This is the thing about Wolverine vs Nova. If Nova can create space, then Nova is in a great spot. But getting there is what’s hard. If he sees you about to put a pulse he can Berserker Slash you during its startup. It’s very difficult to get him off you. You’ll end up blocking way more mixups. Not to mention Divekick stuffs everything. If you manage to escape and create space then you can FINALLY force him to block and mix him up without putting yourself at a huge risk.
I really think this is one of those things where you just haven’t fought a competent Wolverine. There’s a big difference between a Wolverine at NoelBrown/PRRog/Angelic lvl and your average Joe in the Midwest…
Wolverine beats Nova, even if it’s slightly. It isn’t as bad as Spencer IMO, but it’s not in Nova’s favor. IMO.
In case anyone was wondering how to better play the Hulk matchup (I was), Nemo makes it look easy vs. Kaneblueriver in this set. I think Kane has the best Hulk in the business so this is reassuring.
I thought Nemo was sweating against Kane. He is at a massive disadvantage if neither Nova or Strange dies. As much as people don’t like Kane’s team, its a scary team to play against. Since no matter how much of a struggle, ugly and scrubby it might be for Hulk to hits you, if he does, you will die and might lose the whole game without having to play.
Your mentality/arguments regarding the matchup are the problem, not what the characters can and cannot do. You don’t want to create space and put barriers of entry to “finally force him to block and mix him up” you want to create space and put up barriers of entry to…put up more barriers of entry. Deny Wolverine his options, then explore options to punish when he uses his limited approach. If it’s not there, keep denying and wait until the opportunity arrives. Approach with an assist and a mixup after a pulse is up, and if it doesn’t work, put the pulse back up. Don’t keep applying pressure, because if he blocks it he’s going to put you exactly in the spot he wants to be again when you didn’t have to put yourself in that situation in the first place.
Let’s use one of your own matches for a reference. You cite Nova’s struggle to create space. Note the start of the round opening situation. Every single round, PR Balrog gives you space. First two matches you’re walking forward, then attempting to apply your own pressure. You get smacked for it. Third match you take the space he gives, then dash right into his Standing H and get crossed up by his Berserker slash. Even beyond the opening gauntlet (since Rog didn’t kill on the initial touches), you’re not looking to get away, you’re looking for opportunities to mix him up. You’re playing Wolverine’s game, not Nova’s.
Despite the metric shitton of Wolverines in this tournament, Yipes isn’t the greatest example of approaching the matchup. He tries to put up the pulse a few times, but a few of them get bopped by Berserker slash because they were poorly timed. And the few pulses he puts up against Wolverine he doesn’t really commit to. But the right mentality can be seen in how he treats PR Rog’s Doom in Grand Finals. When he gets the hole, he puts up a pulse. Chucks the javelins, and uses hits assists to lockdown. Overrides the pulse while being covered by either his own javelin or Bolts before the previous pulse expires. Waits until he gets the right spacing to apply pressure with bolts (relatively) safely, then goes in. Beautiful. And yes, doom on point versus wolverine supplemented by plasma beam are not the same thing. But the effective levels of durability are there since wolverine has no projectiles. Pulse takes care of his assist, your assist takes care of Wolverine. Isn’t always that clean cut (the smarter wolverines will block the pulse so the assist gets through), but even in those situations you still have options because the point character is blocking and Nova + his assists have options for dealing with beams. At least they should anyways.
I treat this matchup the way I would if I actually encountered a slobbering, rabid, pissed off wolverine with metal claws; I’m getting the hell away from it. Yes, he has tools to help him rush and get in; he needs them. And just because to me the matchup is in Nova’s favor doesn’t mean he crushes him; Wolverine can still apply initial pressure, potentially overcome your defense with smart assist usage, and with bad use of Nova’s tools you can easily get bopped and killed for it. The matchup is by no means free. But from what I’ve seen, from what I know, and even what I’ve experienced (I’ve played Wolverines outside the Midwest thank you) I don’t see it being in Wolverine’s favor.
My match with Rog isn’t the best example. I still was learning the matchup unfortunately and was too scared of Plasma Beam. Also, I kept dropping shit. I don’t know if it was PS3 or nerves or whatever. The last match where I get bopped I was trying to do my plink method of escaping the opening gambit and got a st.H. Which resulted in me getting hit. I tried to analyze his tendencies at the start and noticed he didn’t do anything at the start of the first round so I thought I’d force him to block. If you look at my match vs Angelic at FR, that’s pretty much how I play the matchup. Same with vs Noel Brown.
