Starting to learn Cody, coming from a Sakura background so adjusting won’t be too difficult
Am I right in saying that Cody has a kara throw from f.hk?
Which throw is better to do with Cody for post throw setups/ambiguous crossups etc., forward or back? And what safejumps can he get off them?
Thanks
he has various kara throws (like all characters) but nothing too exciting.
the most simple setups are:
after a back throw, simply hold up forward + attack (most commonly j.hk for the hit/block stun and j.lp for a tick throw) and you do a 5+ (5 including). this works against sagat, cammy, yun non-ex, all of yangs, gen, dudley non ex, seth, and various more. if you don’t do any attack you land an empty save jump which is save against everything.
off a forward throw you need to walk a LITTLE TINY BIT (as soon as you see him move) and jump forward. a j.hp will ambigious crossup many characters and will avoid most reversals. if you do a forward throw in the corner, do a c.lk and fj.mk. this is an unblockable against some characters.
Just a few frame questions
What’s cl.hp, cr.hp, cr.lk and st.mk on block/hit
I was looking at that but I wasn’t sure if it was accurate
Cody’s kara throw isn’t off f.HK but simply just s.HK which means you can kara throw into back throw. It’s VERY useful and you should implement it into your game as it allows you to throw opponents from ranges you normally couldn’t (for example after a cl.HP) and it makes the opponent want to press buttons from an abnormal range (which is a good thing because then you can start frame trapping).
After a forward throw you walk for one frame and jump for a, if you time it frame perfect , 4 frame safe jump that will work on all characters except those that have 3 frame reversals. It won’t be ambiguous on any characters unless it’s in the corner where you have to do another frame perfect setup.
Do NOT use forward throw-> c.LK-> j.MK in the corner, that is a terrible setup and any good player will just forward dash out of that (can even be anti-aired). Don’t use it, it’s not good. If you do want to go for an ambiguous setup off a forward throw, you have to time it manually with a walk forward.
Cody’s only ambiguous setups are either, in the corner or off specific jump setups (from EX Ruffian knockdown for example). The majority of your Cody gameplay should be safe (safe jumps from most knockdowns, meaty Bad stones for chips etc).
cl.HP is: +1 on block/+6 on hit
c.HP is: -1 on block/ +4 on hit (try not to end a frame trap with c.HP, unless you’re cancelling it, because it’s negative on block)
c.LK is: -1 on block/-2 on hit (same as c.HP)
s.MK is: terrible on block and hit unless your cancelling it (cl.MK) and far MK doesn’t matter because it’s too far.
The normals you’ve asked about are good in their own way but the normals you should be focusing on are:
For frame traps
cl.HP: +1 on block/+6 on hit
s.LP & c.LP: +3 on block/+6 on hit & +2 on block/+6 on hit (respectively)
cl.MP (his most important normal): +4 on block/ +7 on hit
f.MP: +1 on block/ +6 on hit
EX Zonk: beats crouch techs and stand throw attempts (goes through basically every special and usually lets you punish), shouldn’t be abused but it’s a good option, especially when you have 3 bars.
For zoning
s.MP (far): good hitbox, decent startup
s.MK (far): beats all pokes during it’s active frames, slightly moves Cody forward, good for keeping the opponent away (puts Zangief outside LP SPD range when used at max distance)
s.LK (far): basically s.MK with quicker startup, a less prioritized hitbox, slightly less range and quicker recovery, should be used exactly like s.MK and it also put Zangief outside of LP SPD range when used at max distance)
s.HK (far): great poke that Cody has with lots of active frames, good for keeping opponents REALLY far (like Zangief) and the opponent usually walks into it lol.
Bad Stone: When used properly can make it difficult to get in on Cody (especially LP Bad Stone recovery)
For anti-airs
b.MP: most common used anti-air for Cody, can be empty jumped so make sure you know the range to use it ( my tutorial goes through this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8LPd5QB1IM )
s.HP: should be used at the range where b.MP can be empty jumped
c.MK: good for beating jumping normals that have horizontal hitboxes (try and avoid this type of anti-air since c.MK is unsafe on block AND hit)
s.HK (far): good for catching long range jump ins
s.HK (close): not very common but can be used as an anti-crossup anti-air
c.HP (with knife): must be done early (in AE 2012 it will startup in 7 frames so it will be easier to anti-air with)
s.LP (close): a good last minute anti-air and creates a mixup afterwards
HK Ruffian: the best anti-air Cody has! If you anticipate a jump in and time your HK Ruffian perfectly, it’ll be all jump ins
For footsies
c.LK: 3 frame normal, amazing range and cancellable? Need I say more! Great poke for whiff punishes and buffering
f.MP: moves Cody forward, beats most normals when active, links into U2, c.HP and c.HK on counter hit and can be used to whiff punish (takes immaculate spacing though)
f.HK: do NOT abuse this normal to move Cody forward, it can be whiff punished severely however, that said, it’s great for hopping over lows and occasionally moving Cody forward. Also: Try and learn to hit confirm f.HK into: EX Criminal Upper or MK Ruffian (I’m still learning)
c.MK: max range only! decent startup and decent damage for quite an easy whiff punishing normal, it has good range as well.
