How to “duck shoryuken”?
I saw a video tutorial where a guy says that if you don’t “duck shoryuken” an air attack, you’ll trade. But if you “duck shoryuken”, you will counter his air attack. What does “duck shoryuken” mean? What’s its move?
You damage someone by putting a move’s hitbox over your opponent’s hurtbox. Sometimes, two people do a move and both do that and get hit simultaneously. Both get hit. This is called a trade.
Most Shoryuken-type moves have some invincibility right when they start - you have a hitbox, but no hurtbox, while a jumping opponent still has both. You’ll inevitably hit him before he can you.
=> Do a shoryuken as late as possible to maximize chances of hitting the opponent while Ryu is still invincible and get more hits in.
The Shoryuken input is officially [forward][down][downforward+P], but the game actually accepts [any forward][any down][any forward+P]. So [downforward][down or downback][downforward+P] = Shoryuken. Ryu is crouching the whole time so the opponent’s jump attack hits you as late as possible.
I know that this seems like a very basic question. Seeing that i play Evil Ryu/Ryu for at least a year for now; but still i feel inconsistency on my DP AAs on reaction, i really want to nail this down because i feel this as a necessary step to improve my game and to force my opponents to fight on the ground and improve my footsies in the process. There’s some matchs online where the opponent can’t really get in with jumps, but in some matchs i simple let them come (and that’s the inconsistency i’m talking about), i don’t know how to explain. Balrog and Dudley seems specially annoying when it comes to this question.
So, i’m here to ask you more experienced Ryu players: what is a good method for me to dive on this thing about practicing DPing jumps on reaction?
I think it’s good to let you know that i’m brazilian, and the internet here is not top notch, so it’s really an issue too. But at the same time that i do believe that i could improve this part of my game even online.
Thanks in advance!
I have no idea what your skill level is so I am sorry if I sound patronizing.
Firstly, shoryukens are not always the best anti air in this game. Jump arcs vary widely between characters and some are easier to shoryuken than others. Namely, Dudley’s and Blanka are difficult because they jump so fast and the hit boxes on their attacks extend far away from their bodies. In some cases this also means that if the opponent does an empty jump your shoryuken will wiff. This is highly dependent on spacing, half of the anti air game is knowing which anti air to use depending on the space between your opponent as well as his jump arc.
In Dudley’s case, I suggest using far fierce punch or ex shoryuken if he spaces his jumps so that only the tip of his elbow attack hits you. For Balrog you can try using stand roundhouse or shoryuken, depending on the spacing.
To practice anti airing with shoryukens first you need to do them consistently. There is no trick to this, you just need to practice practice practice until you can do them 95%+ of the time from both sides. To practice reacting to jumps go to training mode and record the dummy (usually Ryu) jumping and attacking at random intervals and then practice anti airing. As you practice note the distances where anti airing works and when it doesn’t. Don’t try to anticipate the jump, you are just working on your reactions and getting used to pressing buttons as someone is jumping at you instead of blocking like you usually do. Once you have that down pretend like this is an actual game: walk around a bit, crouch, wiff a normal, and in spite of all that try to shoryuken his jumping.
This will take several days to learn, just practice for 10-15 minutes each day and you’ll see improvements. After that, make note of any jumping attacks that give you trouble then go to training mode and figure out which anti airs to use. Ryu’s main anti air options are: shoryuken, far fierce, crouch fierce, stand roundhouse, and meeting the opponent in the air with a jumping attack (usually fierce, or medium punch).
Two things, firstly, dont forget about cr.hp. Its not as much damage and doesn’t put the stamp down same way as SRK but will usually work well in many places a late srk wont work. Also, anticipate the jump in. A lot of the time throw a standing lp. It will bait people to jump cuz they will think you’re throwing a hado. You need to work on your fireball game in order to control enemies jumping in. Just watch say… Infiltration or Daigo to try and learn fireball spacing. I recently watched the dieminion infiltration matchup from… Evo i think? Maybe SCR? Look it up on youtube. It was a good match and shows a lot about fireball spacing and Infiltration’s AA is amazing.
Watching Infiltration for Ryu fireball spacing can be a bit of a bad idea. Ryu’s fireballs have fast startup and good comboability, plus closer up EX fireball is basically impossible to react to, so Ryu wants to stay in the closer end of midrange more.
Akuma’s fireball rhythm is more uniform, comboability low, startup slow. But in return he gets better recovery and support options in air fireball and red fireball. He’s a lot more comfortable playing the fireball game at 3/4ths to fullscreen.
Finding out good fireball players is definitely a good idea. Daigo, obviously. John Choi. What little I’ve seen of Cookies N BO says he has a good fireball game as well. Much more sparse than Choi’s more active style, but it seems to work.
Ya, i was saying more for the AA aspects of things with that match as Infiltrations AA SRK in that game was so on point. But ya, you’re right as far as fireball spacing which forces AA. And ya i forgot but john choi has great fireball spacing.
Thank you all for sharing your knowledge
I’ve done some training today and it already paid off against players that doesn’t have crappy connections; there’s a lot of room to improve, but it definetly paid off to practice to do DPs from crouch stance and to react to random recorded strats of pokes and subtle jumps (i’ve tried this before but with the CPU as Dan), in crouch it gives you more time to react and most of the time makes the opponent eat full damage from the uppercut; it’s really enjoyable to hit a full uppercut on people who tends to jump.
If it’s not too much, i would like to ask if there’s special cases of arc jumps from some characters that cannot be AAed by Ryu’s cr.HP when they try to crossup you from near a low strong range. I tried to punish one crossup attempt today from one Evil Ryu and one Gen player and the cr.HP simple whiffed and i eated a full combo.
