Ryu General Discussion Thread: Frame Data, Strategies, Combos, etc

[Infinite_Waveshine]

hey guys. I love this thread. I’ve been lurking for like, 2 months now, coming on and off everytime or so from work lol.
I have a 9 questions and or things I wonder about. some are general, some are matchup specific. I’m not bad at the game, and know a lot about the character itself. I can do the c.lp to c.mp/c.hp/c.mk links, the c.mp tp c.hp, srk focus cancel ultra, and I’m trying to implement fireball focus cancel combos now. I don’t own the game though, and I don’t play as much as I’d like to.

You can answer one or many or all the questions if you have accurate info. please be nice, as some of these questions may seem trivial to you. you can be concise or detailed in your explanations, but please mention when there a moves requires different punish options depending on the strength used (e.g. you can punish bison’s scissor kicks on block, but not the light kick one).

If anything, maybe a good question’ll be there and we can spark a good convo that’ll help new players like me.

1- what’s the best option to punish a blocked tiger knee, depending on tiger knee strength and spacing on block? even a reversal shoryuken doesn’t connect after, and sometimes I can’t even grab because I get hit by another stupid sagat move.

2- where should i be spacing myself and what do I do against balrog? I noticed that I can’t do ‘c.lp, c.lp, c.hp’ on Balrog when he’s ducking. should i stick to the ‘c.lp, c. lp, c.mk’ string?
even then, it’s hard to get that close to hit confirm my combos. if I play patient, I get often corner raped. I get raped in the footsies game because I don’t know the safe zones against him. I often get hit with stupid stuff when trying to space a c.mk, like a c. hk. Most balrogs i see poke a lot with c.lp, and it’s so fast. then headbutt follows it at the end of that tale :(.

I really don’t know how to approach against Balrog. people told me to play against him like when playing zangief, but it’s not the same to me, as I know the zangief match up really well. In the end, i get overly defensive because I can’t approach, and I don’t know how to punish anything he throws at me unless it’s a headbutt/turnpunch I blocked. I usually stay stuck in between the range where I can’t get hit by a fierce headbutt, and where I can barely not get hit by a c.hk. If not, I’m in the corner getting a vicious ground and pound.

3- what do I do against sagat. I don’t jump against him. then I don’t know what to do. he wins the fireball fight. focusing his fireballs to get in faster in decent, allowing he doesn’t mix up knees to often, or throw an ex fireball… if I get too close I eat the standing roundhouse. where do i stand?

4- can I attack abel at the end of his marseille’s roll? with a c.hp into srk for example. or can i only grab him?

5- how should i react when akuma does his air flip, if he’s landing at a range where he can only hit me with the end of the sweep, when he’s landing in front of me, also when he’s at air grab angle. I think he can only trigger the dive kick at the peak, right? so after he passes the peak, how do I react to the grab/land/occasionnal punch mix-up.

6- can i do anything after blocking c. viper’s electric punch to punish her?

7- how come e. honda’s ex buttstomp sometimes breaks the focus and sometimes doesn’t? same for blanka’s rainbow.

8- how do I cope with el fuerte on wake up?

9- should I rush down rufus or should I play more conservatively?

that’s it. thanks in advance. I’ll be lurking some more unless I really need to post again. >_>

[Hiryu02]

E: He is vulnerable for a short time at the beginning and the end of the regular roll, but throwing him out of the roll is more consistent than trying for a meaty at the end, and the throw is less risky.
EX roll however is completely invincible to attacks during the whole move. It can STILL be thrown.

[DarthPaul1982]

1- what’s the best option to punish a blocked tiger knee, depending on tiger knee strength and spacing on block? even a reversal shoryuken doesn’t connect after, and sometimes I can’t even grab because I get hit by another stupid sagat move.

**For Tiger Knees, Gat is safe if he hits you at the end of the move (from the right, furthest distance). If he is close when he hits you, you can c/fp, SRK if timed correctly. Because of the TK, its best you sit at c.mk range, where you can stuff of cause the TK to whiff. From full c.mk range, it’s happy days for Ryu. **

2- where should i be spacing myself and what do I do against balrog? I noticed that I can’t do ‘c.lp, c.lp, c.hp’ on Balrog when he’s ducking. should i stick to the ‘c.lp, c. lp, c.mk’ string?
even then, it’s hard to get that close to hit confirm my combos. if I play patient, I get often corner raped. I get raped in the footsies game because I don’t know the safe zones against him. I often get hit with stupid stuff when trying to space a c.mk, like a c. hk. Most balrogs i see poke a lot with c.lp, and it’s so fast. then headbutt follows it at the end of that tale :(.