c.HK: can be used to whiff punish, punishable from most ranges (although it’s rare that it’ll be punished anywhere near max range)
c.HP: can be buffered into all specials and has a good hitbox on startup that beats a lot of pokes (Fei Longs c.HP for example)
f.HP: Cody’s overhead, quite slow so not to be abused but good damage and ridiculous range, use it sparingly.
c.LP: this poke beats like everything lol! Buffer into MK Ruffian outside of your opponents poking range. (**EVERY! **Cody needs to learn, perfect and use this normal, it’s one of Cody’s best tools and options for almost ANY situation)
Anyway, I could expand on everything but that would take too much time. This is just a brief on Cody, hope it helps.
this is not true, you can do it midscreen just fine (test it on ryu. works 100% on him). the only exception is when you throw the opponent OUT OF the corner (cody with the back to the corner) as this will alter the throw range (from 1 square in trainings room to 2). still nice post overall :).
If you’re aiming for the 4/5 frame safe jump then the jump in will not be ambiguous, it’ll just hit really deep and late (which looks weird) but it’ll never even look like it crosses up **BUT **if you walk forward for a bit longer THEN it’ll be slightly ambiguous. This doesn’t work on many characters because they can alter their hitboxes with normals (such as shoto c.MK) but characters like Balrog and Guile hate this shet lol!
And thanks :3
there are many possibilities to avoid mixup, that doesn’t make it less viable tho. it always depends on the situation and the player you face. to actual BE ambiguous overall is more effective then safejumping only (or crossuping respectively). this is in particular effective when you mix the safe jump with the crossup setup since both lok VERY alike and will punish wrong behaviour from the opponent. I know you know it, but sometimes your words sound like you doom such things to be never used at all, which could lead some readers to take it TOO literally. I see it like bad spray. nothing that can be abused, but it shouldn’t be forgotten either.
Thanks for the write up Packz!
Also we must play sometime 
Lots of good info there from Packz. I just wanna add, I love when anti-air HK ruffian trades. It can combo into things like (dash) MK ruffian, and even U1 (corner only I think). It’s usually better to trade than not; obviously, not if It’ll kill you.
There’re some things I completely dismiss because I’ve already used and moved on from them and then there’s things that are just plain bad and shouldn’t be used at all (like forward throw-> c.LK-> j.MK). I do dismiss things that I think shouldn’t be used because it can give players bad habits (especially if they’re new to the game/character). I used to ALWAYS EX Zonk. I never threw you and I got that bad habit from playing too many bad players online who weren’t punishing it or always pressed buttons and then when I played good players, who didn’t mash on crouch tech and knew how to punish, I got destroyed.
That is my main reason for dismissing a lot of things that others may THINK is useful, so they don’t pick up bad habits. And when they’ve got to the point where they can try stuff out without making it a bad habit, THEN you can try all the ambiguous stuff. Tbh anyway, Cody isn’t really an ambiguous character, outside of the corner and with the exception of setups SPECIFICALLY looked to be ambiguous (for example the EX Ruff setup on Sagat).
That aside, it’s much better to just play a safer game and take risks where they’re needed instead of attempting to be super ambiguous all the time and losing because of it. If you** DO** want to try out a different style or setups etc. Do it online where it doesn’t matter and if you find it’s a good setup then start using it in tournament.
