Try DPing it. Take a step forward and put out a high priority normal. Jump straight up (if you can avoid FAB and Raging Demon doing this, you’re fine with a Level 2 mid hitting super) and hit a normal on your way down.
The possibilities are endless.
Try DPing it.
If you’re using a character that doesn’t have a DP or good wake-up, then it won’t happen. But maybe that could work. At that time, my top priority was landing a CC to stop the KNKs, but it did no good. Believe me, I timed it just right so that the first hit wouldn’t touch me, but as I began to start the combo, I got caught in it still. It was too fast. And he did the other KNK early enough so that I wouldn’t get to do a wake-up afterward. I could’ve DPed him after the next super, but by that time, I had already been guard crushed.
And also know that Dr.B is good at mixing traps with Dodges, so the only time I really do get to escape from the corner is when he isn’t charging the KNK so he could dodge. And it usually ends with him dodging and throwing me out of a roll and back into the corner, or dodging and hitting me with a knockdown poke.
Take a step forward and put out a high priority normal.
Did I forget to mention that I was in blockstun most of the time? B’s timing for the KNKs were just too good- one right after the other. It’s not very safe for you to just step forward inbetween each one.
Jump straight up (if you can avoid FAB and Raging Demon doing this, you’re fine with a Level 2 mid hitting super) and hit a normal on your way down.
It works against FABs and Raging Demons because they’re grab supers. A KNK is not. It hits people on the ground and in the air. And if I did have a Lv.3, I sure as hell would’ve done it, but I was in A-Groove. And I couldn’t counter even one KNK by just activating the CC for the same reasons above.
Well the thing about it is, grapple supers, at any level (omit Maki with her zero range), have a higher priority than a same level super that connects via hitbox (FAB vs any hitting level 1 = FAB raping you). Just essentially, jumping straight up happens faster than anything. I would think that you could escape a KNK since it’s a mid and low hitting super - things like Mai’s fan super, the first hit is almost an anti-jump because it hits so high.
But in any case, yeah if you don’t have a DP then it makes things difficult, but a DP will clean that shit up. You can do it on reaction when you see the ki gathering animation and the worst you’ll do is trade, unless you’re Morrigan since her DP priority is kinda shitty and you have to do it late. People like Cammy, Yamazaki, and Sakura can easily trade by sticking out a stand roundhouse.
Just remember that no matter what, Level 1 priorities are all the same, it’s just that the hitboxes on some contact your sprite faster than others. Like Rugal’s Genocide Heaven, King’s Silent Flash, and I suppose Knee Press Nightmare are good examples. Pick a normal that’s fast enough to stick out and you’ll stuff it or trade. Like King will clean out Ryu if he tries to sweep her out of it a majority of the time, because the sweep has so many more frames than her super, but if he sticks out a low forward instead, it’ll at least trade every time.
If all else fails, RC that shit. heh.
Back to Rock.
All right then, I’ll keep those suggestions in mind next time I play him. I’ve never played anyone good in S-Groove before, but now I’ll try not to be so reluctant with anything other than CCs.
Does anyone know about what Final Showdown was talking about in his thread concerning Rock’s invulnerability during empty jumps?
Yes. Rock is not susceptible to tripguard properties when you do an empty jump.
For instance, jump in on Iori with Ryu, hitting no button, and have Iori do Level 3 Maiden Masher to anti-air him. Ryu will get raped. Do the same thing with Rock. Rock will be able to block.
That’s the “glitch.” Rock and a couple other people have this trait, it makes him very good at baiting anti-air CCs like Cammy’s that hit low initially.
I had no idea Rock wasn’t susceptable to the tripguard deal. That is so cool to know. I can’t tell you how many shoto’s i nail as they land, as i’m sure everyone else has done too
although ive used this combo only a few times ( most of the time i miss the c. mk --> shine-knuck.) but it could be one of the, if not the most damaging combo in the game and i wanted to share it w people and hope some can find it useful.(n-groov. 3 full bars rock) j.fierce, fierce–> deadly rave but leave out the energy blast and do c.lp, c.lp(or c.lk or any 2 c. light attacks) c.ml----> shine-knuckle. man, i love that combo. huge damage.
i also had a question about the glitch i saw in a vid. with rock here in shoryuken when rock was walking about with his raising storm active … :o … does any one know how to do that?
Tech throw glitch, I reckon.
“soo ka”… thanks
how would you fight someone like sagat vega iori or cammy
counterpoke sagat with sweet by walking around and crouching just outside his low fierce range… if he whiffs, sweep him. other then that… you just beat sagat with the same tactics as any other character… rock doesn’t have anything that outright beats sagat…
vega, reaction standing roundhouse everytime vega jumps… sweep a lot, and it is mostly safe to jump at vega if you’re rock using roundhouse… standing strong will hit vega’s claw at a long range, don’t throw repukens because vega’s jump is fast enough to punish you without them having good reaction time.
iori… i don’t play good ioris often so i’ll chill back
cammy, low jump over her roundhouse poke if you have a low jump, if not, rc the jab elbow vs. her running pokes. sweep a lot… other then that… it’s too hard to beat her once she gets in on you so save the super… that way you have a way to actually hurt her.
rock’s problem is that he can’t really attack good characters because of his lack of good moves…
Bascially the idea is to zone them out and not get rushed down if you don’t have meter, or you will die horribly.
