Could we quit bitching about TAC, a mechanic that’s barely even used in the first place and start thinking about how to balance up things like the bottom tiers and top tier characters?
Believing that you get to decide what that is is the definition of the scrub mentality.
The implication of “overpowered” is that it’s a universally dominating strategy. With that in mind, do you feel like there’s no reason not to TAC? All the time? Most of the time?
A game with balanced characters and broken mechanics is a broken game.
A game with balanced mechanics and unbalanced characters is not a broken game.
Once again, I don’t think power level is the issue with the TAC’s.
Considering MvC2 was most definitely a broken game, you’re wrong.
MvC2 was a massively unbalanced game (broken), but the mechanics were more or less sound. Broken has two different meanings in this case.
Edit: Let me rephrase. I think mechanics like TAC and Xfactor, in addition to things like the DHC glitch and infinites hold the game back more than Hsien-Ko and Arthur being crap.
Well then what’s broken about it? In any strategy game with imperfect information, you are guessing pretty much constantly. Guesses which are skewed in favor of one player are so utterly ordinary that I’m kinda surprised this is an issue to anyone.
…no. Broken means that it doesn’t work. In the case of MvC2, the characters were so incredibly unbalanced the game didn’t work. In MvC3, the problems are not only character balance coughMagsDantePhoenix but also mechanics, the most prominent of which are X-factor and the DHC trick.
The difference is the TAC is Rock/Paper/Scissors. It’s not even truly a player interaction at all.
I rephrased my previous post. I actually think we agree, except I don’t think character balance is bad in MvC3 as the mechanics.
So you think fighting games are supposed to be played by using a pseudo-RPS to determine whether a character survives or not? Really?
As for OP, I don’t recall using that term. Something as unreliable as TAC can’t be deemed OP. Hell I don’t even think anything in MvC3 is OP, even the DHC glitch or DPX.
I do believe there’s no reason not to TAC if your combo is not gonna kill or lead to a very good mix up.
Combo> Tac>Air Combo>Tac>Air combo finish is like the silliest thing ever on a phoenix team. You go from 1 meter to 5 in a matter of seconds. TAC’ing near the end of combos is pretty free for phoenix teams, you got nothing at all to lose.
As for balance, give Tron better range on her command grabs and allow her to combo from it without assists.
Same for Haggar.
I still don’t get why Wesker has one of(if not THE BEST) the best command grabs in the game lol. Should had given it to Dante to officially make him the best character ever.
The good thing about TAC at least is that there’s enough other really strong things where it will never be THAT much of an issue. It’s just something that augments all of the other shit that’s already in the game.
I think with Wesker they just weren’t sure if he was going to be good enough at opening people up so they wanted to make sure he had something when people were blocking him. They probably also didn’t realize that his gun would be such a ridiculous spacing tool. They probably figured since the hit box was small it wouldn’t be that big of a deal but it’s mainly the ridiculous speed that allows him to control space so well any way. The fact that your character has to be really short or have a short wave dash to get in on Wesker and while still having to deal with gun/assist port bullshit is why Wesker runs a train on a lot of the cast. He has at least one tool for every situation and his only issues (low super damage, unsafe teleports without assist) are mitigated with small tweaks to your game (using his scary reset game which is practically better than long combos and using assists or just not teleporting as much cuz he has one of the best wave dashes any way.)
People were so quick to want to tone Sentinel down but the first time I saw Wesker play it was obvious who really needed changes. Wesker could have 800k health and still be a completely scarier character than Sentinel. It’s just Sentinel’s assist and his XF3 that keeps him a threat.
Your incredulity is really unwarranted. Even if you took out Team Aerial Combos, that’s still basically what the game is.
I think you’re oversimplifying the interactions is a fighting game a whole lot when you say “its all basically rock paper scissors”.
Well, it’s obviously more involved than that, but strategy in any game is really just having the understanding to make the best guesses.
I think that’s the issue, TAC is so “un-involved” that it stands out. And not in a good way. It doesn’t really involve any level of understanding, it is just a guess in it’s purest, simplest form.
I dont know I always thought fighting games in general where just a battle of space and controlling options where the idea is to force advantage on your opponent’s defense so they are forced to guess unfavorably until you crack them open enough and win. That’s pretty much how you have to play this game since a lot of the mix ups are hard or impossible to block on reaction. You have to control your space so you can force situations that force the opponent to guess and when there’s too much to guess you have controlled their space and they must succumb to your pressure. You never have to guess if you’re effectively controlling space. You’re only guessing once your space has been invaded. That’s why characters like Wolverine and Wesker are so good. They can invade your space whenever they feel like it especially with an assist. The pressure is on the opponent to control both them and their assist or be forced into an unfavorable situation pretty much instantly.
That’s why a lot of the game is just a lot of dancing around fighting for space and when someone loses their ability to move they get blown up by a mix up into combo. People that win consistently in this game are those that are able to control their space and know how to manage themselves depending on what assists the opponent’s characters are utilizing. It takes a while to learn not to get blown up by Haggar/Tron assist or teleport mix ups with projectile assists because they basically act as instant footsies and you have to learn to avoid those situations and attack during the small time frame where the instant footsies aren’t available.
That’s all true, you should always be trying to minimize guesswork and slanting any and all odds in your favor. However, that really doesn’t pertain to the TAC problem, the technically invaded your space already, and hell, they already “guessed right” and hit you. The problem is that the mechanic is totally brain-dead.
I don’t really share that view. You’re not guessing. You’re analyzing a situation and picking the best/optimal option in your view. I’m sorry but that is not a guess. I am not guessing when I notice that someone likes to chicken block and start using low strings to hit them out of their jump startup frames.
I guess you’re gonna tell me yomi is simply guessing now…
Guessing in FGs only applies to a small set of circumstances.
Next thing you’ll be telling me people on the stock market are guessing.
Yeah guessing in fighting games is mainly done by the person who is defending, not the person who is on offense. You dont have to guess when you’re the one with the space and options. You get to do what you want. That’s where all the terms like “random super” and “wake up DP” come from. Hoping something defensive gets you out of something where it’s not entirely clear if it will work because the opponent can do 13 things and you can only do one or 2.
That’s mainly why I dont like SFIV though. There’s too many ways to get out of a bad situation in that game that have to be covered by so much other arbitrary stuff. In Marvel once you lose your spacing you have to block, tech grab (which is one frame and harder to tech than SFIV), or advance guard. All 3 options are heavily blown up by an offensive option from the opponent. Which is why the game is a lot more interesting for me. You dont get much if your space is invaded so eventually at high level the game will be a lot about controlling your ground and air space so it’s harder for the opponent to land clean hits and full combos on you. Once you get your space invaded you have to make a really good read or get blown up.
That’s kind of the reason why characters like Chris, Arthur, Morrigan and Hsien Ko haven’t seem too scary yet in this game. They can control space but they dont do a very good job of invading your space.
But during a TAC you are guessing…
HI NINI!!! 
SUP VE. Why is DL DEAD >.<