Need some good and deep Strider/Doom Info

Classic Fighting Games Marvel VS Capcom 2
81

im not sure I understand all of that, which leads me to a question about re calling orbs as fast as possible.

what are the rules to calling another set of orbs out as fast as possible after the last orbs’ meter runs out?

Is this there a certain set or amount of actions like two dogs or a dog and a teleport which allows the orbs to be called as quickly as possible after the last orb meter runs out?

so far the quickest way i can make this happen is to jump back while doom is covering the last set of orbs, throw one dog at a specific timing and xx into orbs while they are in bloc stun. I jump back because it seems to only work that quick when i am not right next to the opponent.

I have tried other ways to re-orb a soon as possible and to stay close same time like calling a dog and teleporting above them, land and activate, which works sometimes, but then im not sure whether the two actions actually reset the ability to call orbs quicker or not.

do i have it all wrong?

82

Just a really really basic explanation:

after your ouro runs out the two machines that shoot the rings have to walk off of the screen before you can reactivate. There are ways that you can manipulate this, the most obvious one being positioning Strider so that he’s on the short side of the screen during your re-orb so that the machines have less distance to cover. Once they are gone, you can activate again. that’s the gist of it in simple terms.

re-orb time isn’t measured or defined by actions, persay. Rather, the actions make up the attack sequence and fill up the time that you need for the machines to leave. as well as keep your opponent in blockstun. Since you always won’t be trapping on the same part of the screen, you gotta be able to adjust these actions and choose the best ones to fill the time. There’s a lot more to it but I think that’s the best way I can explain it in a way that won’t leave you scratching your head.

Although! There are ways to use certain strider actions at certain times to get a re-orb even though both machines have not left the screen or speed up the reorb. But that is a post for another time, and probably better explained by someone else should the time come where you want to know :tup:

Clockw0rk had a beastly post about going from ouro to ouro, among other things. It was deleted in the old thread, but PM me if you want it, I have a saved copy somewhere on my computer.

I hope this helps!

83

well said w\o over complicating it. Looks like you learned quite a bit locdown.

There is no set pattern to a reorb. What you want to do is use normals+ specials to make up for your walk off time and allows him to reactivate aka reorb. This varies upon which setups you use and how far they have to walk off which can be manipulated heavily. There’s a lot of factors that go into which one to do. You really gotta figure them all out until you realize what works from where and use the proper one given the situation. Its not about what buttons. Its about using his normals + specials to make up for the walk off time. The less walk off time you create, the less you have to attack to reorb and makes your trap that much tighter and this is just a brief explanation of strider’s trap.

It actually gets much deeper when you start to implement split orb setups, variable walk off timing and screen freeze activation tricks. They all add some type of extra dimension to strider’s ability to trap.

The way I do my traps is that I like to vary guard cancel timing on every trap so no 2 are exactly alike back 2 back. I do use the same patterns but I rarely do the same pattern back to back. This prevents people from only disecting 1 pattern and think thats all there is to the trap. By having a firm understanding of the basic concepts, I can create different guard cancel holes and keeps my opponents guessing on when they will be released. His trap gets crazy deep. When someone can’t figure out where to push block, they start to panic and push block wrong. Thats when its much easier to actually to trap someone. Its when your opponent realizes which trap is coming and push block right that things can go wrong or you have to create extended long patterns that can force strider to execute something wrong.

84

that explains a lot.

I recall now that sometimes, i would teleport to the otherside of the screen and behind the opponent and was also able to call orbs faster, now i know why.
i dont think ive ever consciously noticed those machine walking off the screen until now. :xeye:

locdown… shoultzula

              **thank you**
85

My Strider is not pro I cannot split my little robots walking in two different directions :frowning: They are holding hands walking in the same direction all the time

Rather I throw bombs near the end of my orbs HOLLA AT PRESSURE TACTICS

86

me too @.@

87

You have made a good explaination about this. I have tried to explain this to my friends about this concept, but they never seem to understand. I’m going to show them your explaination about this subject and see how if fairs off with them. By the way… do you have the old postings about this from Cl0ckw0rk? If so, can you send them to me? Thanks:tup:

88

bah, reading your opponents game plan and limiting their options is 100x better than any split orb setup. Playing smart and not fucking up your execution is the way to go. Fuck split orbs.

89

I have a few of you asking me for this, and clock gave me the ok to post it again, so i will.

Originally posted Friday, July 13, 2007, by Clockw0rk

yeah I don’t mean to be preachy, but I’m in a postingaboutmarvel mood heh. Theme is “what youre doing rather than how youre doing it”. It’s all my opinion, feel free to post/flame

rambling incoming

Maybe I’m wrong… but it seems like alot of Strider players still don’t know how to go from ouro to ouro >>inescapable<<. While your goal with Strider shouldn’t really be trying to do that all the time, it’s definitely a staple to Strider/Doom imo. I always get hella ppl asking me “what buttons do I press” or “what string do I use” to trap from ouro to ouro. It’s really the wrong way of looking at things. Rather than focusing on what buttons you’re pressing or setups you’re using, you needa focus on what you’re actually doing, and this applies to almost all things “advanced” in Marvel with any given team, combo, situation. So for example, when it comes to ouro traps, whatever worked for you to get from one ouro to another (worked as in it was impossible for your opponent to escape) in any given situation, it won’t necessarily work in another situation depending on character position, opponent position, position relative to corners, SCREEN position, meter, character specific heights/weights/lengths, timing, assists, and so forth. Or maybe said pattern woulda worked but something else woulda been better given the “what you’re actually doing”… like building more meter or getting in a better position. BUT, if you understand what you’re actually doing as far as that trap goes, you’ll be ready to adapt and trap (or not trap) in ANY situation that arises.