Wow… long question. Check AKS’ thread, but in general, you want to sit at full c.mk range or further. At distance, its a guessing game. You have the choice of neutral jumps, FAs or c.mk to be Rogs dash punches. he has an answer for all of those though, which is why it’s a guessing game. Always remember to buffer SRK with your c.MKs. Combo wise, Rog is fucked cause of his weird shape. Im generally able to hit c.lk, c.lp, c.fp Tatsu, but some people say that whiffs… so maybe im thinking wrong, just check in training. Oh, and get those knockdowns, use option selects and rape him on his wake-up. I hate this match too, but played right it is amarginally in Ryu’s favour.

I really don’t know how to approach against Balrog. people told me to play against him like when playing zangief, but it’s not the same to me, as I know the zangief match up really well. In the end, i get overly defensive because I can’t approach, and I don’t know how to punish anything he throws at me unless it’s a headbutt/turnpunch I blocked. I usually stay stuck in between the range where I can’t get hit by a fierce headbutt, and where I can barely not get hit by a c.hk. If not, I’m in the corner getting a vicious ground and pound.

well… you just need to stay away from the corner. Throw FBs but selectively cause he can dash through. Remember he cant do any safe dashes from close, except (I think) the upper and all EXs.

3- what do I do against sagat. I don’t jump against him. then I don’t know what to do. he wins the fireball fight. focusing his fireballs to get in faster in decent, allowing he doesn’t mix up knees to often, or throw an ex fireball… if I get too close I eat the standing roundhouse. where do i stand?

**Get to c.mk range and stay there. He hasnt got a great answer at this space. If he gets close, try to FA and dash out. Basically, youre looking to always be at max c.mk range. The best thing about this is when you have ultra, causeyou can FB him and he cant FB you in case you ultra through it. **

4- can I attack abel at the end of his marseille’s roll? with a c.hp into srk for example. or can i only grab him?
**
Yes you can. The way I do this is by ear. In the English version he says something like ‘Excellent’… I generally throw a c.mp out on the 'exceLent/… the ‘l’… from there you can combo all day. This is spacing dependent though, as if he crosses you up at the end of the roll, youre c.mp will whiff and he can rape you for free. throw is the safest bet though.**

5- how should i react when akuma does his air flip, if he’s landing at a range where he can only hit me with the end of the sweep, when he’s landing in front of me, also when he’s at air grab angle. I think he can only trigger the dive kick at the peak, right? so after he passes the peak, how do I react to the grab/land/occasionnal punch mix-up.

**totally depends on which move he chooses and spacing. Badly space just SRK, he can hit the throw one safe on wake-up though, so just dash out. You can j.mk over sweep one or FA and dash in ( I think, I generally stick to j.mk though). **
6- can i do anything after blocking c. viper’s electric punch to punish her?

you mean the one where she dashes? she’s at -5 on block, so if shes close you can punish her, else just be glad that she just burnt an EX (which is incredibly valuable to Viper - way more than Ryu) for no reason.
7- how come e. honda’s ex buttstomp sometimes breaks the focus and sometimes doesn’t? same for blanka’s rainbow.
**
With honda I think its the second hit that breaks the armour… not sure though… Doesnt Blankas roll always break armour?**
8- how do I cope with el fuerte on wake up?

Depends. Dash back to beat the throw thing. SRk to beat the slide and pretty much everything else. There is no answer for everything - if Fuerte didnt have a great knockdown game, hed be fucked
9- should I rush down rufus or should I play more conservatively?

**Depends on you and the Rufus. Personally, I’ll play conservatively whilst looking for a way in… then as soon as I land my shit, I’ll get out and go back to being conservative. You can rush sort of, if he doesnt have EX, if he does then you shouldnt, you should bait him to waste metre first. Anything is better than being in the corner though, so if rushing helps you stay out of the corner, do it, but be cautious of his metre. **

that’s it. thanks in advance. I’ll be lurking some more unless I really need to post again. >_>

answered above. hope that helps.