Also, Yipes had bolts vs PR Rog. Bolts neutralize Plasma Beam and give you time to setup shop. I unfortunately don’t have that luxury when I play Dante. You can mention all you like how it’s in Nova’s favor or whatever, but if the Wolverine is on point. He’s going to mix you up about 3 times as many times as you’re getting to mix up him.
Pulsing is definitely how you play the matchup, but regardless of what you say. I still don’t agree. Grav Pulse has a whopping 26 frames of startup. You know how fast Berserker Slash H is? 22 Frames. That means that just by you putting a pulse up you’re putting yourself at risk. What if he’s already in your face and jumping into the pulses and using Plasma Beam to lock you down?
Learning the plink method to escape the opening has the helped the MOST in the matchup, but it’s still in Wolvie’s favor. Again, this is my opinion. I think Wolvie wins.
It’s not as bad as Spencer. But Wolvie wins IF he plays it right.
Also, Nova RAPES Doom. Doom has no mobility to deal with the pulse properly once you set up shop. The only option he has is to lvl 3 you if he gets in range. Shooting a plasma beam will get him speed tackled. Doom can only fight Nova if he has drones or something similar to deal with the Pulses.
Does anyone have any tips on how to fight Ghost Rider? I really struggle fighting one even though I have a lot of experience against it because my closest training partner mains him. Thing is, he has Dormammu (dark hole) and Shuma Gorath (Mystic Ray) behind him which is actually pretty strong, and I have no beam or real full screen presence aside from energy javelins, so I have a really tough time approaching him safely. I’ve tried laming him out but I’m not patient enough to do effectively and besides my team is built around going in because god forbid I get level 1 Frank against that team, he has to make a HUGE mistake for me to get close to him, let alone get a hit to level up. Even as level 4/5 I sometimes struggle against him, Ghost Rider is a tough one for someone who has no beams or teleports, or so I find. Can anyone with experience help me on this? Thanks!
I still struggle with the Zero match, does anyone have footage of good Novas successfully fighting good Zeros? I just feel like the match has this natural swing to it, where whenever he has buster charge, i have to respect him, when he doesn’t, i can go in or try to set up shop with pulse and javelins. However it seems like when that swing is in his favour he gets to do whatever he wants, where as when i get my shot i can’t capitalise well enough.
Zero pretty much never wants to be on the ground, but i don’t really want to be in the air with him, since he’ll pretty much blow up my air movement with buster or lightning. But if i stay on the ground i can’t really take control with st.L because pizza cutter beats me clean, not to mention if i do get a st.L, because of Zero’s stupid slow falling speed i have to chain at least 3 or 4 of them to get to him to a decent launch height and fuck up my damage.
I’ve tried playing ultra respectful and lame, and i’ve tried going rabid but nothing really seems to work, right now i’m playing the back and forth method above and that’s working out the best but i still feel like i lose to inferior players in this match.
Zero matchup sucks man…but it sucks for EVERYONE and luckily most Zero’s like to go in. Which gives you a chance to j.H them in the face.
Zero’s that play like Flocker are MUCH MUCH more difficult (as in they play lame…)
If you play Doom and he doesn’t have a horizontal assist you can surprisingly zone him very well. You need to keep putting pulses up until you have a red life one out with a normal one. All while calling plasma beam. After that, just try and control the neutral. He will waste Buster trying to stop your zoning. That’s when you attack. If he throws a hadangeki and he doesn’t have meter to sougenmu or it’s already active, that’s a j.H/speedtackle he’s going to get bodied with.
Bait the hadangeki, don’t try to punish his normals if he has buster, punish bad buster lightnings, force him to block…Also, try to be careful of bad box dashes, he can pizza slicer/buster that for free.
J.H/Centrushes are the key to the matchup.
Also, if you’re on the ground and you’re close to him…you can force him to block with Grav Pulse L/M + assist. Grav Pulse (especially with a little red life) will eat through whatever he throws at you(EVEN BUSTER), so you if you call it with an assist the assist will hit him and you’ll get a full combo and a potential happy bday.
A big part of the matchup is understanding what your opponent intends to do with the character; learning the matchup gets compounded by the fact that there’s many ways to successfully play Zero. He can zone. He can play air footsies/space control. He can rush/mixup/frame trap. If you’re trying to zone him out when he’s staying grounded with busters + hedangakis, you’ll lose that fight. If you’re trying to rush and/or use air normals when he’s safely using raikousen/buster cancels to control space, you’ll like lose that too. Etc etc etc.
