Not gonna diss Yossann or Neo, theres some setups in their videos you can pick up and try for yourself, and get alot of success out of, you just need to notice them. For real its hard to be “good” with Juri, but ive learnt some godlike setups from Yossan and Neo, tbh i wouldnt have noticed the unblockable setups on Seth and Guile if i didnt notice Yossan’s and Good-Time’s corner setups. Not for nothing but the Japs right now, they know alot more than us, so watching what they do, you can pick out a few gems in the rough now and then.
I think most people have had success with j.strong in the corner. They FELT it was really hard to block but didn’t know why…heh. Hell, I still have problems blocking it. Maybe it works vs juri also.
Real talk…its hard to be good with juri because
a)Most of us have ASS defense so we get blown up. Because of this we do stupid shit on defense that gets us killed
b)We dont have a high level knowledge of the game so we get killed
c)Most people just do stupid shit on defense taht works on juri’s mix up. Seriously…Mashing will always own FSE due to its weird properties and different normals coming out vs different characters (I.e. far hk coming out when we expect close Hk, and whiffing and getting dp’ed from someone mashing). Becuase of this we never really get to practice our FSE in match because all everyone does is run away or reversal. If we meaty we get reversaled, if we dont meaty we get people jumping back and running
d)Almost everything about her is character specific so we drop a lot of stuff due to just not being able to hold so much information.
To cut to the chase…most juri players are not great players. Example…if Justin wong played juri, or if Mago played juri I bet people would think she was high mid tier at least!
I don’t know man. I’ve been playing Juri for a long time and I just recently started playing Honda. I do worlds better with Honda and have next to no experience with him compared to Juri. Maybe the reason people don’t play her at upper level is because she really is ass.
Think about it for a second. Juri has attributes that are good, but there is a character better than her at every one of those. The range on her Lights is so short we can’t really do alot of the things a Balrog or Chun can do. Our frame traps are mediocre at best.
Dive kicks: Cammy’s is better.
Fireball: Several are better.
Pokes + Footsies: Chun Rog are better.
Rushdown: Lol…
This leaves you to play Juri like a Faux-Rush-Zone-Hybrid Character. I really like the character, but I’d rather work alot less with somebody like Bison or Honda than pour my heart out with Juri. I’m pretty sure that’s what all the top level players do too.
I’ve just been doing alot of thinking about SSFIV in general. I think her being unique isn’t enough reason to continue to play her competitively. I enjoy getting compliments on my playstyle,(when I do well) but who cares when you get bodied by half the cast because your damage output is decent, but not overwhelming, and the risks you take is seldom worth the reward? Hell, even Viper’s risk to reward factor is much higher because she does so much more damage/stun than Juri.
Just my two cents.
Son, the reason why youre doing better with honda is because in Super hes a character that does DUPER damage. Like…jab hands/hands/round house does stupid amounts of damage/meter build. He has retarded anti airs and reversals. You cant rush him down, he has great health and his only fault is his problems with fireballs. He cant even rush down well…he just gets extreme reward for hitting your opponent.
Juri is the better character in the long run. Once they nerfed honda…he has nothing…and…its sad for the fat man.
Moving right along…your damage output is ass because your using ultra 2 IMHO. Ultra 2 is a punish ultra and yes…it might be guarenteed damage its pretty tough to setup. Yes there are easy setup’s, but the best setup to ultra 2 which is the most useful setup…the one that you can hit almost every round is fuhajin fadc ultra 2. Sorry…i’m not hitting that 1-2 frame ultra…too much work for the results. Pick ultra 1 and mix up your opponent and tell me her damage output is ass.
I have niggas mashing HARD during my fse because they know im ending the match with 60% of your health in my pocket. Personally…you really gotta realize taht everything in this game wont be handed to you. You have to be able to read your opponent. With honda, you dont need to. Just jab hands. Your opponent will eventually drop their guard or srk you, but if you get hit its whatever…high health…but if you hit them its 1/4th their life.
Juri can zone, and she can zone well. She controls space really well and you should use this to establish dominance over the screen. You really do control the screen. You can be anywhere you want at anytime. Dive kicks, teleports, fast dashing. But once you get a KD, you can rush down and mix up just as good as most of the cast. She just doesn’t have anything thats broken (except fse and some fuzzy guard setups).
Do i think juri is ass…yes. I think her lack of defense and frame traps make it very hard for her on a high level. However…if you’re worried about her short comings…please…you might wanna just spend your time here. If you’re having a hard time taking criticism…just go play with him…you wont lose as much and you’ll think you’re a good player because you earn points.
Which brings me to my last point. First, i hope you dont think im being a dick…because I’m not trying to be. My last point is…why are you arguing? You just said “this is the first ranked match i’ve won in a while”. Even if you’re making a joke…you’re having problems with ranked?! With Juri!!! I dont have problems with ranked. Maybe…I’m just playing cats that are just complete ass but I dont have many problems with Ranked mode. But you do…so…maybe I’m doing something right. Why are you arguing with my suggestions?