Other than that, stay safe. You criminals! >=]
well even c.lk => j.mk is viable. it’s as viable as doing a cl.hp on wakeup against a character with a decent reversal. playing safe will bring you a great distance to victory, but not the whole way. you NEED to take risks once in a while or your opponent can simply outplay you. opening up the opponent and staying unexpected is a crucial and vital part in a match. and if the ryu only blocks and late techs on wakeup unless he has 2 bars then hell, I’ll use that setup. Bad habits die hard, I agree that it’s best to avoid getting them in the first place, but that won’t happen if you just started to play. you’ll realize eventually that it’s actually a bad habit and start to change it. And I don’t think that this specific setup will grow to a bad habit. one should just know it’s not safe and have a word of warning; bashing it won’t help that matter IMO. keeping any setup in mind is always useful. Widsom is one of the most important keyfactors in any game, just the abillity to resort to if needed makes you bigger thread allready. like c.lp xx lp cu, u2. it’s situational and won’t happen often, but it can mean the difference between winning and losing.
moreover, you’re very right that you should start with a basis and the fundamentals before trying advanced stuff and making it into a habit.
and ofc you shouldn’t test new technology in a tournament.^^
What you’re saying is right, yes, you NEED to take risks to win that’s basically how almost any form of competition works but what you’re going into is risk/reward.
First off let me say that forward throw-> c.LK-> j.MK is REALLY bad and I wouldn’t be dismissing this, or repeating it, if I didn’t know so. You will absolutely not get away with attempting that against any good player. They’ll see that it’s a terribly timed jump in and simply anti-air, dash forward etc. That really ISN’T viable and I wouldn’t recommend it to anyone. (Not to mention playing against opponents who know the Cody matchup will just know that’s not a safe jump).
Next up is cl.HP on wakeup against a character with a decent reversal. I’ll tell you why this isn’t a “bad” or “stupid” risk. The player on the ground is at a HUGE disadvantage compared to the player who isn’t. The reason this is, is because they can’t do anything. You have at least a second to think about your next move, have the option to: block and try and bait something, stand just inside throw range to bait a throw, frame trap, throw, safe jump and probably more. Your opponents options are limited to: block and try and reset the situation to neutral, RISK teching a throw and opening up a possibility to be frame trapped, backdash or (if he hasn’t got two bars to make it safe) risk a reversal.
The best option for the opponent would be just to block because that involves the least risk and at worst he’d take another throw or chip damage, the worst option the opponent has is to throw out a reversal which, if it lands, most likely resets the situation (unless it’s a stupid character like Yun, Seth or someone lol). However, if it’s baited, the opponent takes 30-50% damage. Who’s in the favour in this situation, Cody using cl.HP on the opponents wakeup (which isn’t THAT much of a risk due to the many other options you can choose from) or the opponent throwing out a reversal and hoping for the best?
Similar to c.LP-> LP Criminal Upper-> (Random) U2. I’ve been through that phase and I used to do it all the time but the risk/reward with that heavily in the opponents favour (especially if they know the Cody matchup). The reasons that is a terrible choice is: 1. LP CU is -5 on block and can be punished, so it won’t work on opponents who can time their punishes and 2. What if the opponent just decides to block? It may work on players you’re used to but when you play somebody completely new, it’s a dull and risky tactic.
My overall point is, your general gameplan should be safe. I did say “it’s much better to just play a safer game and take risks where they’re needed,” i didn’t dismiss taking risks. It’s actually impossible to play WITHOUT taking risks, since almost everything can be punished in some way or another but playing with MINIMAL risk is what makes players better then others.
For an example of a player who almost ALWAYS plays risky, even when he doesn’t need to, is Poongko. He does random DPs for no reason when he has the life lead and, although it looks good when it lands, when it doesn’t he just looks foolish and Fuudo done well to expose him by playing a much less risky gameplan at Evo.
That said, there’re many situations where it’s almost IMPOSSIBLE to win by playing safe. Cody-Dhalsim or Cody-Guile for example. There’re characters you simply **HAVE **to take risks on because they force you to. Same with when you’re in a losing situation and have to take bigger risks than usual to win (and where your opponent should take note of this and try and bait you into those big risks, that’s where something like LP Criminal Upper-> (Random) U2 would be baited.)
As proof, of playing safer and taking risks when necessary improving your game, since I’ve stopped relying solely on EX Zonk frame traps and have implemented more throws and non-EX Zonk frame traps I have been more successful in weekly tournaments and have a much more solid Cody. Heck! For even more proof just watch how most of the top players play.
And good talk, nice and clean :3
I agree with Ice_Rei. I try to be even MORE safe than usual. theres very few situations where i feel the need to do ex zonk. throws can be teched, normals and specials can be blocked. command throws can be neutral jumped. by working on this general defensive game, you become such a better player and can more easily transition to other characters/games.