[ranix]

hey guys. I love this thread. I’ve been lurking for like, 2 months now, coming on and off everytime or so from work lol.
I have a 9 questions and or things I wonder about. some are general, some are matchup specific. I’m not bad at the game, and know a lot about the character itself. I can do the c.lp to c.mp/c.hp/c.mk links, the c.mp tp c.hp, srk focus cancel ultra, and I’m trying to implement fireball focus cancel combos now. I don’t own the game though, and I don’t play as much as I’d like to.

You can answer one or many or all the questions if you have accurate info. please be nice, as some of these questions may seem trivial to you. you can be concise or detailed in your explanations, but please mention when there a moves requires different punish options depending on the strength used (e.g. you can punish bison’s scissor kicks on block, but not the light kick one).

If anything, maybe a good question’ll be there and we can spark a good convo that’ll help new players like me.

1- what’s the best option to punish a blocked tiger knee, depending on tiger knee strength and spacing on block? even a reversal shoryuken doesn’t connect after, and sometimes I can’t even grab because I get hit by another stupid sagat move.

it s depend of the distance if tiger knee touch you 2 time in guard it s vulnerable to cr.mp into whatever you want. if it touche iyou one time and you are standing you recorver faster than sagat but he can protect or TU if it touche you 1 time and you are crouch then sagat have the advantage.

2- where should i be spacing myself and what do I do against balrog? I noticed that I can’t do ‘c.lp, c.lp, c.hp’ on Balrog when he’s ducking. should i stick to the ‘c.lp, c. lp, c.mk’ string?
even then, it’s hard to get that close to hit confirm my combos. if I play patient, I get often corner raped. I get raped in the footsies game because I don’t know the safe zones against him. I often get hit with stupid stuff when trying to space a c.mk, like a c. hk. Most balrogs i see poke a lot with c.lp, and it’s so fast. then headbutt follows it at the end of that tale :(.

I really don’t know how to approach against Balrog. people told me to play against him like when playing zangief, but it’s not the same to me, as I know the zangief match up really well. In the end, i get overly defensive because I can’t approach, and I don’t know how to punish anything he throws at me unless it’s a headbutt/turnpunch I blocked. I usually stay stuck in between the range where I can’t get hit by a fierce headbutt, and where I can barely not get hit by a c.hk. If not, I’m in the corner getting a vicious ground and pound.

no use to play full screen against boxer as they can FA and your hadoken all day long.

basically you have to play mid range. before balrog sweep.

your goal is to avoid the sweep and put pressure with hado the if they try to predict shoryu.

don t be predictable with your hado, make a lot of rythm change and move from outside of balrog sweep range pressuring with hado to inside cr.mk ryu range to to pressure with cr.mk to hado.

be carefull with TAP ex and jump. you have to oplay a lot of footsy just like zanghief but distance is outside of boxer sweep.

3- what do I do against sagat. I don’t jump against him. then I don’t know what to do. he wins the fireball fight. focusing his fireballs to get in faster in decent, allowing he doesn’t mix up knees to often, or throw an ex fireball… if I get too close I eat the standing roundhouse. where do i stand?

your goal is to puch him in the corner by going forward slowly.
you can pressure him with cr.mk. don t enter the TS war, ryu lose and sagat build meter faster. you can fight with hado but going forwar to pressure him.

once you ush hm in the corner, try to enter cr.mk raneg and pressure him with it.
you have to play some hado outside of cr.mk too .

sagat goal is to make you jump over ts to puncih you.

your goal is the same, pressuring him with cr.mk hado and hado just outside of range to make hime do mistake or jump.

4- can I attack abel at the end of his marseille’s roll? with a c.hp into srk for example. or can i only grab him?

already answered cr.mk is good at the end of the roll ex is only grab.

5- how should i react when akuma does his air flip, if he’s landing at a range where he can only hit me with the end of the sweep, when he’s landing in front of me, also when he’s at air grab angle. I think he can only trigger the dive kick at the peak, right? so after he passes the peak, how do I react to the grab/land/occasionnal punch mix-up.

if he land a little bit fare just hado him, be carefull if he is in grab ramge as some time some kick can make you wiff the shoryu.

there is no rule here, you have to react properly, BUt late shoryu will beat or at list double contacte with eerything if akuma is in front of you.

good answer is to jump bacl with hp. it will at worst reset teh situation and in many case counter akuma move.

