Rose Hitbox and Analysis

A good day everyone, a good day indeed! Finally we have access to the complete hitboxdata in (S)SF4, and that means you can see all framedata frame by frame, active hitboxes, defensive boxes, throw boxes, invulnarability, reach and more.

Example of S HP.

The main data comes from a torrent posted on the main SSF4 forum, and I extracted this to Rose specific data much like Rorec did in the Juri forum.
I find this to be invaluable to at least Theory Fighter, but also a lot more practical than just the framedata by itself.

At this moment I’m converting the movies to frames and then filtering out the bulk of frames that mean nothing, so that you are left with the moves by itself.

The data is divided into following categories: standing, crouching, proximity (standing close), neutral jumping, jumping, throws, ultras, super, specials, taunt and focus.
Most categories do LP, MP, HP, LK, MK and HK to show all the moves.

One way to view it is by opening a category folder and viewing the files one by one, as if you are stepping through the frames. You can clearly count the frames; it matches nicely with the known framedata.

Disclaimer from the original author of the videos:

He explains the hitboxes too:


It is now complete!

Also check out Pasqual’s Rose Technology thread for new combos.

Go and analyze!


This stuff is awesome for newer rose players who haven’t really gotten a “feel” for the character yet. Even just seeing how long it takes to raise your hitbox during and and how many frames it takes to lower your hitbox during a slide is really helpful.

The rest is on the way. You can clearly see the blue throwable hitbox disappearing the frame the S CL MK starts, that’s why this move is so useful. It as fast as a tech, really, and it wins from untechable throws as well.

For anti-airs you need moves with an offensive hitbox quite high and higher than your defensive one. Even a slight advantage is enough as jumping attacks usually have completely overlapping offensive and defensive hitboxes, meaning you’ll win the fight and not trade.
You can see that C HP and S CL HK are actually the best, conform to experience.

It is complete. One nice thing to see in those hitboxes is what makes a good crossup move. There is a small rectangle at the feet which signifies the ‘middle’ of the chaeacter and is used as the passing point to figure out when a character has switched sides with another. As that crosses the other chars middle, you get a cross. Good crossup moves have offensive hitboxes close to that point, so that a move that is activated just after switch will still hit the enemy. It doesnt have to hit behind the middle (when facing left to right: left from the middle), it just has to be able to hit the deepest (most right) hitboxes of the opponent when it crossed the points.
Hard epxlanation, but you’ll see that J MK is very close to the middle point, and also J HP has possibilities. J MK is way better tho than J HP.

For me I learned that I should stop using J HP in neutral jump… I thought that it would hit low but it hits medium to high, in contrast to the animation. Very bad move to hit crouchers with.

definitely checking this out later.

those info are awesome !!

I struggle with the data for Ex soul spiral.

at first it seems much better than in vanilla.
but there is something strange:

with the jpg, I’ve found 11 invulnerable frame, then one normal, then the first active frame.

the move isn’t supposed to have 6 startup frame ??

Now I wish we had the same data from vanilla, to have better comparison.

other example: reflect have really a lot of frame to hit fireball ( more than the 2-3 ‘active’ frame), but maybe it was exactly the same before ?

Its quite correct how you counted, because the framedata lists it at 13 startup (hitting at frame 13), with 6 active frames (maybe thats you confusion?)
The really, really nasty thing about this move is that frame 12 doesn’t hit, but does have hittable boxes. One would think this was a mistake, really.

Downloading now, thanks man !

ok, my mistake.
It sure annoying that she doesn’t have that one invulnerable frame more.
Do you know how much she had in vanilla ?

I suspect this stayed the same. You can see a one-frame faster startup on C HP, tho.

About the reach numbers: the first one is where the red hitbox starts, the second one where it ends on an X-axis, with 0,0 origin being the starting point of the move (the tiny yellow box or the tiny purple one if the characters moves during the move).
This works well for grounded moves but doesnt work for jumping moves as the starting point of the move appears to be the origin of the tiny box where the move was initiated, but you are volatile so it quickly changes (you can see the value add up or subtract during its active frames). Especially annoying to compare reach numbers of moves in a backjump against moves in a forward jump, as both are used in the vid as ‘jump’ actions.

just as I thought before thinking about hitboxes, the scarf in most attacks that it SHOULD be a active hitbox, it’s not…meaning the scarf is more show than actual hitbox.

Biggest attacks that show this are FA, cr.HP. (far)s.HP. Rather sad really.

This is good stuff and only going to get better. Good work!

For some reason I can’t see the pics. What program should I use?

They are standard PNG and JPG image files, any modern OS should be able to open these by default, just like any browser.

I’ll try to update this thread to have one image per move listed in this thread, for quick reference. This will be easier to lookup and discuss moves.

I have Vista, and even dloaded an image viewer, but the files won’t show for me.

Hey Acku, if you get an image site to host the hitboxes, I’ll post them in the wiki… unless there are going to be different wikis for SF4 + SSF4. then I’ll wait.

Did you extract them from the download archive? The ‘normals’ archive is full of PNG files created with a Mac, and the other files are JPG files created with Ubuntu. That shouldn’t matter though, as they are plain image files.

@metroxylon: I’ll upload them to my own hosting, if you want to relocate and update the wiki, be my guest. I think there are now two wikis on SRK, one for SF4 and one for SSF4. We should update the latter then. I have access too, but also a lot of thing on my SSF4 schedule.
I’m working on a ‘framedata analyzer’ webapp.

First batch of hitbox images at the move’s longest reach:

S LP: reach 1.06
S MP: reach 1.23
S HP: reach 1.60
S LK: reach 1.22
S MK: reach 1.52
S HK: reach 1.88

C LP: reach 1.01
C MP: reach 1.53
C HP: reach 0.94
C LK: reach 1.18
C MK: reach 1.64
C HK: reach 1.90

Ordered by reach:

  1. C HK
  2. S HK
  3. C MK
  4. S HP
  5. C MP
  6. S MK
  7. S MP
  8. S LK
  9. C LK
  10. S LP
  11. C LP
  12. C HP

And finally, why C HP is a good anti-air: C HP at highest box.

thanks for all the work Acku!

as for cHP for AA how much better than vanilla, which felt so slow and gets beat alot =( ?

1 frame better in startup, it’s a good normal AA overall compared to others. The hitbox is high and quite safe, as jumpins usually have a defensive hitbox that completely overlaps the offensive one, so jumpins lose instead of trade to this.