Considering it’s unsafe even on hit, not that effective. Depends on the character I guess, pretty much anyone w/ a dp or command grab can get you easily unless they flinch.
I use it occasionally after knockdowns. Forward throw, lk tatsu can make for a bit of an ambiguous cross up.
Yeah, this is all I use it for currently too… I just looked at the frame data and I didn’t realize it puts you at -5 even on hit. Thats pretty harsh.
A real good use of lk tatsu is when you just stunned someone and the damage is scaled real bad (example if you would do an ultra it would do about a jabs worth of damage) Do something like level 3 focus bnb lk tatsu then kara throw. Works on just about everyone at least once and it makes people stay awake to. :karate:
very helpful info. need to learn some more block strings so I can advance my game.
Since this is a general discussion, I just thought I would share a story about the “Legendary Champion” achievement. Yes, it is a cool story bro.
So I set out today to try and get the achievement for defeating Gouken on hardest difficulty. I set the difficulty to hardest and the rounds to one. I tried a few characters at first, lariat machine gief and ryu- the “good” shoto. Since getting to Gouken requires those certain conditions- two perfects wins and 3 ultra wins (plus at least 5 first attacks), I was having mixed results. With Gief, it is really easy to get perfects, but his ultra is a pain in the ass to grab someone with. With Ryu, it is a pain in the ass to get perfects, but his ultra hits people without even trying.
After messing around for a while with various characters, I just decided to use Ken. Now since the computer throws out all kinds of random stuff, it is problematic to get those perfects with Ken. I did get a perfect here and there, only to be disappointed to see Akuma appear instead of Gouken. On my last run, I was getting robbed. I had my 3 ultras out of the way early on, and plenty of first attacks. It was during my “rival” fight with Rufus that I snagged my first perfect. I rushed that poor bastard down with jumping HP into combos, dodged his ultra twice, tick throws, etc.
Next, my final battle with Seth. I am not exactly sure whether you need a single perfect to unlock Gouken or two… but I laid on the anti-seth techniques enough to score another perfect against him. Finally Gouken shows up. It was a close battle but I punished that CPU for those random ultras, and took it home. For all those kens out there with our crappy fireballs and lower stamina, he can deal some damage in the right situations.
So anyway, it was much more rewarding to get that achievement with my main instead of grinding one of the higher tier characters. We got the tools, we got the talent. 
I am bored and was just thinking about a couple things.
So I have two questions for everyone:
How do you feel about reversals, a.k.a. mashing DP.lp during an opponent’s block string. Do you do it? Does it work for you? I’m wondering if I should start using this or not, it kind of seems like if it works and you can use it to your advantage you should.
EX Focus Canceling normals. I haven’t tested this out yet, but I’m pretty sure it is possible. Does anyone use this (if it is possible) or is it completely worthless?
I do it some times if they’re block string happy. I try not to mash it though.
I mainly use it because I don’t have the muscle memory for OST. I’m also tempted to start using fierce dp if I have the meter for fadc.
I can’t properly comment on this because I don’t use it, but my guess would be that it can serve as another pressuring option. Like, doing a punishable normal (maybe cl.roundhouse?) would throw the opponent off if you fadc it.
In regards to 1…
I was in training mode earlier today looking at how reversal DP’s work, and I set the dummy Ryu to do the block string j.rh - c.lp - c.lp - c.mk xxFB and I noticed that if I block the j.rh - c.lp - c.lp and get a DP.lp in between the c.lp and c.mk, the DP.lp will beat the c.mk. I didn’t know that it could do that.
I try not to mash anything whenever possible, but I will throw a reversal DP in the middle if I see a gap somewhere. The thing to be careful about is being baited to mash out reversals. I’ve actually starting doing this with reversal-happy-ryu players. I will go in and start a block string, stop suddenly and punish the hell out of their mashed out uppercut.
I have been doing that same thing. If I get hit with those mashed reversals I will bait them out. I would like to add reversals to my repertoire, but I think I will have to practice it some more in training mode so I can do it without mashing… I hate mashing.
My guess would be that the start up frames for medium normals is longer than the block stun from the light normals.
