MvC3: Magneto: Questions (and Answers) Thread

Classic Fighting Games Ultimate Marvel VS Capcom 3
1441

Yeah I need to work on that a little more too, but the most reliable thing seems to be to control opponent height during the fly loops and not delay the addf as much as I do in the corner. At least for me I let them hang in the air for quiteee a while before I end the fly loop starter. And I guess addf.M into juf.M is the move here? Addf.H seems to push the opponent far enough away to make the rejump.Normal difficult. Whoever came up with it first, I’m stealing the setups posted by Ranmasama a while ago.

Wondering if that side variation would be easier with delay, add.LMH adf.H, fly (reversed input), into loops. So the same way you’re setting up your down’s. Also nice on hammering out that 300% flowchart :slight_smile: Lara gets pretty frustrating when you have to get dirtnapped lol. A guy around Boston’s been hitting me with the old-fashioned Ironman finite into double dirtnap with Jam Session BS lately. It’s not a good feeling lol. On the other hand, getting a miracle grab on invisible Lara when she fucks up (which is pretty hard to do unfortunately) is a good feeling lol.

I mean no worries dude. Seems as if you’re doing most of the maintenance around here and it’s appreciated. Was mostly mentioning the spoilers issue so it was clear I’d tried to do my homework before asking (if the answers were in there) :stuck_out_tongue:

1442

Yeah, nothing worse than fucking up a dirt nap. T.T I had the gameplan down well with my old X23/IM/RR team, but getting down 2 new infinite characters and ways to get to Mags infinite off every possible situation and learning all his infinites while learning how to even run neutral with all of them has been rough.

I didn’t even know you could rejump off addf.M. I’ll have to try that out. Are you still supposed to be at that weird unfly H height or is that a true old-fashioned rejump?

1443

Lolll yeah sounds pretty rough. Similar thing going from Nova to Magneto for me…Mags is getting a lotttt better finally, but you know…actually playing smart is kind of a new thing when you make that shift hah.

And yeah I didn’t know that either about addf.M, but here’s the Ranmasama videos I took it from:

Down:

Spoiler

http://youtu.be/2An4aHKUhCU

Side:

Spoiler

http://youtu.be/WCk_iMXLNFs

Btw you asked a while ago if there was any tape of my playing the Frank team. Might finally get to record something next week so I can pass it along if that goes down. It’s against the Boston X23 player as well lol. Point Mags vs. X23 is pretty suspect…somehow he gives me a little bit of trouble though. Lara/Unibeam/Jam Session isn’t like god-tier, but if I fuck up my neutral execution with Magneto I can get locked down pretty easily. I also make some…really questionable decisions sometimes so that might not help. Working on that lol, but I kinda don’t mind getting blown up by trying out a bunch of different stuff in a new matchup if it’s in a casual setting. You can learn some punishes that way if you don’t don’t play the opponent’s character or have someone feeding you info.

1444

Holy shit…I can’t believe I never saw that, that looks so much easier than the addf.H crap. He’s just doing ADDF j.M unfly instead of j.H Unfly? That’s way closer to the ground that you can do the addf H option at, right?

Honestly, I love X23+JS+Unibeam. That neutral is super super solid IMO. I just think you’re stuck running point X23 or Dante on that team when you can run point mags and not have all the top tier troubles (or the IM dead weight) but still have the dirt nap nonsense. Plus X23+JS+EMD is still pretty solid.

My main sparring partner runs Hulk/IM(RB)/X23(OTG) and I think X23 actually has decent answers to a lot of Mags derpier tactics (especially if you start auto-piloting too hard. Her buttons and speed can really give him a lot of trouble.)

1445

(I’m just moving this from the ‘video combo’ thread. Not sure where match play vids should live on the Mags board…)

I’ve got a bunch of matches freshly recorded. Just bombing the relevant character threads. Mags/X23/Dante starting to feel pretty real. Trying to get a new optimized BnB in play and kept over thinking hypergrav loops, but still won the set by a pretty wide margin and feel really good about my mags play. There are 2 more vids to upload after this for any sadists, out there.

1446

Cool vid man. I wouldn’t mind seeing you run that team vS. a top tier one though. I see issues with using JS as your only neutral assist.

By the way I’m an ATL player but my career keeps me busy and I suck lol. But I’ve been grinding stick and I plan to start going back to locals in November. Used to play Mags but I dropped him for MODOK…Sorry guys but honestly he’s more fun and Capcom did a better job adapting the character to the game. Still love good Mags play though.

1447

I went 2-3 at CEO against Rayray with this team so it’s definitely not a huge issue. The main issue is that Wandles is the only other serious Marvel player in the area (he made 17th at FR this year, he’s just not a big name so he didn’t get any stream time). If I can get some of the old HSV Marvel guys playing this week I’ll try to record some matches again Zero May Stride or Wolv/Doom/Vergil.