6- can i do anything after blocking c. viper’s electric punch to punish her?

no… they can back dash or ex seismo or birning kick.

ex seismo will touch you if you attack directly or if you counter.

back dash will avod your ttack ane burning kick will win if you try to hado.

there is no answer you have to think and react. it 50 /50 as you can shoryu hado or back dash.

7- how come e. honda’s ex buttstomp sometimes breaks the focus and sometimes doesn’t? same for blanka’s rainbow.

must be because some time it s a reversal. all special move are Armor breaker if they are done as reversal, even hadoken. there is no other way honda could break with this move your FA

8- how do I cope with el fuerte on wake up?

guessing game, jump forward back dash and guard then just make the good choice.

9- should I rush down rufus or should I play more conservatively?

conservatively. punish is dive kick with shoryu and pressure with hado.

that’s it. thanks in advance. I’ll be lurking some more unless I really need to post again. >_>

Hope helped a little bit.

ranix

[Infinite_Waveshine]

wow thanks a lot DarthPaul1982 and ranix, it helps a lot. Also ranix, c’est vraiment drle lire tes posts parce que j’entends ton accent franco quand tu tapes en anglais lol. Mais srieux, j’aime beaucoup lire tes posts parce que tu sais de quoi tu parles. ^^

I checked the boards about safe jump option select, I’m gonna have to implement that in my game. There was a thread about all the safejump option selects listed by character match ups. I’d like something cleared up though.

If I understand right, after a knockdown, I do a jumping HP/HK, and do the motion for the srk/tatsu/super/ultra as the aerial is supposed to hit right before landing.
After that, I press the correct button to trigger the srk/tatsu/super/ultra on landing, while going back to a defensive position on the joystick, is that correct?
So when I do that, I should stuff the opponent’s reversal (in the best scenario), or the reversal will trade, or whiff because of my special. I can also block the reversal in other cases.

If the opponent only blocks on wake up, won’t a srk/tatsu/super/ultra come out and get blocked, allowing the opponent to punish me?

On-topic about safe jump, check out the beast trying some crazy stuff with safe jump option super. I’m sure it would have worked closer to the corner maybe:
[media=youtube]AuM60G3fyRA#t=3m43s[/media]

edit: he didn’t do a reversal ultra, I guess he didn’t react fast enough. talk about players that see crazy punish opportunities.

[Weazzy89]

Hey i’ve been readin through here for hours now trying to find an awnser to these two questions.

1. Which is the best way to mash uppercuts on 1pl side through block strings. Sometimes i can tell their broken but i just get wasted and my DP doesnt come out. I’ve made the switch to stick and it’s driving me nuts.

2. When i do get the mash dp i cancel but then cant fadc cos stick is too slow on the 1 pl side. On 2 pl side i can hit it 100% just by twitching a little, why so much harder on 1pl side. This has been driving me crazy for months now, i play with every other char now other than my fav and my first main Ryu.

Thx in advance, and i’m REALLY serious about this game, it’s taking over my life lol, in a good way lol.:wgrin:

[otter]

If the opponent only blocks on wake up, won’t a srk/tatsu/super/ultra come out and get blocked, allowing the opponent to punish me?

No. This is the entire purpose of the option select because it is a win/win situation.

If the opponent blocks your jump in, you will be stuck in the air for a split second. This forces the game to ignore your special move input so you simply land and are free to combo or pressure your blocking opponent.

If your opponent is not hit by the jump in (because of teleport, backdash, invincible attack, etc…) There will be nothing to stop your special attack from activating.

[DarthPaul1982]

On-topic about safe jump, check out the beast trying some crazy stuff with safe jump option super. I’m sure it would have worked closer to the corner maybe:
[media=youtube]AuM60G3fyRA#t=3m43s[/media]

edit: he didn’t do a reversal ultra, I guess he didn’t react fast enough. talk about players that see crazy punish opportunities.