Spend time figuring out what his plan is, then try to counter the style. Zoning works well against Zero teams without projectiles if he’s trying to air footsie. Just be mindful that buster still goes through pulse (which isn’t the end of the world because most Zero’s can’t handle the space control if you block the buster). If he wants to zone on the ground, take to the air and get in his face. If he’s trying to apply pressure, look for chances to ADD l in neutral/near neutral situations; using L button to hold buster makes it difficult for you to be trip guarded. It’s a matchup where you’re forced to be more reactive than proactive.
So a while ago someone posted about Tron giving them trouble, and I kind of blew them off because of my big head after going even with Abegen, but after playing the matchup a bit more I can see how Tron can give Nova trouble. I still think it’s 5/5 but anyhow…
Tron’s air normals are ridiculous. There’s no point in putting up a shield to keep her out because air H and S completely blow through it like it’s not there. If you need to nullify an assist it’s great but otherwise she just doesn’t give a fuck about it. j.S even nullifies Energy Javelin, which makes no sense to me. I don’t think I’m the only one who’d find someone pressing buttons at super jump height against Energy Javelin to be scrubby, but it ended up looking like a good call when this guy did it. I feel like s.L is Nova’s best option against her, but you still have to bait out assist-less ADF j.H’s at the right time, otherwise you’re gonna get hit. Plasma Beam does give her a lot of trouble, and she’s also pringles to instant overheads. Most annoying thing is probably the fact that she not only can escape my reset situations either because of her bizarre hitbox or the j.S nullification thing, but she also falls out of combos regularly. And still has 1.2 mil.
Been playing the point Spencer matchup a bit more lately. I know someone might have mentioned this before, but against most Spencers you just have to bait Bionic Arm and counter XF if necessary. If the team is front-loaded this is always a good option (I have a friend who plays Spencer/Storm/Doom, and I’m really not that afraid of Storm/Doom with or without XF), but if the shell is something like Doom/Ammy it’s just a necessary sacrifice. I think once the playing field is neutral in terms of meter and XF, it becomes almost in Nova’s favor since Spencer is so punishable without meter, though he still has to build space first and assists obviously shift things.
Anyway we should work on making a consensus guide at some point, together I think we all have matchup knowledge against every character and we can include brief synopses, what kind of assists help, match videos, etc.
I honestly think that Cent Rush H might be the key to a lot of the Spencer matchup. Bionic Arm? Fuck you, Super Armor. Grapple in my face? Fuck you, projectile immune. Just stay in a nice range and punish missed grapples with Cent Rush H, which’ll eat Bionic Arm and keep on going. That’s what I’ve been trying recently, and I’ve actually been getting a lot of use out of it.
I really doubt that’s viable, the amount of frames Cent Rush has Super Armor for is extremely limited and halfway through the animation anyway so it’s not like you can do it in reaction to much with its very slow start-up. Besides, grapples ignore armor anyway, they just grab you.
I have been having some trouble with online haggars and chris. i find it hard to get in on chris due to him having haggar assist, or doom missles and mines. and when ever i try to zone magnum blows completly through H Pulse. i currently rock nova with plasma beam and dealing with this is beyond annoying. Any tips for this?
Who are some of the particularly relevant characters that Nova has advantage against, iyo (by relevant, I mean I’m more interested to hear we beat doom than that we beat spiderman)? Marvelo explains away doom pretty well above, and I recall a great anti skrull explanation earlier in the thread.
There’s just so much focus on problem matchups, which is good to discuss obv, but there may be winning matchups people are struggling with because they don’t know they’re winning or why.
Just curious, I just really love to read all of your theorizing and thought id attempt to prompt some.
Nova beats Doom clean, Pulse, Javelin if he’s in the air, dash in jab, dash out if he’s on the ground. He can’t approach, you’ll snag him out the air and eat his photons with the shield, and the jabs will clip the startup of all his unsafe movement.
Unfortunately for Nova, he loses or goes even with pretty all the top tier point characters, maybe he has a slight advantage over Magneto.
I’ve been thinking about the matchups I’m bad against the last couple days and I realized that Doom beam assist gives me a ton of trouble.
As a Nova Strider player I do really terribly against both Wolverine beam and Nova beam. Against most other point characters I like to put up a Grav Pulse H to eat the durability of the beam but I don’t feel like I have that liberty with these two characters since they can both punish the startup of Grav Pulse H from quite a distance. Punishing Doom himself is difficult too since Nova’s only option is beam super. Also most good players have been punishing my Strider calls lately which has made the situation even worse.
I don’t want to have to switch assists or teams quite yet, but I’m almost to the point where I feel like I don’t have a choice anymore