I would say Balrog and Iori are probably the worse out of the 4.
(all based on an n-groove rock ‘cuz rock imo works best w/run’)
running and sweep doesnt work for me (dammit, i wish more people used rock or at least to see most of “yours” at play. :bluu: so i could compare & contrast and learn) :mad:
i play the probability game which is a very powerful method… for instance, rock against terry… most of terry’s better moves, or should i say, the ones that are more effective and that work for him against most characters… (moves that terry is more probable of using) will be caught by rock’s high counter whats left? that huge, long sweep, right? catch that shit too!
lets take cammy for example what does she usally do? drill… more times than most dragon kick right? both will be caught by high counter. her best pokes a s.fierce, s. roundhouse, or s.forward, middle counter…CRACK counter. he-he. her roundhouse is shit and rock has that huge s.roundhouse to block her jump-ins( less she’s in p/ k) and even then you could switch into a deep-df.fierce or raising storm. going back to the running to sweep thing, i usually just rush them down with jab hard edge, most people will try to low attack you and well… yes you have time for the counter, strong leaves you more vulnerable and well i dont really use fierce hard edge except to buffer from s.fierce(close) or s.roundhouse or i might just run in with a c.jab, c.short, c.jab,----->jab hard edge, reppuken. and the mind games with the shift to 360-toss from a guard crush combo. sagat, iori, blanka… man blanka strat. is well, maybe later but i still dont have an effective way to beat sagat… as in to win most of the time. iori players love to hate the double reppuken…
Not flaming you or anything, but strats revolving around “psychic” counters are generally about as worthless as Kyosuke.
You should be throwing afar Reppukens to discourage Spiral Arrow. This limits her mobility to (outside of RCing the SA, which I don’t think anyone really does)-
- Jump/Superjumping
- Short Jump attack
- Blocking it
- Rolling
- Very unlikely, but a well timed lp Axel Spin Knuckle will pass through fireballs
Blocking really doesn’t do shit. So you’re left with 3 realistic options. Option 1 is met with a stand rh or Super. Option 2 is met with stand fk or stand mk (maybe even stand mp) - depending on who it is and what attack it is, it may limit Rock’s ability to either blocking it or super. Option 4 should be met with a meaty normal into B&B or super coming out, the scrubilicious Hard Edge follow up, or a throw.
Now the hard part is maintaining the momentum you just got. This really lies primarily in mind games and baiting shit. There really is no strat list for this.
Some of the basic things you can do is, follow an anti-air stand rh situation with a mp Reppuken and follow behind it for some kind of pressure, or to continue where you left off. After a knockdown, you can whiff c.lp and bait a wake up DP so you can block it and punish her for it. You can randomly Dash in and 360, but you have to be quick (not recommended for Run Grooves, unless you can c.lk tick-command throw Chikyuu style).
But really this match comes with experience and gimmicks. Landing a super really helps. Like a Level 3 kind.
reread your reply buddy, probability. its not psychic whatever… its math… if they are in the air, rock has many options but a counter will always be high, when their in the ground, depending on the character, there is a higher probability of certain moves that will be used in the match. i was sharing a method on using those “dreaded counters” that most people overlook. its not just speed and luck… although you do have to be fast about it. and your options are good but i think, you forget how fast cammy is. in a dash groove, she could just hop over it.
Okay, well I don’t know how you are used to playing, but in my experience, relying on counters has never really worked out for me or anyone else I know playing a character that has counters. Maybe Yamazaki to use it as a AA more than anyone off the top of my head.
But yes, I know Dashing is viable, but the whole thing is based on zoning from quite a distance. Being half a screen away and having her Dash over it is not much a problem unless she’s got full meter.
ok, ok, now how would rock deal with a sagat? all that i really have is …sorry…middle counter which stops c.fierce and s.fierce… i guess if you anticipate a move, you’ll have faster reaction. aside from that, if you have a run in ur groove, if you get a chance u can run under a high fireball and i guess you can be more cautious when his meter is up but not be a little bitch and run like a scrub with mai would:mad: . then there is the obvious shine knuck. through fireball… hhmmm anything else? i think that zoning an area like what mummy-b said against cammy might work alittle better here.
Someone once said something about how Rock’s upper body was kinda invulnerable during the 360 and could do some crazy shit like grab Joe out of his double cyclone, but I haven’t been able to do anything like that. Is it really practical to try it at all?
The only reason Rock may have upper-body invincibility during the Shinkuu Nage is because he’s crouching during the the grab animation.
I’ve heard that Rock’s low MP will hit Sagat’s standing HP cleanly. Any confirmations?