Well, Wiz has spoken and I’m pretty sure that’s the end of the discussion here. EVO is obviously banning them and no tournament worth their salt will run them too.
Off course, you guys are free to keep arguing, just don’t expect anything to happen.
No…the rule stays the same no matter how many character there are. There is no reason to believe that 5 characters is a legit reason to ban Xbox 360 verison of the game.
Evo is an international tournament that personally invites international players.
Why should Japanese players be forced to buy a console for a good 20,000 for matchup experience when 360 players are going to be given that exact privilege?
Care to take a guess why?
Also why should I care about the waves of Xbox LIVE warriors who got knocked out in the first few rounds compared to the amount of international players we see in top places in all international majors now?
Unless Arcade players are the only people being shafted.
They’re only Arcade players after all they don’t matter.
OMG why are Arcades in the US dying?
I call trolling. No one is this stupid.
Yeah he’s obviously trolling, he uses SFIV Vanilla as an example @ Evo which had 2 Japanese players, he now compares that to the waves (10!!!) of players we see now… oh wait it’s no longer Vanilla, example failed.
No one is this stupid.
>Call out hypocrisy
>TROLLLLLL
Stay fresh.
Also, west, I don’t think you get my point, seeing 10 international players that can get to top 8, rather than 2, should be just as important to tournament integrity as keeping an even playing field for the waves of Xbox online players who get knocked out in the first few rounds, and the few that get to top 8.
minority=rules don’t matter, you heard it here first
I think you misunderstood my intentions, I was not defending this specific case of console exclusives. Instead I was asking what does it takes for a console to become tournament standard? Is it here at 5 joke characters or do we wait for 10 legitimate characters. I used an extreme example to help illustrate how it isn’t reasonable to fall back on “console exclusives are always banned” and not at least examine each game individually. Yes, I am sad that Cole and Megaman will never see tournament play but right now the cost of making PS3 the tournaments standard far outweighs the benefits.
Trying to have a legitimate civil discussion with Negative?
Troll!
You don’t get it, you’re trying to compare this to Evo 2k9 and how the Japanese players where disadvantaged.
There was 2 players disadvantaged and one of them Dan fell to Sanford Kelly’s Cammy, Daigo had no such issues.
Because you’re some stupid PS3 fanboy you can’t see why it would be suicidal for a tournament organizer to ignore the more used console to placate ps3 users. Comparing 2 players to 60-70% of the playerbase is stupid as fuck, and your example of waves and 10+ players is meaningless, the Japanese haven’t been at this disadvantage since Super came out in 2010. And again XBL is the preferred platform for Japanese SFIV players even though PS3 is dominant as fuck in Japan compared to the 360. What system did Gods Garden Online use? What system is the current Topanga league using? Which system has more top player replays online? It’s not going to change for SFXTK.
Your example sucks and hasn’t been an issue for over 2 years now, you can call hypocrisy all you want but you have to be dumb as fuck not to see that 2 players (or 1 if you want to use Seasons Beating 2009 as an example) means as much as 60%+ of your crowd.
No, you are completely wrong in this regard. I lived in Japan shortly during 2010. What you just said couldn’t be further from the truth.
Yes, but think about why that happened, international arcade players do not want to attend a tournament where they have such a disadvantage, 2k9 was devoid of a lot of talent for that very reason
>He doesn’t know I’ve only had a PS3 for like 3 months because I wanted to play Demon’s Souls
Nice job pulling out a rationalization, though.
Minority=rules don’t matter
I understand that Tournament organizers give hundreds of horrible players priority over top 8 international players, that doesn’t mean that the banning issue isn’t full of hypocrisy.
And who rectified this issue?
Was it tournament organizers?
Of course not, Arcade players had to RALLY to persuade Capcom to rectify the issue and release AE, and after that they were lucky that we got console AE, and the 2012 update on both console and Arcade.
Again misunderstanding my point, I do not have any right, nor is it logical, to shaft the large handful of good Xbox players into buying a PS3, or playing with matchup disadvantage.
I used this thread to express my disdain that the very same thing was done to the large handful of good Arcade players, and that if it happens again I’ll be calling anyone out on it if they try and rationalize it with “It’s X characters why would they ban that much” like I heard a number of times upon SFIV console’s release.
Minority=rules don’t matter
Your “2 player” rebuttal is in itself proving my point, there were 2 good arcade players at Evo 2k9.
Just sit there and think for a minute: "Why was that"
Even a Neanderthal would eventually get my point springing into his head after a good 10 minutes, I’ll estimate about 20 for you.
Hmm, it’s been 25 minutes, guess I was wrong
2010?
Of course, many Japanese players went out and bought consoles during that year because they knew that they were being assdevastated by Capcom and tourney organizers and had to adjust, just as Daigo started playing Super on his friend’s XBL account.
My point was that most notably in 2009 the lack of character banning led to a lack of international competition, which in itself led to fairly mediocre competition in general.
Can we ban console-exclusive input lag instead? This relates to every character in the game and not just 3 of the 40+ characters (not counting joke cats). As the game is running on the SF4 engine with no tweaks to the way hitstun, hitstop, bounces, etc are handled, it’s a rather safe bet that PS3 will have the extra 2F of lag that comes with the SF4 engine running on PS3.
At EB Expo I found the game notably more swiftly responsive than SFIV on PS3.
Whether that’s lack of Input lag, engine differences, or just my apparent Sony Fanboy goggles is yet to be seen, so take it how you will.
I think the lack of international competition stemmed from the game not having much exposure outside of Japan. Now we have people traveling from Canada, Europe, and Japan to the US, and Daigo’s even been to fucking Kuwait of all places to play SF4.
As a TO, you have to make good decisions that benefit as many players as possible. Even though a particular tournament may have PS3 players as the majority, banning characters that aren’t on the 360 version is something that has to happen for the good of the community. Thankfully MrWiz understands this.
Extreme cases like Japan coming to the US for EVO 2009 were different–this is a console tournament and they had the console release before we did over there. Daigo played online just like a lot of us did, and had the console-only characters available to him just as we did.
Hence why he won.
My point isn’t Daigo, it’s the amount of Japanese Arcade players that have come to Evo since then, because of AE and AE console finally having international neutrality at the time of the tournament.
Just having Fuudo (Let alone Kindevu and Tokido) at Evo2011 was far more important for competition than the amount of Xbox only players that wouldn’t have entered if there was 1 character they couldn’t practice against online.
With that said, both the wave of Xbox players and the high level Japanese players should both be treated equally, it isn’t fair to give the Xbox players a choice like that, let alone people like Wolfkrone and Gamerbee, but it’s also not fair, and not in a competitive interest to give Japanese Arcade players the same choice, even if it was fixed by capcom more than 2 years later.
Those players all play online. Are you not aware of the godsgarden online series?
Did that even exist in 2009?
I’m willing to admit I know nothing.
Right now I’d only like to hear from frequent tournament goers or organizers. The rest of us (even me) don’t know squat about diddly about all the logistics and junk. Still keeping up with this, its a good read and its interesting to read.
One thing a clueless guy like me can add is: its pretty much guaranteed MegaMan and Pacman will be DLC for 360. Will they be mandatory to have on all 360s?
This is the only one you need.
Wiz is obviously speaking for the whole EVO tournament committee here and every major that’s part of the Championship Series at this point will abide by their decision.
Fuck this poll. Fuck those exclusive characters. This shouldn’t even be an issue to begin with. Why are we even debating this?