Sometimes the FP is blockable even when hitting on the first frame. (I saw a couple of those too.) It looks (and the information I have is just visual) like the SRK hits before the victim can transition into blocking mode. This is most likely happening because the system is determining whether Ken hits before it checks to see whether the victim should be switched to blocking on that frame. Reversal frames supposedly have special ‘goes first’ properties, so the interaction with the FP SRK could be interesting.
Interesting stuff Rufus, thanks for the tests. It’s weird how this problem still persists even though it was supposed to be fixed for Remix.
Well it was originally 50% so it could be blocked on the first frame. Did you come up with a new %?
This was a bug (or glitch or whatever) in ST, that any move that hit on the first frame, had a 50% chance of being unblockable. Juice kicks had the glitch, Ken’s fierce dragon punch had it, Blanka’s up ball had it as well. However that unblockable property should not be in HDR according to Sirlin’s changes listed on his website.
So according to Sirlin’s change log there shouldn’t be first frame hitting unblockables in HDR. Yet this isn’t the first time that I’ve heard people claim they haven’t been able to block Ken’s fierce dragon punch in HDR. Who want to test this?
I had frame-by-frame footage of Ken hitting Ryu with a FP dragon punch while Ryu is walking backwards. This was with Ryu on the left edge of Ryu’s stage, and computer Ken. CPU Ken gets unblockable uppercuts on something like 50% of its attempts - I did a simple test, and it hit through block 11 of 19 uppercuts that hit on the first frame. I was unable to get any unblockable uppercuts on PvP training mode.
Are you absolutely sure the move was hitting on the first frame? Its only the first frame that is unblockable.
Try seeing if they opponent always enters guard state on the first frame?
I didn’t record, but yeah, I had hitbox mode on, and the first hitting frame is distinctive. It may just be that there’s some variable that I’m not controlling for.
Try a big character first. It is wierd though that CPU ken reproduces it easy.
Why, it works just fine vs Ryu with CPU Ken?
Those are all cool, thanks Rufus. IDK if you know, but NKI’s site has walking speedfor every character. Also I believe Akiba is in the process of capturing hitbox data (using HDR’s Classic mode) for neutral animations, crouching, neutral jumps, etc. I don’t have the link to that anymore, but if somebody could post it, that would be great. 
The jump arc pic looks cool, as tracking the reference dot during attacks is very important IMO. I know a lot of people say the reference dot indicates if the character is truly airborne or not, but has anybody truly proven this? I think the dot has more to do with throw ranges than airborne states, I could be wrong tho. Dictator’s reference dot during the Scissors and Crusher is always grounded, but he’s definitely unthrowable once he’s visibly airborne. Same with Honda’s Torpedo.
As for fireballs, it would be nice if we knew the travelling speed of every fireball. I mean how many seconds or frames it takes each fireball in the game to cross the screen. *That *I would find very useful, especially when comparing O.Sagat’s speed to R.Sagat’s speed.
Thelo was asking for projectile reaction timing stuff (which is related). How’s this for sonic booms? http://www.pedantic.org/~nate/sonicbooms.png
You said you couldn’t reproduce it? CPU ken does it all the time.
[QUOPTE]I was unable to get any unblockable uppercuts on PvP training mode.
[/quote]
The CPU cheats…
[media=youtube]tbsmckSPmpk[/media]
More specifically, the CPU is known to have access to old versions of moves, so…
Yeah, I was gonna post that the CPU cheats, but I figured you guys already knew that, so I didn’t want to say anything. What about spirited away’s suggestion of doing a neutral jump Jab followed by a Fierce Shoryuken on Hawk? If you can’t reproduce it that way Rufus, it might just be a CPU only thing or a corner only thing IMO, but I could be wrong.
Also what is PvP? I’m guessing peer vs peer, as in non CPU matches.
PvP = player vs player.
I just ran a handful of tests myself and I reached the same conclusion that Rufus did. The unblockable bug for first frame hitting special moves only applies to the CPU in Remix Mode.
Both the CPU training mode A.I. and the arcade A.I. for the CPU, as Ken, they can perform an unblockable fierce dragon punch approximately 50% of the time. However when I tested PvP in training mode, versus mode, or PvP in arcade mode, I was able to block every single fierce dragon punch.
So it seems that the bug of first frame special moves being unblockable 50% of the time has indeed been fixed in HDR for human controlled characters. The CPU however has the luxury of unblockables. No idea why the game is this way but it is.
So a Jab Sonic Boom takes 84 frames to hit a standing Chun Li from full screen? And 64 frames for the Strong Boom and 52 frames for a Fierce Boom? Cool, good to know, thanks Rufus.
This is just my opinion, but the way you had it setup earlier was much better. Multiple pics for each different animation, hitbox and airborne/grounded change was very cool. It gets a little confusing when all of the data of one attack is crammed into one pic IMO. Or you could just create a video and upload to youtube like R|C did, even that would be better than one pic that tries to show everything. Personally tho, I prefer the multiple pics. For an attack like the Jab or Strong Torpedo, indicating the total frames will give a person an idea of how long the attack lasts. Same for Sonic Booms and other fireballs, if you just add a note saying how many frames it takes each fireball strength to reach a standing opponent a full screen away, I think people will easily understand that. Just my opinion, I like the work you did tho. = )
http://kayin.pyoko.org/hitboxes/
I’m unsure who it is that is responsible for the work on this site so rather than PM i figured i would post my question here instead.
First of all great work on the hitboxes.
It seems there is one thing missing in the Vega portion though.
His wallclaw/spike move actually has 2 versions.
The first version is up in hitbox form but if you hit the punch button a second time while he is flying he will extend the claw giving you a different hitbox.
http://kayin.pyoko.org/hitboxes/vega/wallspikefierce3.png <–
What i am referring to as to avoid confusion with walldives/wallclaw/wallspike etc.