I’ve been doing ass in ranked because I live in Tennessee and everybody lags like fuck. On top of that I realized that my Ethernet cable was unhooked from my Xbox and I had been playing on wireless.
I play fine when I mess with the local guys.(People within 50 miles from me) Nobody is arguing with you, but seriously I think you just like to hear yourself talk sometimes bro. You have a web-series called “Gimme dem points” for fuck’s sake, don’t patronize me regarding Battle Points. I’m merely using them as a point of reference.
Sure, Juri can do alot of things, doesn’t matter when your opponent has 200 ms against you and you can’t even react to a jump in with a cr MP. Tech a throw? Pssh you wish, that ain’t gonna happen you’re going to eat 3 before you finally manage to tech one. You can put pressure on somebody with FSE sure, doesn’t matter when that lag kicks in and your input gets swallowed by the gaping hole that is a packet loss and you eat a DP - FADC - Ultra. Online is ass, but unfortunately that’s all I’ve got except for a guy that play’s Deejay and starts EVERY round with Air slasher.
So why not balance out the bullshit with an overpowered character?
Those weren’t mix-ups he was getting hit by. He was getting hit by simple shit like meaty dive kicks, or whiffed dive kicks followed by meaty c.MP. It wasn’t ambiguous at all. He just wasn’t blocking.
It’s true that it’s hard to be good with Juri. The big “problem” with Juri and Hakan is that not only are they completely unorthodox as Street Fighter characters, they are really complicated to learn to play at a high level. They’re also not designed to be “beginner-friendly” characters that cover for your mistakes like Ryu and Honda do. If you want to win with a character like this, you need to know your shit, and your fundamentals need to be strong as well. Most players either don’t like Juri to begin with or they aren’t willing to put in the effort to figure out all of the details and practice with them. Just look at how much time we’ve been spending in training mode trying to figure out everything about Feng Shui Engine and various other things, and all the effort it takes to actually work that stuff into our game. It’s a monumental task, especially for us 09ers who are trying to work on our fundamentals at the same time. For most other characters, it’s not nearly so involved. I think this is why many players are put under the impression that she is a bad character. However, I am fully convinced that she is not bad, just hard to learn. Anyone who doesn’t want to deal with that is perfectly welcome to try out other characters.
Son, trust me…I know about bad connections. I use wireless because I have no other alternative. But that doesn’t mean you should use bad tactics. Its one thing to have used proper anti airs and failed because you mistimed it.
To be fair…I cant really judge you’re overall skill on one match…but I just calls it like I see’s it. In that match…you should have done a lot better.
Like to hear myself talk? Real shit…I hate talking. I hate being the one to start talking because no one else is. Frankly speaking…I post on these boards to get you cats talking. I check back often to see whats popin with you guys and I respond so damn much just to keep the Juri Hype going. I do a channel not because I need to…but because I have fun doing it. Doing ranked was an idea i’ve been doing since vanilla in which I just fucking played and thought ranked was the way to go. I just started GDP when i figured out how to set up my camera…
Not because I like to hear myself talk…but because I want people to have the best experience they can when watching my bullshit, stutter filled, fat body filling the whole damn screen while my ass pops out and I have to sensor it videos.
But let me done the party right quick. If your connection is so ass, and you have 200ms delay and shit…why the fuck are you showing us a replay of a match. Am I suppose to be proud of you that you beat someone in ranked? What abotu the other guy who was playing and fucking lost to someone who has an ass connection. Are you telling me you lagged hard during that match and You’re basking in your glory and shit?
Really? Come on…You’re seriously trying to argue with me about my advice, and defending you’re poor decisions on how you played the match when you were lagging?! Unless you got a good connection with this guy or something in which your overall argument of lag is shot down.
And didn’t you just say you’re overall ability has gone down from playing locally with some guy? Yet now you’re saying you do fine locally when you play?
Son, My logic vs your logic is seriously 8-2 match up. Moving on…
DocGram, true it looked like he wasnt blocking but the same shit happened to me vs Yun. He just did shit that I just wasnt expecting. I would be blocking left and then all of a sudden he’s on the other side and my block isnt fast enough. Same shit for fei long…jumps in…i block high and then he whiffs an attack and im eating a low attack.
Sorry, im trying to defend him, lol.
I completely agree with you DocGram. I believe she’s a really hard character to learn. You have to know whats safe, whats not safe…when to use this unsafe move, how to make this safe…when to use this normal…who this whiffs against, how to hold fireballs, how to let go of a mid and then a low…hwo to let go of a low and then a mid…how to hold 3 and let go of a mid…how to let go of a fireball without releasing it…how to hit ultra 2 which is a bitch…which super to use…which fuzzy guard works on who…which dive kick to use to go into ultra 2, who can be ultra 2’d from j.mp xx dive kick, when to use ex dive kick in the corner, corner combos, fse combos, what normals whiff vs who under fse, what bnb to use against who…
pants
Seriously…maybe not all of that…but those things come into play when developing a plan of attack!
i posted that vid out of sympathy for Yossan, rather than to mock him/her, didn’t mean to start this all up haha.
