Rugal stuff

Classic Fighting Games Capcom VS SNK 2
21

I like how you say this, but I doubt you’ve ever gone to Japan or played with the top players there on a consistent basis. Otherwise you would know that Yuu uses Rugal in C-Groove and that he is a very top player (Buktooth posted some of the tricks he saw in his Random Stuff I Learned in Japan thread).

Also, you would know that BAS was eliminated from SBO by (shock!) a Rugal player, and lost in several SUBSEQUENT tournaments to that Rugal player.

Rugal does NOT suck. You just have to learn how to USE him… something that US players simply HAVE NOT done.

22

Well I confess it’s from some hearsay and a friend of mine who’s japanese (doesn’t visit any forums though).

Two things.

  1. So what if he loses to Rugal, it would probably mean he loses to other characters like Sagat that much more.

  2. Maybe that Rugal player uses Rugal as the first character and a ratio 1 AND loses badly, while his other remaining characters (Blanka, Sagat, A-sakura) are the ones that polish BAS. that would still prove Rugz to be a liability.

Well in fairness he’s “probably” the strongest of the Tier 4 group (King, Yuri, benimaru, etc.) but that’s as far as he goes, and only Tier 4.

BTW Superman > CvS2 Rugal.

23

No one is saying that Sagat is not better. I am saying that Rugal can hang with the top tier and that he does not SUCK.

**

I know BAS. He lived with me when he was here, and I still talk to him a lot online. I was IN ATTENDANCE AT SBO AND SAW HIM GET OWNED UP BY RUGAL. The Rugal is the guy’s anchor… and do you know who his R1s are? Iori and Rock. Are they top tier? Of course not. What does that tell you? That the guy took the time to learn his characters so that they can compete at the same level with top tier characters like A-Blanka, Sakura, and Bison (BAS’s team).

Face it. You are wrong. Rugal does not suck. It is YOU that sucks with Rugal if you can’t hang. Instead of saying that a character sucks, maybe you should look into the character’s strengths and see how you can use those strengths to their fullest potential.

24

Granted I accept these claims of yours, It would only indicate that the player is good, one player in a haystack of dominators…

how often do we see Rugals as good as that one in Japan, or in the states even… none… so it’s obvious that one “hit” does not mean the entire performance is not a “miss”.

If there were more people in Japan who has the same Rugal level as him, it would be good for Rugal users (I’m one, that’s why it pains me to admit that he’s really not good, but hey it’s a fact)

Besides if the player is really good, then it would also be conceivable that he’s wasting his time with Rugal, when he can pick other tons of better characters like Sagat, Ryu, Akuma, Sakura, Cammy and the list goes on. he would be much better with those.

Also if Rugal’s decent, why is he only Tier 4? And why do Japanese people consider him lower tier? (well if you have another opinion on his tiering I’ll respect that though).

25

bahahahaha!! :lol:

Gunter just said you suck.

26

Yes, we should all pick ONLY the top assholes in the game… We should all base our character selections on the top tier! screw having fun and variety if you happen to like other characters! :slight_smile:

C’mon now… Gunter’s just saying that Rugal is good enough to compete. (if you’re good enough with him to pull it off)

It seems you think that way just because you read somewhere that he’s a “tier 4” character. He’s not top, (which is why you don’t see EVERYBODY whoring him)… But you act like picking him is an automatic loss. Where can I find this tier list?

kcxj Dude, put the pom-poms down… :slight_smile:

27

I don’t know where you are getting this “Tier 4” crap from, but you’re obviously being given false information SOMEWHERE.

No one is saying Rugal is top tier. So stop saying stupid stuff where you compare Rugal to the top tier. The top tier IS better. That is a fact. THAT IS WHY THEY ARE TOP TIER.

The definition of a middle tier character is that they may do well against but cannot beat the top tier (if they do well, they are “upper-middle”) and they do well against and/or beat other middle tiers. They beat the lower tier characters. THAT IS WHY THEY ARE MIDDLE TIER.

Lower tier characters have trouble against most of the cast, but they can beat other characters in their lower tier.

And then there’s Kyosuke, who is in the bottom tier all by himself.

There are no set limitations for tiers. In A2, it was the Big Four of Ryu, Ken, Chun, and Rose… but in CvS1, it was Nakoruru and Guile dominating the remainder of the cast when teamed with powerful R1s. So there’s no set number of how many characters to put in each tier.

There’s a consensus within top players in Japan that A-Sakura is the best character in the game. However, based on SBO qualifier results (the only national tournament ANYWHERE with constant team/character record-keeping), she was tied for FIFTH most-used in the game (for the record, it was C-Sagat at 1, A-Bison at 2, A-Blanka at 3, K-Sagat at 4, and K-Cammy also tied for 5th). Nowhere in the top five does C-Chun appear, but anyone can tell you that C-Chun is top tier. C-Guile is 14th on the list (actually tied with K-Blanka for 13th), but we know that he is top tier also.

Taking the data without groove-specifics, Sakura and Guile don’t change in the rankings at all (although Chun moves up). However, Geese and Rolento are among the characters that move above Guile.

Vega, a character the US deems top tier, is tied with Guile and Ryu on the non-groove specific rankings (P-Vega tied for 19th on the overall rankings and C and N had one representative each, tieing for 39th).

