Lets End This! the MvC3 X-23 Combo/Strategy Thread

Classic Fighting Games Ultimate Marvel VS Capcom 3
861

So found a new combo option. Haven’t found anything absolutely amazing from it yet, but I think it might be worth looking into.

So the short version is that you can link a dH after a TA M that has passed through your opponent.

Sadly, it doesn’t look like this can be used for relaunches because of how garbage the dH is (10 frames recovery after grounded makes it where I don’t think anything will link.) You can link an up TAC after the dH and if you can get it frame perfect you can get the up TAC launch without changing characters, but I think they always just tech out.

The only kinda cool thing I’ve found for this is you can do S+ Cold star fast j.hxxTA M(passes through) dH (if you’re low enough down it will catch the last 1 or 2 hits from cold star and then relaunch. Drones can work too and probably any assist that’s really slow and wide. If you do a CS L xx TA M (pass through) dH s.LMH etc that work as well. Obviously, this only works midcreen since TA M won’t pass through them in the corner but I still think there’s some more tech to be squeezed from it.

In XF 1 you can relaunch off it midscreen, too.

@Truzen: As far as I can tell for getting Cold star to let you hit a WXP. If you’re in the corner, they float much higher so if the combo is too long they’ll tech before they fall into the WXP. It seems to me to be just hitstun deterioration. It’s muuuuch more lenient midscreen since it’s not a matter of them falling into the WXP as much as just being held there until she hits them.

862

I see. So it’s not wise to do it in the corner? I guess the bad thing within it is that all of her long combos bring the opponent to the corner, right?

EDIT: Another question:
I dont know if I will be able to make the long loop combos using Ammy’s assist. I will try to use Ammy to keep the opponent blocking after I start a block string. Then, after a dive kick, for example, I will have to use the two weak attacks c/s.L+Ammy’s assist > c/s.M before start a long combo to give time to Ammy’s projectile hit the opponent.

With this strategy, If I get a hit on the opponent, I will not be able to make these long combos because the weak attacks and Ammy’s assist will reduce the untechable time of the opponent.

Do you kow a way to, if the oponnent block my attack, keep him blocking with assistance and, if he does not block, don’t reduce the untechable time? I guess it’s Impossible to confirm the hit to know when call the assistance or not. Then I need to call it after every blocked or hit attacks right?

If make the combos is not possible with this strategy, then how can I use Ammy’s assist to help X-23 when she gets the momentum?

863

Ammy works fine for combos extension, it’s just that you’ll have to really shorten your combo before your first launch if you’re wanting to go into WXP. It still works decently for extension otherwise, you just have to learn the timing since if you hit too soon they won’t actually launch from cold star. (There might be some interesting stuff if you relaunch with cold star > really early S xx TK special > something.) I haven’t messed around with it so I don’t know of anything cool off hand, but def. worth taking a few minutes to see if there’s anything there.

As far as using it in neutral, it is going to hurt the damage and hitstun scaling so you would have to either have a 2nd assist that will let you relaunch no matter what (untechable assists for X23: ground/wall bounce/otg + Charged NS) or have some good resets on deck.

Since it leaves them on the ground you can use X23s stair relaunch to fill the gap in damage. Just find a combo you like that leaves your opponent grounded (no CS, no s.c.H) before launch. Basic go to would be something like cold star hits > Charged NS > dash jump dHxxTA L > s.MS > stair relaunch and as long as you have something that gives her the 3rd untechable relaunch I’m pretty sure she can get to 900k or maybe 1mil with the right DHC.

[media=youtube]ClTR7xY5_gw[/media]

864

Your assists seems like mine. The diference is that I use Cold Star to lockdown and Katanarama as combo extension.

This stair combo only works on corner as far I could see here on lab. What do you do when you are on mid screen?

865

Katanarama works fine for the 2nd assist since it gives you a ground bounce. You can do the stair midscreen but it’s not super practical (at all) since you have to space each character differently to not pass through. For midscreen I would just go with any ol’ bnb. The best I could muster with a little lab time was ~730 for one meter.

I would start mixing s.L+cold star, s.MxxMF M (if you’re not already) since it will make them have to block the whole assist on the opposite side. Then you can mix it up even further with MF L once you get in their head. Just to make your pressure that much more unpredictable.

You have a ton of options with cold star but to maximize damage you need to try to knock them out of the assist asap to reduce scaling.

