And what if, upon seeing Vega flying to the wall, Guile started the FK, just in time to hit Vega out of it? I know, not exactly a high chance, but that way it could explain the stuffing part… If FK has actually enough priority to do so.
I mean, I suppose it’s possible, but super improbable. There’s no way a flash kick would stuff Vega out of his ultra on reaction; it would always have to be anticipated, and that’s IF it can be stuffed at all.
After Vega touches the wall it take one frame to sweep the screen with the pink light of death. Guile has to FK preemptively which is a horrible idea in so many ways.
Also, isn’t Vega invincible DURING the pink light of death as Sanchez put it? I’ve gone through quite a number of attacks, not only projectiles.
yea the dude stuff my ultra, wasn;t on reaction he did the flash kick and i did ultra, he hit my vega out, vegas so bad, can;t take a hit, no cross up moves, wall dive gets stuff by madd moves even on wake up, so why do it, he has like the worst ultra in the game madd unsafe and you can;t even control it, i dunno what capcom was thinking when they made him. his ultra don;t even be coming out, dunno whats up with that neighter.
lol?
Yeah Vega’s got nothing but an uphill climb…sucks…I was getting wrecked by almost every player at the arcades…his wall dives get countered by EVERY character…its retarded…Capcom seriously needs to retool him and update their cabinets. I hope to god they changed him for console release.
Was anyone able to test anything out for him at CES?
I can’t think of anything more pressing for the console version than to fix vega
i will still use him a lot,lol
You guys are making him sound a lot worse than he really is. Nobody kills him but Sagat, he beats a couple of characters, and he goes mostly even or has slight disadvantages against the rest of the cast. This is not at all a big deal.
My thoughts exactly :rock:
The “Low Tier” part is doesn’t really mean shit, some of you guys are overreacting, maybe cause you are used to Vega always being Top or so. If you like the char play him, if you care about tiers pick Sagat.
Still, I think some chars still have some potential yet to be discovered, lets hope of the best. :china:
When you hear low tier, don’t think Q or Kyosuke or Roll or A3 Birdie or whatever. Don’t even think ST Zangief. SF4 Claw is much more competitive in almost all of his matchups than any of those characters.
even though these days all i see are matches where he loses, i still think he looks fun to play, and rewarding if you want to pace out a match and outsmart the other guy, i will definitely give him the ol’ college try XD
I see… These guys are bashing Vega like mad. He can’t be as bad as you guys make him seem. I think I’ll take Ultra’s word for it. I’ve seen some of his matches so think he’s credible.
I want to make something perfectly clear for all of you Vega, and especially non-Vega, players:
The ONLY person who has the right to make ANY assessments about Vega, at this point, is me. I’m not trying to be cocky or arrogant, but the truth is that I have more Vega experience, and know more about his matchups, than all of the US combined.
That being said, allow me to address this whole issue of whining and tier position:
First off, if you haven’t played SF4, you don’t get to whine about anything, and you most certainly don’t have the right to argue with ANYONE who has played the game.
Secondly, Vega IS the worst character in the game, and it IS by a large margin. For you naysayers, consider this:
-Vega loses his mask and claw for no reason, at critical points in the match, handicapping him even further. This means that, when the odds are stacked against you, they’re REALLY stacked against you. Your one consistently reliable normal, cr.str, gets shot to shit, you are put at the lowest health in the game, AND this will always happen if you are on the defensive. ALWAYS!!! 80-90% of the time I lose a round, I’m not wearing my mask. Think about that. 
-Vega has no reliable anti-air. Every anti-air in his arsenal (jump back fierce, jump forward fierce, flip kick, air throw, st. rh) require the opponents jump to be somewhat anticipated, and even then those options will lose out to higher priority jump-ins.
-Vega cannot practically combo his ultra or his super. Ultra’s are a critical aspect of this game, as are supers… to an extent; not having a practical option to combo either one, is the most retarded thing ever. His ultra can’t even be used as a reliable anti air. Other characters who can’t practically combo into their ultra, have a means to use it as an anti air. With Vega, it’s screen position dependent? Are you fucking kidding me?
-Walldiving is a gimmick.
-Vega has no cross up.
-Seeing how bad walldiving, crystal rolls, or scarlet terrors are, there’s almost NO point to hold a charge outside of a combo. What this means, is that Vega has shit for specials. He has the worst specials in the game. Everyone else has a special that they can use consistently, outside of combos. Vega doesn’t. Every single special he performs ALWAYS puts him at a risk, even at the beginning of the round.
