Wtf, how’d all these posts get up here? Lol. This new design bullshit<div><br></div><div>EDIT: Wont let me delete them (sigh) …my bad my peeps</div>
<blockquote class=“Quote”>
<div class=“QuoteAuthor”><a href="/profile/29562/DEK09">DEK09</a> said:</div>
<div class=“QuoteText”>Wtf, how’d all these posts get up here? Lol. This new design bullshit</div>
</blockquote>
lol, that’s what i was talking about with you “getting your point across.”<br>yeah, i’ve learned not to guess with kongo against pressure, the odds aren’t in your favor.<br>ex is for pressure relief.<br>i aa with ex quite a bit too.<br>i hate it when i get jump hit through my hp.kongo.<br>
Lol yeah safe jumps mess with our kongo. Safe jumps you normally have to use mp kongo. I know Ryu has a built in safe jump to where he can jump immediately after sweep and its a 4 frame safe jump. You have to mp kongo that. Characters that has super active crossup normals like Gen and Deejay…same deal. I never use ex kongo. We need meter badly and I’ve become about an 85% good guesser at high or low on my wake whenever I choose to use kongo. Me personally, I would much rather save ex for flip. I’ve been learning to use it more though because there has been times where I went low and the opponent went mid and I get combo’d. Then I reflect like “I shoulda just used ex there” lol. <div><br></div><div>What alot of people dont realize is that Kongo has recovery, and a bit of a bad one too. The thing is that the move obviously activates when you hit it so no one tries to hit you. But if Im not mistaken kongo has something like 18 frames of recovery. </div>
THIS DESIGN IS A PAIN IN MY ASSHOLE. ANBODY GONNA BE ON TONIGHT ON XBL?
Great tips DEK09, i’ll be working on my matchups more, thanks a lot!
<blockquote class=“Quote”>
<div class=“QuoteAuthor”><a href="/profile/45438/SUNSUNMCNASTY">SUNSUNMCNASTY</a> said:</div>
<div class=“QuoteText”>THIS DESIGN IS A PAIN IN MY ASSHOLE. ANBODY GONNA BE ON TONIGHT ON XBL? </div>
</blockquote>
I agree, there are a ton of other forum dbs and designs that work great and don’t look like shit. This one isn’t one of those.
I find myself to be threatened at about 1-2 character spaces from my opponent, but I can’t just keep walking back and I believe there are things I can do in this range to keep them from advancing on me, but at the same time using moves that won’t get blown up from fast moving punishes. The above video is me being blown up by a Cody who makes good calls on my pattern play. What can I be doing outside st.hk range? I could fireball from time to time, but this can be reacted to.
You need to work on your own spacing more and pay attention to his patterns. This is a tough match because Cody’s jump ins are hard to AA for Gouken, they just seem to get through more often and he jumps fast. Kongo him a few times and he’ll start empty jumping. Then you can AA better with fp. He often hit confirms with 2 cr.jabs and if you blocked he uses st.mp to get close again. That st.mp is not safe for him and can be countered. I try not to be in the zone you are getting destroyed in because of his speed at getting in and his armor break kick that moves him in (at least I think it’s armor breaking). He has to come to you, so make him work for it. Don’t get to that distance you don’t like and then just sit there guessing buttons. Bring the fight to him with dash in/flip in/command dive OR get away fast. Don’t be afraid to take a throw if he’s frame trapping you while you are teching. Bingo…well, I hate that move. If you see it coming, neutral jump and grab as he goes behind you. You used a lot of med. hado and I think hp. hado and lp hado are really the only ones worth using here. If you knock him down…flip pressure and prepare for ex bingo. As far as normals at that distance, st.lk is fast and you recover quick enough to ex tatsu if he jumps on reaction.
Got one for you guys. I remember back then in Super before AE (I used to use Gouken way back then, but then dropped him), it was possible to do hp palm and get a Denjin on them before they hit the ground (without FADC). I used to be able to do it super easily.
Now about 9 out of 10 times, I keep getting EX flip. It’s not because I hit the kicks on down-forward either. Sometimes I get ultra when they reach the apex of their spinning flight and sometimes I get the flip if it was just a tad later so I don’t feel like I inputted them too early or anything. It’s like there’s a window that won’t accept an input for ultra. What’s going on here?
