How does a throw stuff an invincible reversal?
I’m actually doing the same thing. But i havent sent the info I collected to those guys yet. Lemme know if you’re okay with me pm’ing you whatever I have so we can either add or remove some stuff.
I actually didn’t want to add any info on the first and second posts on here because imo, we don’t have anything concrete atm. So, I wanted to wait until we have something for each character, look it over, and then start editing the posts.
As for the 35 threads thing, yeah that is a bit much. I did mention an idea similar to that though:
Goddamn this double post crap!!!
shrugs Test it out, pick Ryu and make Makoto do that, besides not all reversals have as much priority as a Grab. Take Makoto for example, none of her reversals have that much priority and you can grab her without fear.
here’s some stuff i’m workin on for rog
dash punches -
Cr. MK most consistently beats them clean
unless…
(whiff ranged straight = trade not in your favor)
(max ranged overhead = beaten)
(full screen armor breaker = trade)
Ex Dashpunches
st.MP -> EX Oroshi (sometimes invincibility runs out) (120 dmg 300 stun)
st.MP -> LK Karakusa (can be beaten if MP done late)
st.MP -> EX Karakusa (insurance, will be beaten by armor breaker if done late) (120 dmg, 220 stun)
throw (130 dmg, 120 stun)
Rog’s Jab
F+MP
seems to be able to trade or get rog’s hitbox more often than other pokes,
will lose sometimes obviously
Headbutt
question (i’m alone and i’m bad at recording a good dummy lol)
would rog’s headbutt, if ex karakusa absorbed a hit, have good enough recovery to punish makoto for using it?
this is only good to know for dash up and ex karakusa on a turtling rog, since he might get scared and throw it out
anti airs
st. mp
st. mk
f+mp (recommended for cross up whiff shenanigans or hits them if done early enough)
these only gets beat when at whiffed ranges (for rog’s j. HP j. HK)
f+mk (recommended for cross up whiff shenanigans, hits whiffed ranged j. HK j. HP if done early enough)
Rog’s st. HP, st. HK
dunno what to do against these
Rog’s Sweep
focus lol
so help me out guys, are there any other tools that balrog uses that i missed
or suggestions for any of these things to add
please do say
CHESTO!!!
Sorry, but a kara-throw will lose to a reversal Ryu DP every time after a dash punch. You don’t know what you’re talking about. A regular throw is 3 frames, and a kara-regular throw is slower. A Ryu dragon punch is 3 frames and is invincible.
“Priority” is not a real thing, and you need to stop posting nonsense in this thread.
Just wanna say I really like Choy’s effort to isolate all the tools of a character and find specific counters. Good way to think about these things. Gonna try these out.
I know it’s early. That’s the same reason why I hadn’t PMed you sooner. I’m sure your format is better than mine. I just copy and pasted posts into a word document. 
I think we should go ahead and put some info in, but only after letting the pro players (yourself included) go over most of it. I’m sure they can determine whether it is good enough at the moment. I know a lot of what we post now will be null and void in a few months, but it will at least be something so folks don’t come in with the same “I can’t be Bison! Waaah!” posts… Not that neatly putting everything on the first page will stop those anyway…
I just got lucky and karakusa’d Vega out of a roll. Anybody messed with this before?
I’m having to play this match up REALLY defensively. Need some new weaponzzz.
umm, alright. By next Thursday or something, I’ll just pm those guys you mentioned and see what they have so far. Hopefully, everything they have matches up to what we have and I can write up some sort of “summary” of all those notes. Hopefully by that next week or so, I’ll have something posted up on the front pages.
Oh, and it could be that I misread what you wrote, but I’m no top player. Not by a longshot. Maybe NinjaCW, since I saw that dude on [media=youtube]iadG4Yt6xR4"[/media], but I’m still a scrub son.