So the facts don’t lie - top/high tier characters are not necessarily the most used in the game. Or in other words, the number of players using a character does not directly coincide to that character’s tier. Just because there is that “one ‘hit’” doesn’t mean that the character is not good. Ease of use does not have any bearing on the character’s tier. Tiers are determined by success when used to their fullest potential. That is the true judgment of the CHARACTER, independent of the player’s SKILL (or lack thereof in the US, as you state).

The Rugal player in Japan that completely dominated BAS at SBO and in subsequent tournaments lost only to Daigo in his qualifying tournament (I don’t have the official SBO brackets on hand), so he had to fight through the top players in the TOKYO area - the home of Amusement Forum More and all the top players that practice there. So his qualifying was NOT a fluke. Rugal, when used to his fullest potential, can COMPETE. He does NOT, in any way you choose to look at the data, SUCK.

28

yall are too obsessed with tiers just say fuck tiers and play. I use characters i feel comfortable playing with not ones that are
"top tier"

I use Rugal he always ends up getting the job done for me as my first character R1

29

I used to play C Groove Rugal back in the day and could hold my own as long as I could get spacing. The biggest problem was characters like Sakura, Kim, Cammy etc. It seemed they would get inside the airfireballs and most of the normals either didnt have enough priority to counter the characters. Everytime I had success I was able to keep them away with a few runaway airfireballs, Kaiser Waves and crouching fowards into God Press. A big problem was I could never find a reliable AA as Genocide Cutter has little priority and takes forever to come out and his crouching fierce didnt seem to fair much better. Against guys like Sagat, Blanka, Yama I could beat because of the spacing. So how would you space someone like Kim or Sakura especially with no reliable AA.

IMO it seems Rugal’s most reliable groove is K, the rage bar seems to add quite a bit of damage to his moves and supers helping to neutralize some of his other weaknesses, he can be really effective in K if used right.

30

Rugal definitely does not suck, and is actually quite the popular character in Japan. Off the top of my head, I can think of 5 really good players that use him.

31

WTF are you high again? Can anyone even decifer that.

32

@?@?@??@B@?@?@K@?@?@?@?@@B@?B@?@?@@?@?B

33

Lack of an anti-air is one of the reasons P and K are so good for Rugal. However, I’d give the edge to P because of the anti-air parry to wall crush to super combo. His wall crush is a very good move because it sets up his super, but in K he only has that super for a limited time. BAS found out the hard way that one foolish jump kick leads to over half your life gone against a charged P-Rugal. Plus, as Buktooth mentions in his thread, Rugal’s dash is extremely deceptive. You get dash thrown before you can react to it (unless you’re looking for it). Rugal doesn’t need run so much when he has parries, so P gives him more of a boost than K, IMO.

34

Hmmmm…

Well, lets just say Rugal IS a complex character… if your hand-eye coordinations sucks… he sucks! But mind you ppl who says Rugal can’t compete against toppers (ei: Blanka, Sagat, Athena), you’re DAMN wrong. Best thing bout Rugal is that he’s one of the char. with the highest Hp, best against rush characters. His roll is pretty nice and throws quickly indeed. And in C-Groove, try using this old fashioned Rugal combo:

Cross-up mk, standing mk+god press, do lvl2 genocide heaven then cancel with air smasher light punch, then again do lvl 1 genocide heaven. =)

If Rugal’s Ratio 2 and having this combo executed pretty well, i doubt that character would still be breathing… massive damage! But Rugal really have a hard tym on small rush characters… i dunno y?..

35

I don’t htink having high HP and a nice roll are reasons he can compete against top tiers such as uh… Athena.

36

This thread hit yet another low

Forgive my babbling, I was shrooming and I do strange things when I do that.

37

standing strong is good anti-air if you’re zoning someone, if you’re going to get crossed up just roll the fuck out the way or jump back fierce. close standing roundhouse is actually a dope anti-air but it’s got really funny properties so you have to experiment with it… and there’s always rc godpress

38

What are you all smoking? You guys have usernames like Rugal 3:16 and KaiserGenocide, but keep going on and on about how Rugal sucks… :lol:

39

I agree about the dash though, it’s quite good but you can’t dash over low projectiles like he does in CvS1 because he hops closer to the ground, but maybe that’s the trade-off.

Rugal does indeed lose his weaknesses in P and K depending on how good a player can utilize those block neutralizers (Parry and JD) but IMO he also loses his strenghts.

Rugal’s best asset is his massive damage capability that can shrug off Ratio 1’s easily (assuming they just stand there) and in P-groove you’re only forced to use this sparingly because of the one level and the amount of time it takes to build it up.

Of course if your opponent notices a good chunk on super bar on your part, you won’t see missed DP’s, much poking (for fear of anticipated with a higher level gigatech pressure), guarding high only. you get turtled, and Rugal has to rush down and he CANNOT.

The Irony is Rugal has to zone because well, that’s all he can really do… and the sad fact is, he doesn’t even zone well even against most characters (not just the top tiers) that can also have more battle initiatives (can turtle better, can rush better) and still can also zone better.

So true he may not be as bad as complimented by public demand. But when it’s tournament time, everyone has to win, so everyone’s best bet is to pick the Top Tiers…

40

What did you think? If he’s truly shitty, why should anyone give a fuck?

No one’s saying you can’t, bro, but if you don’t feel like it,… well, I’ll not write in circles.

(not flaming)