Cody does have some gimmicks that he can use, but in general, he is not a gimmicky character. You can win with just a solid defensive zoning game.
I think you misunderstund c.lk xx lp cu, u2 tho. you combo u2, not doing it randomly. and it can be a viable option depending on the situation when the risk / reward ratio is in your favor. and I don’t think that a sparsely used unblockable setup will be avoided all the time, by every good player. it’s like saying you can block every burn kick shenanigans and act accordingly. it won’t happen in the long run; we’re humans and it’s not AS obvious as you make it.
I don’t know one cody alike, every player plays differently, but imo they take even take greater risks often. you sound like rather the defensive type, who zones alot, which is fine, I play more on being unreadable and explosive; ofc we all need to change our gameplan when facing a different type of player and character.
btw taking a shoryuken for a cl.hp or a unblockable try is the same “risk”, you get nearly the same reward, but having a greater chance of actual hitting - even against good/top players (I’ve seen my share). I don’t say the setup is anywhere near ‘useful’ persé, but it’s an OPTION to keep in mind. I’d rather know it and never use it, then not knowing it at all.
it’s not enough to be consistently. you bring the sugar and the dough, but it’s not a cake yet. if you know what I mean. there are many characters that can outfootsie you.
btw2: wtf @huge text. I like it : D props for that.
its not the same risk at all. a blocked shoryuken means a full combo. a blocked cl.hp leaves you at +1.
you misunderstood, if you get reversaled with a srk when doing a cl.hp or when you try to use that unblockable is the same result. maybe I was unclear, my bad.
lol :3
I thought you meant c.LK-> LP-> Criminal Upper (on BLOCK)-> (Random) U2. If you were talking about finishing a round with U2 after LP Criminal Upper has landed then that’s a different story but that’s not really a risk at all if you’ve already landed the LP Criminal Upper and want to K.O the opponent. I’ve done it in tournament and won a round. There’s nothing wrong with that and it shouldn’t really fall into this debate because it’s viable if the opponent has low enough health to finish the round. There’s not even any risk/reward because it’s completely your favour (if you’ve judged the amount of health correct that is).
I would NEVER use that setup and advise nobody to use it for that exact reason. EVERY good player, and I mean EVERY single one, will definitely avoid that without fail. It’s not even a meaty jump in, they can just hold up. If anybody tried that on me I’d just dash forward or b.MP. Even if it DOES miraculously hit, it hits so high on the head that you most likely won’t be able to hit confirm.
If you want a good setup use EX Ruffian-> Double Dash-> j.MK or j.HP (on some characters not all),. That’s a good setup because the opponent ALWAYS has to block that. There’s no getting out of it because it hits meaty, it whiffs reversals and they have to guess which way to block (and in Yun and Yangs case j.MK is unblockable so they can’t even guess right).
I’m not talking from watching and seeing things work against good/top players, I’m talking from EXPERIENCING it against good/top players. EX Ruffian ALWAYS works whereas a really bad jump in won’t. And it’s definitely obvious to see. I could see that it was bad just from watching the video and the dude was telling me it wasn’t bad so I had to record a video of my own showing why it was.
For the opposite reason, landing a cl.HP allows 200+ damage if they don’t block, is +1 when they do block (where you can frame trap or throw after they block it) and on counter hit allows 300+ damage. The unblockable, if it miraculously hits, will allow JUST under 200 damage (unless you can hit confirm with like 2 jabs), is negative on block (because it hits so high) and you won’t be landing it on counterhit (or you shouldn’t).
A character can’t outfootsie you my friend, only a player. And Cody has some of the best pokes in the game and can keep up with many other characters (especially that c.LP buffer!) Playing safe isn’t gonna lose you games, even if a character has better pokes than you.
Also, on the same note, the reason forward throw-> c.LK-> j.MK would create bad habits for players is the fact that, if it works, you’ll think it’s viable and it REALLY isn’t. I remember slightly timing my jump wrong against Andreas (the best Rufus in the UK and Europe) and I got EX Snake Striked all the way to the other corner lol. <— Doesn’t feel good xD!
Also, I don’t have a playstyle “type” I’m just safe and take risks when necessary (or after I’ve set my opponent up). I play defensive when it’s necessary (if I have the life lead, against Bison, Blanka, Boxer etc) and I rush down and take risks when necessary (against Guile, Dhalsim, Yun, Seth etc). I don’t stick to one style of play but the different styles I do play, I make sure it’s safe and not too risky. :3