Honestly, though. If you go and watch some of the other big Mags+JS players out there, you normally don’t see the 2nd assist called very often outside of specific incoming setups or combos. It’s a super strong pairing and even if I lose pressure and have to block something it just becomes a chance to alpha counter for me.

1448

Thanks for posting these, man! Be lookin forward to watching them :slight_smile:

1449

kind of a beginner magnus question, but is it possible when tri-jumping towards the opponent to delay H long enough in the tri-jump that it comes out as an option select grab?? i feel like ive done something like this a couple times on accident, but i couldve misread it. if it is possible, is it viable and does it work the midget character of the cast as well?

1450

are you talking about OS air grab when they jump up? or OS ground grab while they try to block your tri-jump? are you doing sj trijump, coming down with air H?

because sj trijump coming down with air H, you will already OS air grab

if you want to ground grab, you can’t OS it, you have to press H a good height above the ground for it to come out as an air normal, so it’s too far for a ground grab input to register

1451

OS ground grab when they block my tri-jump attacks. ive gotten H in the air but way more often i get a whiff where mag’s H slap hand is like visible for a microsecond and it seems like nothing happens. i thought maybe pressing H at the right time in the tri -jump might cause the attack to startup right up as magnus touches the ground, and if he’s close enough, a throw instead of whiffed H. doesnt sound like its possible tho, oh well

1452

as far as I know that’s not gonna work. Best bet if you wanna stack throw attempts is just to empty tridash with a plink and then plink backwards or Pope select the moment you touch the ground. You can get the air/ground OS’s pretty tight together, but you can’t get both in one input (if that’s what you were looking for?)

Also, for the people who play Mags/Dante

@batzzzzzzzzzzz asked me for advice on the Wolverine/Tatsu matchup, and I unfortunately don’t have anyone around here who plays that shell, so I can only make generalizations based on my Wolverine/PB experience. He’s running Mag/Dante/Frank, so he has Cart as well, but I was wondering if y’all had any advice for him on how to handle Tatsu’s ability to mess with Jam Session calls.

1453

Oh so what you want is to press air forward+H such that if your tridash L’s blockstun fades as you land, you get to grab them?

idk if it’s possible since you should already be in H startup right before you land which means you’ve “expended” the forward+H buffer on an air H

if you try to buffer it on the ground so you don’t expend the buffer on air H, you’ll get a ground H if they’re still in blockstun, which isn’t such a groundbreaking OS lol

yeah you’re right it doesn’t sound like it’s possible, you should test a bit though

1454

That throw thing won’t work. The only way to get a ground throw is 4/6+H while on the ground and at neutral. If you see the start up of the H come out, you’re technically option selecting an air throw and a throw tech, but if you’re hitting H while magneto is still in the air, the game isn’t registering a throw. Trijump light also inflicts a surprising amount of block stun, so tick throw with j. L will lose to smart up backing and pope selecting.

As for Wolverine/Tatsu, if you can play lame long enough to build two bars you have a lot of options for punishing the assist, since the window wherein it nullifies projectiles is actually pretty small, and shockwave beats it clean for huge damage.
Shockwave/million dollars THC on reaction beats it clean for ~85% on Akuma and is safe even if wolverine blocks the super, disruptor snipe into THC, or Shockwave DT DHC is of course safe and does tons of damage leaving you safe.
Reacting to the assist call with shockwave and some way to make it safe is pretty free, especially due to the invuln on shockwave start up, which will get you a happy birthday if they did tatsu + berserker slash or yolo dive kick, in which case you can just DT x factor for the double kill. Jam session into immediate shockwave is actually pretty safe too just because of the active frames on jam session giving you a barrier.
Shopping cart has a pretty good chance of beating tatsu as well TBH.

Does anyone know if the people in the general ultimate thread are bullshitting about magneto being able to do the blockstun escape glitch into an airdash? AFAIK you can only cancel into hypergrav in the air, and grav or repulsion on the ground, neither of which are dash cancellable. I’ve never seen anyone do it into an airdash, and I think Chrisis is kind of nutty anyway.

1455

I know. It’s not bullshit. I’ve done it. There is a video of someone doing it. HGrav in the air is dash cancellable during its startup.

You can do it as well.

EDIT: yo what Slippaz I never saw your post lmao. Makes my post redundant, the one about the grab OS.