Does the term block-string mean just a bunch of consecutive attacks that are blocked, or does it need to combo if the first hit were to hit?
the team block string refers to a series of moves where when the first is blocked the opponent does not have a chance to leave block stun and start any attacks until the last hit of your block string. ken has a 3 hit or 4 (on big guys) hit block string of c.lk c.lp c.lp (s.lp) these are NOT linked, they are chained normals, link timing requires the extra stun of hit stun. which leads me to the other topic at hand:
never do i just mash for dp’s in someones block strings, i ussually try to time fp srk for counter hit on their first swing when i have meter to get a FU after, or fadc to safety. now that being said a TON of people don’t realize that their combo’s =/ block strings. every part of a combo where a link is tried a reversal can be placed because it is NOT a block string. a blocked move gives less stun than a hit, this is why people can just mash out dp and beat your combo… cause they blocked the first hit and it wasn’t a combo at all. so what this means for ken is that we all need to work on hit-confirming with c.lk c.lp (chain them for block-string, if opponent is blocking either lp again to continue block string then kara-throw or stop to bait dp, DON’T FINISH YOUR COMBO!!!)
personally i don’t use this at all and i’m hard-pressed to think of a situation where it would be worth the 2 charges of meter, like maybe if it extends a combo for a couple hundred damage but that’s far-fetched off a normal… meh i use fadc off of the c.mk > hado combo to keep the pressure on and add more damage so who am i to really talk. honestly i think that you just have to pick your spots and when the time is right if you just put that extra bit of pressure people wilt
Ok i need some help and i know its a learn on your own thing.
I can get the FADC ultra as SECOND player side every time even in game pressure. in training i can even do in with eyes closes my feeling for it is pretty good… but FIRST player side… hahaha ya right…
like i can do everything untill the ultra. can someone give me a tip on how they hold their stick i can do everything fine as far as basics and combos down but when i even attempt my FADC my hands work like fucking dinner plates.
In the end: It’s just practice. I only suggest Ryu due to his Fireball speed. You can also use Sagat - his fireballs are quick and you can practice well that way.
So I did some messing around with this today and these are the normals that can be EX focus canceled that I can remember:
c.lp, c.lk, c.mp, c.mk, c.hp, cl.mk, cl.hk. I don’t remember if s.lp, s.mp and s.hp are cancelable but I am assuming they are.
I couldn’t find any real uses for them. I thought maybe you could do cl.hk - FADC - ULTRA, but no. The normals don’t have enough hit stun to cancel them and continue a combo… unlike the c.mk xxFB - FADC - etc. stuff.
Maybe it warrants some more messing around with, I think it could be useful in some way, but I am not really sure how at this point. Why would they put it in the game if it weren’t useful for something?
Cancelling of normals is useful with the correct application and tactic in mind. There are many tactics in the game.
In regards to this - it CAN BE VERY USEFUL to cancel a normal for the intention to get a FA2 on the opponent.
Not to cancel and DASH-OUT. But to continue with a FA attack.
Most people forget the wide applications possible with FA tactics. Too much concentration on FADC.
eg. (opponent in corner)
bnb string ending in FB and then cancel into a FA2/3. You are not trying to COMBO INTO the FA2/3. It’s far better to get the crumple on the opponent and get the following reset and free hit.
It costs 2 bars… but it could lead to damage of 2 seperate combo’s in on one assault.
In summary- we FA2/3 cancel normals or specials to suprise the opponent and potentially open them to another combo.
It feels good to do… and looks badass too!
A way to record this in documentation using our standard coding would be:
[2] J.hk - s.hp xxFB xxFA2DC
some info on the ken taunt combo
FA for the knockdown, dash, taunt, after the 2nd hand motion of the taunt, HP uppercut xx super
works in the corner
451 damage
311 damage mid screen
280 stun.
have fun with that
That is a good idea… I never really look to use it that way, and I have never seen anyone else do that either. A good surprise tactic! Besides, who would know to watch out for a canceled normal into an FA2? I’ve never seen anyone use that tactic. You could punish Ryu uppercut mashing during your block strings with that.
Careful not to spend too much time thinking of “what Ken can do” and spend some time thinking of “what I can do”.
In regards to canceling a normal as oppose to a special into FA2/3. It’s up to you to decide what is best. Normals and Specials leave differing block-stun times… so decide what you want to do now: combo extension, counter or full fa3?
It’s a set-up (something I’ve learned from Ryu).
I’d rather not use it to cancel a normal. If people are mashing DP it would count as a reversal and smash your FA2 out of the ball-park. I do it after FB’s as people don’t do random DP’s after FB’s and they are in a longer block-stun.
I haven’t been around much (learning Ryu) but I just read up about you ‘reversing’ a Ryu combo of c.lp - c.lp ~ c.mk xxFB
The link in that combo is MUCH more difficult to do than with Ken. Ken has a hard time linking c.lp ~ c.hp, right? Well… the reverse is for Ryu. He has to time it perfectly for it to combo.
and if you have blocked his c.lp - c.lp he is at +2f adv. and he is doing a 5f start-up c.mk (ken’s c.mk is 4f start-up). DP+hp (3f start-up) should beat it out all the time with priority.
So yeah - any Ryu’s trying to link a c.mk in a combo better make sure they got their execution down. Same goes with Ken’s trying to c.lp ~ c.hp
i dont know if this has been posted yet but i like this combo.
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