Match-ups: a general question

Classic Fighting Games SSF2T: HD Remix
1

So, one of the most common pieces of advice I always hear is “learn the match-ups.” Obviously, practice and observation play huge parts in accomplishing this. But I’ve never seen any kind of central “match-ups database” with clear, written advice on what types of things to expect and prepare for in each specific match-up, and how each specific match-up’s baseline advantages/disadvantages break down.

I notice SRK’s strategy wiki has a space for this stuff in each individual ST character strategy article, but these are mostly empty. And I’m sure the Yoga Book Hyper has a lot of what I’m asking for, but I’ve no idea where I can find a clear, translated version of it.

Can anyone point me to a complete, helpful, and accurate English database of character match-ups? Does one even exist?

2

I too would love a simple table to show matchups…

3

For Vanilla ST. I’m sure new matchup tables will pop up eventually. Once people play enough.

4

This is cool and all, but what I’m asking for is actual written, bullet-pointed guidelines to each match-up that offers a general idea of what one should and shouldn’t do, based on the character he’s facing.

5

I think one of the greatest obstacles for beginners trying to get better at the game is to understand exactly what is meant by that phrase. It’s a vague statement so it makes it seem like a pretty nebulous or aesthetic concept.

While it’s true that there are definite, concrete points of knowledge (ie. specifics) to be gained for a given matchup, there are sooo many of them and they are all dynamic, infinitessimally related and affecting each other. Reading about the specifics certainly will speed your learning, but in the end you have to experience it by feel to truly understand it (and thus be able to apply it) rather than just memorizing a bulleted list of facts by rote. In the end, figuring stuff out for yourself can be more rewarding and more effective.

Besides, because you’re always competing against other people, the matchups become more organic and effective tactics will often depend more on your and your opponent’s limitations than those of your and your opponent’s characters. These would be things like execution, reaction times, guessing/patterns/predictability, mental states (what someone is thinking at that very moment), and mental variability (how their thinking/plan changes). The “dynamics” of a matchup become what’s most important, and so I guess the concept of learning the matchups is again reduced to a nebuous idea, haha.

When you’re trying to “learn” a matchup, the main things you should be doing and looking for are:

  • considering all the options that each character has in a given situation, where a situation involves the positioning of each character (relative to each other, and their overall placement on the screen, and the whole stage), and their current state
  • knowing the properties of both characters’ moves and how they will interact with each other
  • considering the risk versus reward of those options, and how executing a particular option can/will change that current situation into a new and different situation

What this should give rise to is the ability to effectively create reactions in your opponent (in terms of mental state or game mechanics), respond to (counter, avoid, neutralize, whatever) an opponent’s actions (movement and/or attacks) with the goal of being able to identify and hopefully work towards advantageous situations. That is, situations where you have way more and/or better “good” options than your opponent does; your options “outweight” your opponent’s.

Your matchup knowledge then becomes a loose, flexible framework that provides a base you will fill in DURING the course of a particular game as you play a particular opponent. So basically my advice is to play lots and think more, haha.

I know I’m making it sound like I’m an expert (or at least that I think I’m an expert) so I’ll point out that I’m really, really not. As a perfect example of my own inexperience, I really have no idea how these concepts would apply to a mirror match. For matches (sets of multiple games) that involve character changes, I’m only juuuust starting to figure out how and how much of the knowledge of your opponent that you’ve gained from one particular matchup can be transposed to a new character matchup. :looney:

… mmmh, it’s pretty wordy but I hope that helps at least a little!

edit v v v yes all of this v v v

6

On a kind of related note to what deadfrog was saying, the key to learning matchups is to play many different opponents who use that particular character that you’re learning the matchup against. One problem is that you may face many opponents who themselves don’t know the matchup well enough to pose a challenge – what this does is it limits your own ability to improve with that matchup. Obviously, the fastest way to improve is to play the strongest players; those players who know the matchups inside out and will punish your every mistake – making you learn from your mistakes.

To answer the OP: unfortunately the SRK wiki is the best we have for a condensed set of info on strategies and matchups at the moment. Yes, there are very long threads in the SSF2T forum, and they’re very helpful, but there’s no one central repository where info is set out nice and bullet-pointed for every matchup.

In the end I think the most important thing is to play with your mind turned on, so that you learn quickly. If you want to improve fast, don’t just play mindlessly or “for fun” – play with brains. Notice what works and what doesn’t, and if things aren’t working, try and figure out why.