Anyway, as for getting people to talk, I don’t post much on this site because, quite frankly, I’m very busy at the moment. I don’t even have time to play SSF4 anymore.
But I disagree with K1, I believe Good-Time and Eish are very good. And a top player did try out Juri, it was Kindevu, and he got nowhere with her. It’s not that easy to be effective with Juri.
And I said it before, and I’ll say it again, Ultra 1 and Ultra 2 should both be learnt. Don’t be picky and only use one, they’re both good.
I saw somewhere in the mess that is Kail’s wall of text about Mashing being effective in FSE, which isnt true i can spare a few details regarding FSE on how to make your strings tighter knit:
- Close and Far mp on hit and block will always put you in the “close” proximity of your opponent.
- If Far.mk comes out, far Hk and Hp will always come out after.
- Blocked overhead isnt a good reversal window at close range, its +2 on block still so doing a close standing light kick makes the gap 1 frame (tightly executed).
- Baiting reversals: Stop your string at cr.mk (after doing about 2 other moves), this is -5/-2, so stopping here allows them to reversal you, it will whiff because they are out of range, hold down back and as soon as you recover from the move (if they dont reversal) do far.mp followed by another 50/50 or you could just do the same technique again.
I just wish 1 top player stayed with her. Just one.
Mashing makes doing overheads not an option, but good call on the far normals. I didn’t know that. I’m assuming it doesn’t work with strong? If I use strong and far strong comes out I should assume far mk will come out?
Juri has to work hard for her damage but it’s not that bad when people get used to her flow. People struggle with fuhajin management but its not a problem once you get a feel for it. People struggle with spacing dives but you get use to it quick.
I feel using ultra 1 and 2 both are important however I do feel In a majority of the matchups what you can do with ultra 2… Fse could do it better. Fse isn’t guaranteed… I know… But neither is u2 really.
Close mk always comes out after close/far mp, cz it always puts you closer, you then cancel off the animation that moved you closer which moves your position forward.
You need to use cr.mp in a distant speciic way if you want far.mk/hk/hp.
Like i said though if youre sure they are mashing do sumin like lk > lp > mp > cr.mk >> stop down back block >> far mp > etc
Lol. I heard a friend of mine mashing in the cabinet next to me but I reacted too late. Lol.
This is something I have to work on. I don’t bait reversals well my gaps are too wide or too short. Will work on this def.
I don’t know why people even feel the need for there to be top players playing Juri to be honest. I play her to because I like the character. Sure, it would be nice to have a godlike player handing out new tricks, but we’ve found some pretty good ones between us too.
U1/U2, I agree with Ryuga, you should learn both in the long run. I personally focus on FSE because that’s more helpful to me in most of the matchups, and because it has much higher utility in my opinion. I guess it just suits my playstyle better.
far.MP to cl.MK is not quite that guaranteed, I think there’s a very tight spacing where far.MP xx far.MK is possible, I was playing with that when trying to build high damage FSE combos (to get far MP,MK,HP,HK chain). Might be character specific though. Not very practical anyway.
I personally bait mashing with cr.LK xx cl.MP, block. Since its the same starter as I use for going to Sekku and cr.MK xx cr.HK, and you stand up so it kinda looks like a Sekku might be coming, it fakes opponents pretty well in my experience. Afterwards you can trap with far.MP xx sekku, or cr.MK,far.MP,cl.HK xx store, etc.
cl.mp is just as good i guess, the problem is that both cr.mk and cl.mp are both in theory punishable by 3 frame reversals. Yet i havnt eaten one so far lol, cr.mk puts me quite a ways away but cl.mp id imagine is worse cz your right in their face.
Ken can’t punish cr.LK, cl.MP, you can block or whiffs outright. You’re right that Ryu can actually punish with HP/EX Shoryuken, I should start using cr.LK,cl.LK,cl.MP on him instead, this can’t be hit by any SRK, although Ryu can still super of course. Or just cr.LK,cl.LK > block.
The trick I think is making the gap as small as you can to maintain pressure buy long enough to not get hit.
I agree, I think you lot sell yourselves far too short lol. Look at how much the Juri forum has found out about the character on its own. Some of you may feel discouraged now, but if you look at all the threads, you’d probably appreciate what you’ve done. All this stuff figured out for a new character, that barely anybody uses anywhere, without much players to look at for inspiration, and laid out the info for future Juri players. I think that’s an achievement.
We all put in work! I feel that if we all came together like the mega-zord we would be unstoppable.
I don’t need a top player. I just hate the view that juri is free. She’s not bad. I just hate that if j Wong used her and bodied people would cock ride.
I just… Love learning new things. I watch matches and study the simplest things. I have a thirst for knowledge. Unfortunately a lot of my shit is emulation without knowledge.
I dunno. I feel like we just need a figure head for respect for our queen. Tired of the disrespect.
i agree with this post.
@Kail ending this conversation on this note: I got a hauppauge 1212 HD PVR for my 26th birthday. It’s going to be used. That’s why the video is uploaded. Putting that $200 my wife spent to use.