It could be sarcasm too. shrugs. I’m paranoid like that. =/
I’m not a pro -_- in SF at least im learning just like you guys haha. . .i’m just playing 12-15 hours a day haha
jesus christus, ninja. /jealous :lol:
fuck i have to write this narrative…
I karakusa’d one of boxers dash punches today by accident. I might have done a cr.lk first that stopped him though, i’m not sure.
At a certain range only cr.mk will be able to hit Boxer out of the air. Basically if st.mp won’t hit him directly (where you’ll win or trade) use cr.mk.
Turtle boxer can be really annoying to pressure. Tools I use:
f.mp, correctly spaced, beats his jabs. And does a LOT of damage (90). s.hk can also be used.
c.hp at the correct range to get him down, and ex IAT.
meaty oroshi is excellent to beat non ex headbutt
Obviously don’t ever jump on him if he is sitting on his charge.
Ummmm I’m starting to get destroyed by decent Chuns. Ran into one last night that killed me with TONS or cr.shorts/jabs. Seriously–everytime I got in range I ate nothing but those. I couldnt get close enough to use EX Kara to grab her through them. Also Chuns cr.hk OWNS THE FUCK outta of Makoto if she jumps. There is literally nothing Makoto can do to stop it. I tried every air attack from j.hp to Tsuguri. They all get owned.
I’d also like to know how people actually use IAT in matches because everytime I use it my opponent jabs/sweeps me out of it. It never reaches low enough to hit them. 
F+MP does well to move in on jab spam. Max range EX Oroshi does, too.
I don’t suggest jumping on a standing opponent, unless you’re predicting a fireball or something. For Chuns other pokes, you can usually get in and focus them, same for Hazan.
As for IA Tsurugi, I never really use it unless going over a projectile, a low, or while the opponent is in guard stun and expecting a tick throw. I’ve been jabbed out of it by boxer and swept out of it by Chun, so I feel your pains there…
I haven’t played a particularly great Chun with Mak yet, but it was pretty tough getting through her pokes and such. Luckily, the guy I played liked to end block strings with Sweep, so that was my chance to get in with a focus attack.
Chun bnb is c.lk x 2, ex legs. She has also a 3-frames jab. Makoto is not a jabber, but has good enough normals to deal with all this. My advice on the matchup:
- your ideal distance is away from her jab/short, where your pokes can still hit (s.mp etc). Put a crouching Chun in training mode and try your distances.
- Jump less. If really have to, you must not whiff. Or empty jump, to trip guard. Move with command normals, FA, dash.
- Basic defense against Chun involves blocking low and switching high for hasan shu. It is neutral on block, so if you think Chun will resume her low string, ex karakusa. I wouldn’t use it for anything else, it is really not so great.
“Getting in to ex kara” should never be your objective, imho. If you want to use kara, you have to tick into it.
thx for feedback guys. I tried empty jumping but her cr.hk was still hitting me. For example if I emptied jumped over her FB, she could cr.hk me out of the air. Also I had a bitch of a time trying to anti air her on shallow jump ins. It felt as if all her jumping attacks could stuff my cr.mk and st.mp. I found her j.hpx2 especially hard to AA.
I’ll mess around with max range EX Oroshi as well and see how that works. When I used it last night it was still losing to jab/short spam, but I wasn’t using it at max range (I was right in her face lol). What do you guys do when Chun neutral jumps after you close the distance. I have this problem in general with other characters but it’s especially bad with Chun because I often like to dash under the opponent. However her neutral j.hk prevents that.
As bad as the match was, it coulda been worse. Right now I’m of the opinion that Chun’s footsies pretty shit on Makotos at any range. The guy I played didn’t really use Chuns st.mp much and I don’t think Mak has an answer to that(?) either.
If she neutral jumps, use the proper Fukiage or Kara-Fukiage. If it hits clean, follow with: HP Fukiage > EX Tsurugi for 328 damage if you get both hits of EX Tsurugi. If the Fukiage trades, you can almost always land a MP Hayate for 200 damage total.