Regarding TAC
First counter 50k damage
2nd counter 200k damage
3rd counter 400k damage, the more you try to get Meter/damage you should also be punished more if you want more reward
This isn’t unusual for something you can only do in a combo, but I agree with you that the risks for each direction should be unequal as well, and they could stand to be a little bit higher in general.
It’s a “mix up” with no execution required, insane reward and virtually no risk. Safe tag (which normally costs TWO meters), plus meter build, plus continuation of a combo that can go into a level shouldn’t be that easy. Not only do you have a 1/3 chance, but the window is so fucking small God, it’s really just fucking awful. The counter itself shouldn’t necessarily do damage, but you should be able for follow up the counter, it’s a fucking counter. You see your opponent who you “countered” just falling out of the sky, and you can’t even move and punish them. If you are getting a safe tag and meter build, plus continuing a combo, all at scrub execution skill, if you get countered, you should get fucked over… HARD. As in if I’m playing Taskmaster, and I counter you, I should get a full 800k+ combo.
I dunno if anyone remembers the E3/Comic-con build which allowed you to counter TAC which led into your own TAC. Ex: Wolverine TACs on Dante to switch Wolvie out, Dante counters by guessing right and begins their own TAC in the air. I thought that worked out ok, as long as limits and stuff are put so its not an endless match going up higher and higher with TACs
TACs seemed to work really well and balanced in TvC…I guess because its 3 characters now its harder to make it fair?
TACs required you to spend meter in TvC. That’s why they were relatively benign.
Also, I forgot about that wrinkle in the TAC system back during E3. I remember that shizz now…
I think the “easy” inputs could stand to be toned down a bit. The sequence below was entered in training mode starting with She-Hulk. Now I understand that I pressed the
http://shoryuken.com/forum/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/moves/qcf.png
too fast and got ‘Taking out the Trash’ instead of ‘Emerald Cannon’ (which I think is dumb as the :f: has already been “used”) but then riddle me this: Why, when I DHCed into Wolverine did I get ‘Berserker Charge’ instead of ‘Beserker Barrage X’?
:d::d::s::f::l::qcf:
:h::qcf::l:
It’s 15 frames after the flash (not fast), for a lower reward than a real reset, none of which actually require execution either.
Except for the fact that many resets can actually be punished (and still require more execution). I’m I’m Super Skrull for instance, and I go for an elastic grab reset, not only is the combo I’d have to execute going to require far more execution, but if I miss the grab, Taskmaster can get 800k on me. It’s pretty fast too, I can’t tell you how many times I pressed the right direction, but apparently not in time, and I know I’m not the only one.
It’s virtually broken, and I really am not the type of person to say things are broken. I don’t think Tron Fire is broken, or Haggar Lariat, or whatever. Honestly, I only think 3 things in this game are broken, X-Factor, TAC, and DHC Glitch (in that order).** Why the fuck can you gain a full bar when you are already getting a safe tag and a combo continuation? **I know I’m being repetitive, but, I swear to God, I hate it, it’s like they obviously didn’t think about how broken it is. Guessing games in fighting games are permissible, but they should be punishable, or they shouldn’t lead to an amazing reward.
if XF and dhc glitch were taken out… tac would rule this game with an iron fist in its current incarnation… and yeah, i think i was one of the first people to complain about it… a looong time ago… people was like WHAT? LOL.
still, with XF and glitch in this game… tac is kind of redundant except for chun and phoenix teams… one combo into down exchange could see you having 4 meters at the start of the round (1 at start> combo makes 2, down exchange makes 1, =4 total. there are LOTS of combos that will leave a team with 4 meters at the start of the round. on next combo just any exchange to jean gets her in for free with 5 meters… play until DP activates> tagout. play team “regularly” ie with meter.
-dime
Is that if you fuck up, or if Taskmaster guesses right? If it’s the former it doesn’t matter, because we only actually care if something is hard to do if it’s too hard to do. If it’s the latter then it’s kind of a shitty reset and you probably shouldn’t use it. I know Wesker and Ammy can get essentially completely safe resets off of a combo.
Why is that a problem? Clearly it isn’t so good that people are interested in using it to the exclusion of other options.
I don’t think people understand how big it is that you are getting a safe tag for free, normally, a safe tag costs TWO meters, that on it’s own is just silly, also don’t forget characters like MODOK can literally come in from a TAC and do a CKC.
Crossover counters are safe for some characters, that only costs one meter. Regular Tag only takes ~60 frames, so anything that can keep someone busy for a second will get you a safe tag for free, or 1.25 seconds if you have to start the tag on reaction. Both of those have hidden costs, though. Your opponent has to be attacking to crossover counter, and you probably have to be in a combo of some kind to make hard tag safe, just like you have to do to attempt a TAC at all.
And getting a ToD with MODOK off of TACs also carries the not insubstantial cost of having fucking MODOK on your team.
i dont think the “free” tag is of much importance at all. i mean its only important if your opponent just wants to make sure they actually use all there characters in a given match rather than ocv’ing a team…
but think of it like this:
i just hit you for 95% hp or i did some combo that left you with 5% health or less and thusly into an obvious “i need to tag” situation. are you going to try your luck by trying to land a hit and then air exchange? or are you just going to use dhcx2 into safe super or abuse broken hard tag?
the answer is simple in my mind… leaving the character out is to big of a risk generally speaking and most people just hard tag because of how stupid good those things are (how often do you see hard tags punished? even obvious ones?)
if hard tags werent so amazingly good then yeah id complain about tac even more… but basically hard tags are way to good in this game which makes tac tagins not really a point of contention… i mean if you try and anticipate an obvious hard tag… you could lose an entire character.
so tag ins are basically free in this game. which is what viscant was ekluding to at the last wnf.
-dime
Yeah hard tag probably shouldn’t be an overhead. It’s not outstandingly fast or safe otherwise, though, so I don’t see it as being all that strong of a maneuver.
If you guys aren’t seeing hard tags get punished, you’re playing the wrong people.
It only doesn’t look good right now because DHC glitch is so appealing. If that ever got taken out those free meters would be a lot more powerful of an option.
actually im taking that not from my own matches but directly from lots and lots of wnf matches (EVEN GRANDFINALS) as well as against phoenix teams after snap in when her cooldown on tagout is up. hard tags are bs in mvc3 for 2 reasons:
they hit overhead and they are fast. so if someone wants to “bait” a hard tag they have to sit there and standblock like a moron and open themselves up to a dash in cr.lk combo.
not fun, and probably not worth the risk in the long run.
yes they do get punished sometimes… but not nearly enough to disuade there intertermittent use.
-dime
Again, if you’re seeing hard tags that are safe, either somebody is screwing up, or just got blown up prior to the tag. Which in of itself isn’t that dissimilar to TACs, no?
I totally agree with this. If you do a combo and your opponent is in the pixel rage red, and you let them get away with a hard tag, your doing it wrong. Shit happens sometimes, but when I play (and even when I watch really good people play) hard tags get punished, ESPECIALLY the obvious ones. Don’t underestimate the power of a safe tag, it’s a big deal.
But on another note, because I generally think the game should have more buffs then nerfs, I think every character should have at least one good assist. So make Spider Man’s web ball fater with more stun, make Morriagn’s soul fist way bigger like it was in TvC, give Orbital Grudge more hyper armor or tenderizer do way more damage, etc. Who are some other characters with pretty mediocre assists that need help in that area.
I think AA assists could use some invuln frames so they ACTUALLY WORK AS AA JESUS.