced by 3F<br>Focus attack damage reduced from 60/90/150 to 60/80/140<br>Forward Jump HK Stun reduced from 200 to 150<br>Close s.LK startup reduced from 5F to 4F<br>Crouching LK startup reduced from 5F to 4F hitbox slightly reduced in width<br>LK/MK Air Burn Kick active frames reduced from 8 to 6F<br>HK Air Burn Kick active frames reduced from 9F to 6F<br>EX Air Burn Kick stun reduced from 50x3100 to 40x380<br>Forward Heavy Kick damage increased from 4060 to 5060 Can no longer Super Cancel the first hit. Can now super cancel the 2nd hit instead. <br>(meaning you can get both hits FADC / Super Combo. Which is more damage than before)<br>Far s.HK knockdown on airhit/counterhit is now an untechable knockdown Recovery increased by 2F (is no -4F on block 0F on hit) <br>6MP (overhead) Is now airborne starting on 8F instead of 6F<br><br>Cody Changes:<br><br>Backwards walk speed increased from 0.024 to 0.026<br>Close/Far standing LP recovery reduced by 1F <br>Far s.MK hurtbox reduced in width (from 0.85 to 0.75(now no longer wider than Cody is tall but still wider than T-Hawks body splash) <br>hitbox slightly moved forward. far s.MK with knife hitbox moved back (closer to Cody) now identical to each other. <br>crouching MP startup reduced by 1F damage reduced from 60 to 55<br>Crouching MK slide distance traveled increased from 8training blocks to 10 training blocks. (Rose = 11 training blocks for comparison) hurtbox on <br>legs reduced in height during active period (from 0.45 to 0.4) <br>f.HK (Crack Kick) is now airborne from frame 8 till finish (note: the move still completely whiffs crouchers and has 12F where he can be swept for a <br>hard knockdown by anyone since hurtbox adjustment only lasts through till the end of active frames.)<br>b.MP (Jaw Crusher) is now properly counterhittable during it’s startup.<br>Badstone startup reduced from 29F to 26F<br>Fake badstone total frame count reduced from 31F to 26F<br>EX Criminal Upper is now invincible until 7F<br>HK Ruffian kick hurtbox reduced on extended leg and torso during active period. Recovery reduced by 2F (-17F on block now)<br>LP Criminal Upper damage reduced on first hit from 80 to 60 stun reduced from 70 to 50<br>MP Criminal Upper damage reduced on first hit from 70 to 60 stun reduced from 70 to 50<br>HP Criminal Upper stun reduced on first hit from 70 to 50<br>Badspray recovery from face down knockdown now matches badspray from face up knockdown position<br>MK Ruffian Kick damage reduced from 130 to 120<br>-----<br>Knife changes:<br>All knife attacks now cause 25% chip damage on block (standard chip damage) up from 12% for lights 10% for mediums 8% for heavy attacks.<br>s.MP with knife the first hit is now special cancelable<br>crouching HP with knife is now special cancelable.<br>Fake knife throw total frame count reduced from 32 to 30<br>The knife is no longer dropped when throwing an opponent or if your throw attempt is teched.<br>Jumping MP with knife had it’s hurtbox reduced in width from 0.85 to 0.75 (now no longer wider than his jumping heavy punch with knife)<br>Due to chip damage increase and added combo damage possibilities the knife has received damage nerfs to some attacks<br>standing HP with knife damage reduced from 120 to 110<br>standing MP with knife damage reduced from 4040 to 3535<br>crouching MP with knife damage reduced from 80 to 70<br>crouching HP with knife damage reduced from 120 to 110 stun reduced to 180<br><br>Deejay changes:<br><br>Backdash total frame count reduced by 2F<br>Crouching LK Startup reduced from 5F to 4F. Hurtbox/Hitbox for chain canceled version now properly matches the regular version.damage reduced <br>from 30 to 25<br>chained close s.LP hurtbox now matches regular version<br>chained far s.LK hurtbox now matches regular version<br>HK Rolling Sobat (dread kick) now gets both hits if first connects, just like MK version also throw invincibility increased from 11F to 14F<br>LK Rolling Sobat throw invincible 1-5F<br>LK Up kicks hitbox expanded in height, now hits crouching opponents. Stun increased from 50 to 85 damage reduced from 120 to 110<br>MK Up kicks stun increased from 5050 to 7575<br>HK Up kicks stun increased from 505050 to 805050 Damage increased from 404030 to 505040<br>crouching HK (slide) distance increased from 10training blocks to 12 (in Super it was 14)<br>crouching MP stun increased from 80 to 100<br>+1 block stun on Air Slasher (no change to on hit) <br>Far s.HP recovery reduced by 2F<br>Back throw damage/stun increased from 120/80 to 130/120 <br>Neutral Jump HK Stun increased from 150 to 200<br>Forward jump HP stun increased from 140 to 180<br>Neutral Jump/Angled Jump MP stun increased from 80 to 100<br><br>Balrog (Boxer) Changes:<br><br>Dash Swing Blow (overhead) Now -6F on block. Ex version now -4F on block<br>Dash Straight LP/MP/HP now 0F on hit no change to on block. <br>Angled jump LK can now cross up (though the spacing is specific the side it hits is very ambiguous)<br>Far s.HP damage increased from 100 to 110<br>crouching HP damage increased from 90 to 100<br>Ultra 2 Stun damage increased from 700 to 750 at full 550 at half<br>Ultra 2 Range increased by 5% for half charge. 