About wolv/tatsu:

Well, stand S is a good tool in the matchup. Beats divekick and jS, plus it can stuff Akuma as he comes out for a happy bday, but the more likely thing to happen is that you launch Wolv and tatsu comes out under you because of the way tatsu is timed after a jump-in, which isn’t a bad thing either

try not to go for stand L too much, too inconsistent of an anti-air against divekick imo, and tatsu will beat it so even if you do tag a divekick, you will probably get hit if you mash it to hit confirm

sj addb plink Blast and adb plink Blast are bread and butter

if you bait tatsu with erratic ground movement (ground plinks and nj height plink Blasts) you can get in with sj addf S and chain into Jam to get some pressure going

don’t try to air grab him if he normal jumps up before he divekicks, it will always OS unless you do it like an inch off the ground, when he techs the air throw he gets a free tatsu call on you

while playing the footsie game, both of you will be weaving in and out of mid range trying to coax each other into calling assist first, while doing that you should drop a few crouch shorts from that distance every now and then, it checks for random b.slash with tatsu behind it plus it’s pretty safe on whiff anyway

Shockwave is great, yeah the guy is right, but don’t pull it out when you’re actually in the pressure situation. the pre-flash startup doesn’t have invincibility, at least iirc, and you can get hit out of it. it has fast pre-flash startup though and once you get the flash out, the shockwave is basically guaranteed even when you get hit since it lingers

nj air H is good, you can try to hit him with the tippy tip of it as he jumps up to do divekick, just late cancel into Blast to convert or make it safe on block

when you’re in a pressure situation, you have to understand it’s naturally hard because that’s where wolv/tatsu thrives. You will just have to feel his tendencies involving low/IOH, there’s no way around it since you can’t react or pushblock out. if you block the stuff and tatsu ends, you will want to pushblock him out but the first few times you will want a delayed pushblock, just in case he tries to do a stand/crouch L xx b.slash mixup after tatsu wears off. delayed pushblock gives you autoblock in that case, but after the first few tries you’re gonna have to counter-read him if he tries to read your delayed pushblock and tries to frame trap you or just delay the b.slash

forcefield is an option out of pressure situations. it can give you a safe Shockwave startup, or if you have enough space you can call Jam/cart right behind it to put them in blockstun just in case they don’t trigger the counter

if you get the pressure on wolv, just freeflow the mixups from one assist to the other until he cracks. iirc off a fuzzy you have to use close IOH jump M because IOH jump L whiffs on wolv

with Jam and cart assists behind you, you’re not supposed to sj adu fly xx plink anyway, but this is especially important against wolv. just keep control of some ground space instead

ground disruptor is ok I guess, it doesn’t serve too much of a purpose though (at least in general, actually Mag/Dante/Frank can get lv5 off it so it’s not as useless for this team). it’s possible for wolv to divekick you if he was already in jump animation when you did disruptor. if they get sniped by it, you can do Slippaz’ XF hit confirm for lv 5 Frank. if you don’t do that, they will go into soft knockdown and may possibly roll toward you, which may be bad news if you’re not expecting it

1456

Thanks man, you’re a beast! Makin sure that gets seen.

@UncleGary yeah Forte’s right, it’s totally possible and doable…just difficult when you have meter, especially under pressure. Someone’ll master it at some point and it’ll open up some pretty ridiculous stuff.

And to clarify, I don’t think air Hypergrav is dash cancelable normally, but for whatever reason it suddenly is when you’re doing it out of blockstun. I don’t think it’s a plink either…there’s actually a window of a few frames to do it (kara dash style). I could be wrong about that first, but I remember trying to just do it raw (not out of blockstun) and not getting it. Whether or not that was my fault I’m not sure, but maybe someone knows for sure.

1457

if you want to OS a grab right after a tri.j.L, do:

Tri.j.l [land] h~m+l > cr.l

You get a dash/grab OS there in the middle canceled into a cr.L. Or you can do the ground/air grab OS

Tri.j.l [land][wait] h~m+l > jb.H xx Mag Blast

That the same dash/grab OS, followed by an air grab OS. The theory is that if they stay grounded, they’ll get grabbed by the first, and if they jumped, by the second. That’s why it’s important to wait for the j.L blockstun to fade, otherwise you won’t be able to properly OS the first dash and have no coverage for when you blindly jump back.

1458

Nah, HGrav is dash cancellable normally. sjohn did a test for that, right? With the H~M+L recorded macro, do it naked and Magneto grunts because of the H then dashes. If you do it qcb+recorded macro, he dashes but doesn’t grunt, even though it’s exactly the same plink timing because it’s a recorded macro. So instead of the grunting H you must be getting HGrav.

1459

Ahh my bad, I didn’t test it with a macro, so I must have just messed up when I tried it. Good to know. That’d be really weird if it was only out of blockstun lol.

1460

Got a few more matches recorded (and not against Wandles this time, go figure.) Since I’ve switched to my new team I’ve been going pretty even against Kazi. Kind of sloppy play, but hope it shows M/X/D’s potential against one of the best teams in the game (even if the play isn’t the best.)

Personal notes on the match. Holy shit I need to stop dropping Mags combos. :confused: I think it’s funny how well I can punish Vajra calls with X23 (match 3 or 4) compared to how absolute shit I am at punishing with Mags. I need not to rely on slide + JSxxEMD as much and start setting up pressure with tridash/c.L/Magblast pressure + JS.

There are 2 other short sets uploaded, but the skill of the players was low enough that I don’t think it’s worth posting here. I’m always up for critiques, though.