LOL… I do that all the time. sometimes I go straight to option select ultra VS chun. I use OS super VS teleports, sometimes ultra VS Akuma teleport… theres a lot of fun to be had… generally I just use OSs to be experimentive in casual matches and see what I get! lol…actually… I think I might make a list of OSs to use VS different characters. You guys think that would be worth it?

[ranix]

check this

http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=207625

[Hiryu02]

How do you guys feel about the cr mk, hado fadc cr mk tatsu combo?

I’ve seen it in a few Daigo matches, but is it really practical? By practical I mean worth working into your regular rotation of combos. It about doubles the damage off a hit confirmed cr mk hado combo, plus gets you a knockdown, but is it worth the meter?

I guess you could tack on an EX hado at the end if you had enough meter and use the combo to push your opponent into the corner from near midscreen and perhaps land an ultra.

[System_1]

I’ve lately seen some problems with my regular crossup-jumpin where I do:

j.mk -> c.lk -> c.lp -> srk / grab / c.hp / whatever

A couple of ryu players which I’ve encountered are able to srk me between my blocked j.mk and c.lk. Is this simply because I dont time the c.lk correctly or will there always be a hole if my j.mk gets blocked and hits my opponent too high up?

[Scourge]

How do you guys feel about the cr mk, hado fadc cr mk tatsu combo?

I’ve seen it in a few Daigo matches, but is it really practical? By practical I mean worth working into your regular rotation of combos. It about doubles the damage off a hit confirmed cr mk hado combo, plus gets you a knockdown, but is it worth the meter?

I guess you could tack on an EX hado at the end if you had enough meter and use the combo to push your opponent into the corner from near midscreen and perhaps land an ultra.

Depends on the opponent and the current situation, really. As a general rule, though, if you can, always take the opportunity to do a decent chunk of damage.

will there always be a hole if my j.mk gets blocked and hits my opponent too high up?

Yes.
You can also get a feel for this by testing with j.lk. The amount of blockstun done by j.mk equals the amount of hitstun done by j.lk.
If you are able to combo after j.lk at around the same height, then you will be able to keep the opp in blockstun aftetr j.mk.
You can also occasionally substitute with cr.lp which is 1 frame faster if you are not sure you will land in time.

[SoulSeekr786]

I’ve lately seen some problems with my regular crossup-jumpin where I do:

j.mk -> c.lk -> c.lp -> srk / grab / c.hp / whatever

A couple of ryu players which I’ve encountered are able to srk me between my blocked j.mk and c.lk. Is this simply because I dont time the c.lk correctly or will there always be a hole if my j.mk gets blocked and hits my opponent too high up?

I used to encounter this problem too. A friend of mine plays Akuma and he used to SRK me out of my block strings quite regularly. What I started doing is trying to hit the j.mk cross up as deep as possible. If I don’t hit it deep; once I land I down block for a second, trying to bait a shoryu. If he doesn’t shoryu, I continue with the block string. Usually c.lp c.lp / c.mk xx hadouken.

[Dannkk]

I’ve lately seen some problems with my regular crossup-jumpin where I do:

j.mk -> c.lk -> c.lp -> srk / grab / c.hp / whatever

A couple of ryu players which I’ve encountered are able to srk me between my blocked j.mk and c.lk. Is this simply because I dont time the c.lk correctly or will there always be a hole if my j.mk gets blocked and hits my opponent too high up?

They’re just mashing out the srk. You have two options to beat it. Either cross them up, then do a late crouch tech…to bait the srk, but cover your ass if they try and throw. Or, you can use c.lps instead. C.lp starts up one frame faster than c.lk…that one frame is why they can mash out srk.

[System_1]

thanks for all the answers, guess I will just have to start mixing it up a bit more!

[System_1]

I need help guys… what is the dragon punch shortcut?.. i really need that shit to help my game.

[Kuma_Oni]

It’s a secret

[shatterstar]

I need help guys… what is the dragon punch shortcut?.. i really need that shit to help my game.

623 + EX Kill yo self.

[DarthPaul1982]

I need help guys… what is the dragon punch shortcut?.. i really need that shit to help my game.

just press d/f twice then punsh, or mash d, d/d, d, d,/f then punch.

[System_1]

623 + EX Kill yo self.

Ok… now im going to beast on fools with this short cut… ill have them saltier than a cracker… the food.

SHORYUKENPPAAAAA!!!