-Vega has no reliable wake-up options, outside of backdashing and blocking. So, if you’re pinned in the corner, there’s absolutely NOTHING stopping your opponent from throwing a meaty at you on your wake-up.
-Vega’s inputs are fucking retarded. SF4’s input system is VERY lenient. The system is so lenient, in fact, that regardless of how on point your execution is, you’ll randomly end up throwing out one move, when you meant to use something else. Case in point: Several times I’ve held db to block attacks, then tried to walk forward and use st. rh to poke, only to see Vega perform a rh scarlet terror. Why? Because the system is so lax, that it read my db block as the charge, and when i walked forward a bit and did st. rh, it registered that as just some sloppy input for scarlet terror. This isn’t the only problem. A number of times I’ve went to combo into an EX walldive, and an EX scarlet terror comes out instead. Capcom was smart enough to place those inputs a quarter of a centimeter apart! Thank you, you fucking geniuses!
Thirdly, I’ve come to the conclusion that the only way to effectively play Vega is to rush with him. The problem is that Vega has horrible rushing tools, in comparison to a majority of the SF4 rosterl; this, coupled with everything else stacked against him, is why Vega is not only the worst character in the game, but the worst by a large enough margin for me to bitch and gripe about.
I’ll take your word for it Bebop, but you post confuses the hell out of me. Were you being sarcastic?
Edit: nevermind.
You think Claw has 2 matchups that are 3-7, which are not as bad as Oro’s matchup against Chun Li. You think that other than that Claw has mostly 4-6 and 5-5 matches, which is about the same or better than Oro’s matchup list (Arcadia says he loses to Yun and Ibuki 3-7), and you and I both think he actually beats high tier characters in Zangief and Dhalsim. Oro has some actually good matchups, but those are with the joke, bottom tier portion of the cast, a portion that SF4 just doesn’t have.
I don’t think Claw is substantially worse than Oro, and frankly I think there’s an argument that he’s not as bad as Oro is. You didn’t give up on Oro for whatever reasions, and for the same reasons I don’t think you should give up on Claw.
I like that strat with Oro where you parry into a 50%+ combo. Hot stuff!
I wanna learn Vega, I play him too much like ST. The two things I whored out the most with him in ST, slide and flip kick, suck now. Now I just mash c. strong with him, kinda newbish. I’ll mash RK too sometimes but what else should I be mashing?
You guys are so lucky having a SF4 machine nearby. I don’t even have an arcade within 200 miles of me.
I look foward to using Vega when consoles hit. He should be interesting to play as.
Thanks for the very true write up bebop. I’ve been playing claw as a secondary and have been nearing about 10000bp. nothing fancy. But some things I’ve noticed that make him terrible…
-
Disjointed walldive hitbox.
I get really mad when I’m directly above someone… say ryu… in a corner on their wakeup doing a walldive. I’ll try to go for the izuna and it will get stuffed by a c.mp before I even hit punch. This was a match ender once, and the freeze KO frame was one of the most rediculous i’ve seen in awhile. It had claw up about 3-6 feet above ryu’s head getting hit with a c.mp. Stupid. Izuna drop also seems difficult to land consistently, even with a lot of practice a normal walldive slash will come out more often then not. And, if you play claw you should already know this, but ANY blocked or FA’d walldive, whether it lands in front or behind can be punished with ANY combo starting from the ground. Whereas Fuerte might just get sweeped off a blocked splash, claw will eat dash up fierce xx lk tatsu > srk, or whatever max damage combo a character may have. -
Losing the mask.
IMO you should not be losing your crap when you are FAing fireballs. That’s rediculous. I’ll FA > backdash as an anti-air and suddenly my claw or mask flies behind the op. Just stupid. But in general, claw either needs to have beefer defense and attack power from having his items to start out with or lessen the penalties. -
A GTFO me move / good aa
You can rush down claw for free. He has no good reversal, period. Bebop covered most of this topic already, so I wont beat a dead horse, but he does need something… like maybe give EX walldive startup invincibility? EX roll? Make scarlet terror NOT garbage and FA’able?
Off topic, I played against a 25k-ish ranked sagat the other night. I was in a chip’s amount of health and was waking up in the corner, so he did a meaty EX low tiger shot. I guess if your right up against the wall on wakeup you ultra must get it’s invincibility frames pretty fast, because i tore right through that projectile for the win. =D It was pretty sweet. He then proceeded to win back that lost BP twofold later that night. =(
time will tell how claw does in the future.
i still got my faith tho…
maybe you just gotta play him a bunch different than his ST counterpart