10% for full charge. <br>Level 1 - 3 TAP startup reduced from 30 to 29 no change for 4-Final<br><br>Seth Changes:<br><br>LP SPD Stun reduced from 200 to 125 meter gain reduced from 30/80 to 20/80 Range reduced from 1.18 to 1.13<br>MP SPD Stun reduced from 200 to 150 meter gain reduced from 30/80 to 20/80<br>HP SPD Stun reduced from 200 to 175 meter gain reduced from 30/80 to 20/80<br>EX SPD Damage reduced from 170 to 150<br>EX Tanden Engine now causes 1point of recoverable damage<br>Focus attack damage reduced from 65/85/150 to 60/80/140<br>Forward/Backward Jump HK stun reduced from 200 to 170<br>EX Sonic Boom damage increased from 4545 to 5050<br>Dive Kick is no longer an overhead, damage increased from 60 to 75 height restriction lowered from 1.6 to 1.45<br>LP SRK Damage distribution changed from 8060 to 7070 stun on first hit reduced to 75<br>MP SRK Damage distribution changed from 9060 to 8070 Stun on first hit reduced to 75<br>HP SRK Damage distribution changed from 10080 to 9085 Stun on first hit reduced to 75<br>Stomps active frames increased from 3 to 5 for all versions.<br>Standing HP (far) recovery reduced by 4F<br>Crouching HK damage increased from 80 to 90<br>Standing MP (far) damage increased from 60 to 65<br>Forward/Backward Jump LK damage increased from 45 to 50<br>Teleport recovery reduced by 1F
EDIT: this is the bigest pile of crap i ever saw !!! you completly destroyed the higher tier characters…you literally made them unplayable D- tier… exept adon…he is still the safest and cheepest character in game,even after your mod!
Just leave it be , the game is balanced enough… maybe ppl should try finding faults in their own skill and matchup knowladge instead of constantly bitching about the higher tiers!
Maybe i also hate Seth’s rediculous SRK priority or adons safe cheep presure…but do i bitch about that ??? NO
i get into the game and train to deal with that crap!!!
What makes you say that the Akuma nerfs were “hate”? I actually think that the buffs were about equal (More active frames on jumping attacks, opponent gains less meter from being hit by ultra 1, EX Tatsu no longer randomly drops opponents out due to pushback, Far Heavy Kick connects against more crouching characters) those are the things most Akuma players list as his main weaknesses (besides health.) In turn I only really nerfed his damage by a tiny bit (10 damage lost on EX Fireball, 5 Damage lost on LK Tatsu, 10 Damage lost on forward throw, 10 damage lost on level 3 focus attack [ONLY level 3].) and the meter gain nerfs also hurt his opponent as I also altered the meter gain opponent gets to properly be 50% of the new value (So for instance if Akuma does Demon Flip - Throw he gets 40 meter instead of 60. Now the opponent gets 20 meter instead of 30.)
Seth I think I’ll revert the damage distribution change on SRK. However other than that all that was nerfed was Stun values (he still has some of the highest stun output meterless in the game.) and making his Dive kick not an overhead (I’m pretty set on this change, but not against other tweaks to help improve the dive kick, Perhaps lowering the restriction even further from 1.45 to 1.3) However the stun changes on his SPD just bring it more inline with other command throws. Abel’s tornado throw is 100/150/200/150 (L/M/H/EX). Zangief’s SPD is 150/150/200/150. T-Hawk’s SPD is 200/200/200/150. Hakan’s SPD is 100/100/100/160. and Honda’s Ohicho is 100/100/100/100. That means that Seth has the best stun on his SPD, and at 3F his EX SPD is faster than Hawk OR Gief’s EX SPD.
I did my best for Seth to avoid nerfing the actual tool’s uses (other than his dive kick) while instead reducing the reward for using it. If you notice there was no change to his invincibility, no frame data nerfs, no hitbox nerfs (despite the fact his fj.HP has an INSANE hitbox and crossup HK is one of Seth’s more complained about moves.) Still I’m open to feedback and I’ll post the files later this week.
It is actually very easy to change health/stun values, but you can’t change them with the GFWL version as it will crash on startup. On my version, I have changed a lot of characters health/stun to see how it would balance out the game, and it works very nicely for some.
Some people really think this is their forum and they have to double check everyones thread to clarify this statement pointing out the good path…
Anyway, great job Eternal, I have nothing to say but why not at Akuma’s changes. Or maybe, why not trying to do something with that stupid useless ex DF ex FB thing ?
I could have helped if I were good with several chars and had friends to test them at home. But nop