Also, are there any differences in their flight when I used different strength palms (other than EX)? In other words, is it particularly easier to land ultra after a lp palm or a mp palm for instance? In the corner?
If I did a mid-screen Palm and tried a (now full-screen) ultra at the highest fireball speed, would the fireball make it? What if I catch them in the air with a hp fireball > HP Palm and then did Ultra?
Well for starters you can only Denjin after a palm in the corner. The only way to do it midscreen is to fadc. A set up thats awesome as well is if you’re about 70% of the stage left or right you can kongo fadc mp/hp palm (which they will end up in the corner) and then Denjin. The thing is each strength of palm travels farther and thats where you are having issues. You need to go into training and test. Take you and the dummy into the corner, do each level of palm and then try and Ultra afterwards, you’re gonna find that the higher you go up in strength the shorter the window is for you to ultra. Me personally, I would strictly use mp palm if you need to travel distances like that kongo setup I mentioned above. If you’re in the corner I would strictly use lp palm as you have almost forever to land it, with only using mp palm if it will put them over the stun limit. Especially with online. If you’re getting flip its because you’re doing it too early and the game is only reading a portion of your input. So all in all stick with lp and mp palm as the window for ultra is moderate and not tight like hp. Mp and hp do the same amount of stun in 200…the only difference is 10 damage which is nothing.
Okay. Thanks, Dek.
I can’t seem to figure out Denjin Hadokuen. So mashing directions during the animation increases its speed, so it let’s you charge it for like a second after ex palm for more damage. I can’t figure out a way to consistently judge charge time though. The most damage i can get off demon flip kick > mp >cr.hp ex palm into u2 mid screen is 494, maybe someone else can confirm this is the best damage you can get?
start denjin at the height of your opponent’s launch then rotate stick or whatever like crazy and release once they get to head/shoulder height and release. that’s how i do it. should get 5 hits out of it
Alright 5 hits is what I get as well. Do you know if/how you can juggle after ex palm into denjin?
And when you do a corner palm denjin combo, do you have time to charge it at all?
If i hit ex palm in the corner i cant seem to denjin consistently. What i do is follow the ex palm with hp hado, lp hado, lp palm, no charge denjin hado.
The way you’re doing it is the easiest way to hit it actually. Maybe you should just do mp hado, lp palm and then Dejin. A second hado doesnt add much of nothing with all of the scaling anyway. Or sometimes I dont do any hados at all and just charger the hell out of Dejin, it nets you the same amount or more stun I believe (dont quote me on that).
Thats just one of those things you have to practice…you have to buffer Denjin during the palm…
I also think after you hit them that many times Denjins not that effective bc of damage scaling… But I guess it depends on the scenario… Usually less is more when it comes to Denjin… It doesnt do a lot of damage uncharged and with damage scaling you sacrifice a lot of stun… Not to mention scaling what little damage it does as well.
Most times in the corner if won’t kill them, you want to Denjin them early or juggle the shit out of them and reset them or end with a hard knock down so their next mistake you can dizzy them with Denjin or dizzy them and land full Denjin on them.
if you don’t land ultra raw it automatically scales 20%… First 2 hits 100% > 80% > 70%> 60%> 50% > 40% …etc…
So where ever you fall at in that combo scheme take 20% off and thats how much Denjin would be worth…
Also if you take away one of those hados (50 damage) you can pop them higher up into the air when you palm them to get more time to get Denjin off… And youll have better damage and increased time to Ultra comfortably.
I think i misphrased. Thing is, when i ex palm in the corner and denjin without followup, i tend to miss the guy when he’s falling down, so to do it more consistently i hado , lp palm, denjin to hit it more consistently. Good tips though guys thanks 
If you’re in the corner, you don’t really need to wind up its speed since it’ll hit as soon as Gouken lets go. You can crank it about 2 or 3 rotations, if it helps with your timing.
Thing is that with mid screen ultra, you have to let go earlier to give time for the fireball to reach your opponent. In the corner, that time needed to travel distance doesn’t really exist so there’s no need to make such accommodations and that might be the reason why the timing throws you off.
Oh ok, yeah thats just you practicing it. It has 13 frames of startup so you have to take that into account.