Official discussion thread regarding Game design - what pleases you about ST and HDR

Classic Fighting Games Super Street Fighter II Turbo
101

It doesn’t change the flow of the match. You’re right that it’s essentially a damage buff, but it doesn’t come with new options (like Chun/Boxer/Ryu).

One of the biggest pros is that she can buffer a fireball in front of the stored super. This is a huge, game changing option that makes life very difficult for certain characters (Zangief, Dictator to name two). For example, geif, who can normally lariat Chun’s fireball, cannot lariat once she has her super, as he’ll eat the fireball, the super, and the upkicks afterwards.

At close range, ryu’s super won’t fully hit, and will trade with normals. At ultra close range, his super can whiff entirely. I played a game with XSPR where my Claw walked up and hit his Ryu cleanly through his reversal super (at super close range).

It’s his only real anti air… and a powerful anti air at that, as you get 2 hits + jumping mp afterwards.

I think a lot of people in this thread are saying stuff like “How can XXX super be only average? It’s great in situation YYY”.

Nobody is saying supers aren’t good. All supers are good to some extent (except maybe Blanka’s :)). It’s just a question of how good are they relative to other supers?

In general I would say look at the classes of supers:
Horizontal supers: Balrog, Ryu, Honda, Dic, DeeJay, Fei, Blanka, Chun
Grapple supers: Hawk, Claw, Gief
Combo supers: Ken, Cammy, Sagat, Guile

Horizontal supers in general are the best class of super. They can go through projectiles, are generally safe on block, and can be used as anti air. New positional options are opened up by having this super. Balrog and Ryu are far ahead the best in class here, with Chun leading the rest of the pack in third place.

Grapple supers have the distinction of not being able to miss. This strong point is offset by the fact that they don’t really open up any new gameplay options for the character. This is the second best class of super, I think.

Combo supers in general need to be comboed to be useful. A miss with one of these can mean eating big damage or a round loss. Their main use is as a high damage reversal option, or as a damage bonus in combos. These are the worst supers.

Dhalsim’s super doesn’t really fit any of these classes imho. If I had to put it somewhere, I’d treat it as a horizontal super with very short reach (similar to Fei’s).

102

Interesting discussion… at the risk of splitting more hairs I’ll weigh in with my rankings of supers:

Boxer- huge big area of red, fast, mixes up speed eg after TAP, and control attacks during it… nothing bad at all, any “weakness” is ridiculously risky esp for timing required… simply getting around/over/avoiding it is an accomplishment. Boxer is good enough but even more risky to face with his meter fully charged. It’s one big fat “–rwahh!!” in between a regular r and a wahh.

Fei Long/Chun/Ryu - a cut above the rest below

T.Hawk,
Vega (claw)- with all of his options, hardly needs it.
Zangief
Dhalsim - I’d say mostly OFFENSE for sim to use his super, e.g. to catch up when behind in life a lot and the time’s ticking down. That doesn’t put him above everyone else, just on par since the supers are all pretty good. It cannot be done as a reversal. It’s true that at close ranges, Dhalsim’s beats Ryu’s but that’s only when they happen at the exact same time (or one of them overcame super-freeze somehow).
Bison (dictator) - like Fei’s it can really help him out a lot, get him out of corner/tight spots and his only option of a wake-up attack
Blanka- one you can control after starting it like boxer’s, it has follow-up potential like Chun’s upkicks, and it’s also fast.

Cammy
Guile
Ken - can’t be done as reversal but he has normal DP
DeeJay - one of those where his normals are often better options than his super (like claw)
Sagat - it’s ok, just, not very… Horizontal. can’t be done as reversal, but he has DP move

Honda - definitely the WORST super in the entire game. Almost completely useless. I’d say Blanka’s is significantly better. 4 hits MAX, 2 of which you have to get lucky to ever see in a real game, Honda can get hit out of it not only if they block the first hit but even if they GET HIT by the first hit! the best thing I can say about it is that it kinda goes through projectiles. sometimes.

103

The problem with that is you’re almost always gonna get 3 hits out of it at most unless it’s a point blank punish. I think it’s better suited for going through fbs even though you’ll get weak damage and will only land 1-3 hits. It can also help you get out of the corner.

I wish it could be used as a reversal. Too many times have I been knocked down with a sliver of vitality left with no chance to win cause I can’t escape headbutt or dp chip damage :frowning: .