I mean ya, a few different chars have different arcs on their jump. Like gen’s jump is much different, however, learning the spacing is important because if spacing is correct you can definitely punish with SRK. A few i can think of off the top of my head who have “different” arcs on their jump is Blanka, Gen, Adon, and Guy. I play ERyu and i dont think his is too much different.
Can someone lay out Ryus max damage combos based off 1 bar, 2 bar, 3 bar, and 4 bar. Also for corner and non corner. I’m gonna figure it out on my own but I was just seeing if someone more knowledgeable could answer this quickly.
Not to be rude but thats such a broad question. Is that poke? Is that counterhit? Is that meaty? Is it a mixup in the corner? Do you have ultra?
Things like that are super situational and again… very broad questions IMHO. Because what might be the max combo you can get in a situation you might not want to do depending on your matchup.
So these are off of free punishes? ie. Stun? Missed uppercut?
Im just gonna name some good realistic stuff you can pull off that involves super/ultra i guess.
So, i guess you wanna spend 1 bar on ex-tastu not in the corner that would be your one bar punish but its kind of dumb(I think it would be something like focusxxSolar Plexusxxcr.lp.crhp.ExTatsu maybe? If i cant fit in the solar plexuses my go to combo with ryu is usually just cr.mpxxcrhpxxsrk or tastu depending on if its a char i need corner pressure on (ie.sagat). Two bars I can see you FADC’ing into some form of ultra, however if its in the corner you only ever need 1 bar (ending combo in either ex hado or ex tastu). Two bars with normals most likely something along the lines of a cr.lpxcr.mpxcrhpxhado fadc cr.lpxcr.hpxlp.srkxmpsrk.
Those are somewhat realistic combos you can pull off in a match with your 1 bar or 2 bar. Again thats on the assumption of just purely free combo.
Specifically 3 bar stuff if you have ultra, its good to just be able in middle spacing to pull of cr.mkxxexhadxxfadcxxultra. As far as a punish combo i have no clue lol.
And then as far as a 4 bar combo you can do technically do 2 parts of a combo ending it in hado and fadc loop in the corner. In middle spacing if you burn your super/ultra, solar plexusxxlpsrkxxintosuperxxinto ultra is a very damaging combo.
Those are some “realistic” combos. No clue if they’re max damage but they can be good punishes and somewhat realistic to actually do.
Thats all i got :P. Hopefully that helps a bit.
Thanks for the reply. I guess I should be a little more clear. I got most of it done last night but I am basically just trying to figure out every characters damage output based on meter. So I am just trying to figure out max damage punish, max damage hit confirm, max damage corner punish, max damage corner hit confirm. Just helps me visualize what the opponent is capable of when I see the numbers and the things I should be focusing on to prevent it.
If you input cr.MK xx DP and your MK gets parried by Gouken or Dudley’s parry, does the 10-frame pause count against your DP invincible frames?
I am wondering if someone has a good way to option select an ultra or a tatsu that doesn’t involve whiffing a standing jab or doing a stand light kick from a ground set up.
anybody know any good ryu hit confrim combos or hit confirms
Well that depends entirely on how fast you can react. After a jump in I feel comfortable hit confirming with two light attacks.
The most basic hit confirm:
j.mk cr.lk cr.lp cr.mp xx hadoken if blocked
j.mk cr.lk cr.lp cr.mp xx tatsu if hit and standing
Note that for some characters the cr.mp wiffs (I believe Abel). Instead of cr.mp you can use cr.mk, but that’s a one frame link instead of a two frame link
Or, instead of going for a low attack after a jump in you can instead go for a frame trap:
j.mk cr.mp cr.mp xx hadoken (on block)
j.mk cr.mp cr.mp cr.hk (on block or hit)
j.mk cr.mp cr.mp xx tatsu (on hit if they are standing)
I usually use cr.mp instead of cr.hp because cr.hp wiffs more.
Pretty much most of ryu’s 3~4+ hit combos are hit confirm combos, pick and choose your favorite ones…
The most basic thing you need to know about hit confirming is that you need to know if you hit by the second attack so when you input your third you know which move to cancel or link to. When they block you just end with a hadoken or a safe button, when you hit do tatsu or dp combo. Pretty much just go for whatever combo you like, confirm by the second attack whether you have hit or not and end appropriately. Your choice in hit confirm combos should probably have at least two normals before a linked normal or special…
One hit confirms aren’t that hard either, like corner confirming an ex tatsu or ex hadoken into an ultra one…
Counter hit confirms are pretty tough though, you have to know your setups and look for that counter hit phrase to pop up. My favorite counter hit setup is: cr. jab x2, walk forward (fake obvious throw attempt) st. short (counter hit) cr. jab, cr. strong, cr. roundhouse. If no counter hit phrase pops up, just block after the short cuz dat SHORYUKENS A COMIN!!! probably…
I have a few questions about Ryu’s option selects.
- In 7:27 of this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUgTIrePPuM#t=447), illitirit goes over a safe jump FADC option select but I’m a little confused about the execution. Can someone break it down for me?
- Are 3f reversals like shoto DPs the only reversals that you have to do something other than sweep, meaty j.hk OS on? Who other than shotos have 3f reversals, and is forward throw, whiff s.hp, nj.mk the only setup you can do against them?
gone
Unfortunately I don’t have a copy of sf4 with me, but perhaps you can try:
J.hp cl.hp xx hadoken FADC cl.hp xx EX tatsu EX hadoken Ultra 1
Or maybe remove the EX hadoken and go straight into ultra 1