So I guess in this case, if you’re going for ouro to ouro inescapable trap (note inescapable doesn’t necessarily mean 100% blockstun), what you’re trying to do is optimize blockstun. In any fighting game, it’s hella important to know how much blockstun any given thing does whether is be to keep your momentum going or knowing when your opponent’s momentum has a hole in it among other things. But since a large part of Strider/Doom revolves around blockstun, its fucking paramount to know exactly how much stun a bird or tiger is gonna do, how much stun a jab or short is gonna do, strongs and fwds, fierces and rhs, ALL PHASES OF DOOM ASSIST, ouro satellite things, and rings - and don’t forget about pushblocking/guard cancelling. So in a more practical sense, a good trap is gonna be optimally timed so that the end of one move’s blockstun is gonna lead straight into another move’s blockstun. So for example, as soon as blockstun from st fierce ends, rocks take over; as soon as rocks end, tiger comes; as soon as animal stun ends, rings take over. And like I said before, it’s not always gonna be like that. Under different circumstances, maybe you won’t be in a good position to throw animal (since it travels from off the screen rather than from Strider). Or maybe Doom drops in in such a way that the rocks will stun differently. Point is, if you learn what you’re doing rather than what you’re pressing, you’ll become more solid all around.

Another thing to add to the blockstun thing is that once you get used to it, you’ll be able (if you aren’t already) to feel when an assist is gonna come out. Marvel rewards quick thinking and foresight, and Strider/Doom is no exception. If you know that whatever you’re about to do during or after your ouro is gonna leave a blockstun gap wide enough for an assist to come out, plan accordingly lest you eat Psylocke in the face into double snap. Obviously you can use this to your advantage, which I’m sure shoutz or someone else has already gone over.

It’s kinda like a thing I read that mopreme once wrote about 3s Ken… something about wakeup super being a waste of meter, EVEN IF IT CONNECTS. The “doing” is stopping the opponent’s momentum/pace control, and the “going about doing it” is the wakeup super. While the wakeup super did indeed damage your opponent, the “doing” side of things could have been achieved by other means (like a wakeup dp), and then you’d still have the meter at your disposal. anyway i hope thats what he meant, coz thats what i got from it heh. I suppose a parallel to that would be: Invincibility and being in control is the “doing” and the “go about doing it” is the Ouro. For the most part you can activate ouro anytime you want, but just because you have means and meter doesn’t always make it the best option. Why activate in a situation where you’re already in control or don’t need that invincibility?

So, I guess the point is to try and think about things on a higher level. While trapping, what you’re trying to do is optimize blockstun - the way you go about doing it is gonna be different all the time depending on the situation, so figure out what works for you in any given situation. Or Doom photons - it’s space control, controlling the space between the topmost and bottommost photons. I don’t mean to be corny, but maybe that “formless” state that Sun Tzu talks about is the same thing haha. And yeah like I said before, this kinda stuff applies to all of marvel, team to team, and especially execution… but I guess I’ll save that for another post.

maybe more later

Clockw0rk

90

that clockw0rk post was serious.

91

thanks for the info Locdown. I’m sure this will help out a lot:tup:

92

This pretty much sums up my thoughts on splitting orbs.
I’ve been playing around with it for a while and to me, I think it’s overrated. Furthermore, I think when you pay attention as to whether or not your balls are walking off in two different directions, you’re not paying attention to what’s actually important and that’s the feeling and the timing of your actions. As I looked at some of my old pre ECCX footage, a lot of my setups involved splitting orbs. I just never paid attention to it til now. But there’s a reason why I stopped doing most of those setups. The stuff I do now i feel is more simple and effective. Don’t get me wrong, if you can do the setups and use them, you should. But I don’t think it’s something to live and die by. Kind of like the Cyke infinite.

Oh, and a useless fact: Genghis can get his orbs to split 100% of the time =)

93

I got an option tree I want to try with split orbs. Can you or genghis give me a run down on how that works?

My only gripe about split orbs is that if you fuck it up, you actually create more walk off time so the risk of doing it was always out there and I’ve only done it when I’ve locked someone down for multiple reps and I want to try some hot shit. But it seems it has been figured out now and the whole split orb thing has changed my mind.

94

Try teleporting as the orbs bar hits the M in TIME. The timing is around there. Play around with it a little. It might be a little different on a DC since my keyboard inputs are already faster than a joystick (and with an emulator slowdown, I’m probably in a whole new dimension in terms of speed inputs).

95

I was trying something very similar but I was using the T in time to activate it and this was how I actually got it some what consistently but never 100% of the time. I’ll try the M and see what happens.