The best I could come up with for midscreen was:
s.LL+assist, s.M (2 hits and slight pause while assist starts hitting) s.HxxMF HxxCS LxxTA L land, s.M(1 hit)HxxMF HxxCS LxxTA L land, s.M(1 hit)HS, sj.MMHdHxxCS Hxx TA L, land, katanarama+Charged NS, s.S, sj.HxxCS HxxTA L, land, Charge ASxxRT (~731 with RT, ~814 with DHC to Okami Shuffle)

You can also do some goofy stuff like:

s.LL+ammy, s.MxxMF MxxTA M, falling j.LL land, cr.LMH, etc. (hard and pointless, but I thought i looked cool. :P) This can also be used to make a really good standing reset point since if you alter the timing just a bit on the falling j.LL land cr. L it will actually drop the combo and they won’t get a tech option.

s.LL+ammy, s.M, cr.MSxxTK Charged NS or TK MF L/M/H. More pointless stuff, but since ammy won’t let you launch, you can use the TK things after the S to do stuff you wouldn’t normally be able to do. Just keep in mind that if you use any SxxTK options, they’re considered in a launch state so you can’t use j.S or air TA L without getting a hard knockdown.

[media=youtube]icp0YJu5cT0[/media]

866

Thanks man. Your answers are godlike.
Sorry for only ask and not being able to contribute. I don’t have enought fighting game knowledge, and less UMVC3 knowledge.

867

Lol, no worries, dood. We all started somewhere.

Helping you gives me a break from grinding out my Magneto combos, anyways (gotta start working on some resets and I think I’ll be ready for real matches with him.) Being a lab geek is my favorite thing and I’ve been missing from the board lately so I feel like I gotta catch up.

868

What is this " MSxxTK"?

869

Short Answer:
cr.M, s.S cancelled (xx) into a Tiger Knee’d (TK) special move (NS = Neck Slicer and the ‘MH’ was supposed to be a MF** for Mirage Feint).

And the answer to the short answer (just a heads up, this is gonna get really nerdy, so I’ll try to explain it as best I can. Sorry if you already know all this. I’m sure someone can get some use out of it and I can’t get to sleep anyways.):

First part is explaining the number notations (just in case anyone hasn’t seen it already), 2nd part is explaining Tiger Knee’ing, 3rd part explains launcher cancelling, and the 4th part is putting it all together to answer your question (this turned out to be a long freaking post.)

Number notations yet for directional inputs:
If you see someone write 214 L, they’re saying do a Mirage Feint L (2 = down, 1 = down back, 4 = back, this makes sense if you have a NUMPAD on your keyboard).
623 L would be a dragon punch L. (6 = forward, 2 = down , 3 = down forward)
2369 L would be a Tiger Knee’d Neck Slicer or Tiger Knee’d Talon Attack L depending on how fast you press the L.

Normally, Tiger Knee’ing is when you do a special move but end in a up-forward (9) or up-back (7) direction so that you can do an air special move as low to the ground as possible. This only works because the game has some leniency in reading the inputs. When you put in 2369 L, it read the 236 as a quarter circle forward and stores that, then reads the 9 as a jump, but once it gets the L input, it will give you a very low talon attack instead of a j.L. The reason this is useful is that it’s much faster to do 2369 L than it would be to do 9 to jump and then a 236 L just because of the physical motion. (TK TA L is really great for pressure since there’s so much hitstun on the Talon Attack and it’s much harder to react to close to the ground.)

So now, Launcher Canceling:
Normally, You can only superjump after a lauch but with how the game handles jumps (the first 3 frames of a ‘jump’ you’re actually still on the ground) if you tiger knee a motion fast enough the game will register the up-forward as a jump, but then cancel those 3 pre-jump frames into a ground special move (if you’ve messed around with Dante any, this is how his Bold Cancel options work). Sometimes you’ll see this called launcher cancelling if you’re using this to do something after an S. I don’t know if there’s an official term for it, though, since it’s not used that often. This only works on hit since you can’t super jump out of an S on block or whiff.

So for those random S xx TK Neck Slicer ammy combos:
s.LL+Ammy, s.M, cr.M s.S xx TK Charged NS (2369 L or down, down-forward, forward, up-forward L) will let you ‘launch’ them with an S while Cold Star keeps them near the ground, then hit them with a charged NS. You can just as easily use a s.HxxCharged NS, though. I was just being dumb, Lol.

You can see the difference if you do the s.LL+ammy, s.M cr. M S xx TK MF H (2147 H) j.MS and it will spike them to the ground into a hard knockdown even through you’re really low to the ground. If you just used cr.M s.H xx MF H j.MS they would be left in the air like normal.

You’ll very rarely use this technique as X-23, but there’s a few assists like Tasky’s vertical arrows or Striders Vajra that she can use that to extend a bit. Launcher cancelling with assists like that lets you abuse the fact that S launchers have a ton of hitstun on them and do stuff like S+vertical arrow (arrows hit them at the top of the launch and knock them back down to X23)xx TK Charged NS to get a spinning state into another launch. Dormammu uses this all over the place in his advanced combos for stalking flare juggles since it lets him teleport up the them and get a hard knockdown into a 2nd super.

Seperate from ALLLLL this nonsense, I would recommend learning how to Tiger Knee X23’s Crescent Scythe (62369 H) attacks since the game has a wierd thing where it will let you cancel into a Talon Attack from a TK CS faster than if you did a regular CS. If you do a TK CS H you can actually cancel at any point rather than having to wait for the full animation.

870

Y’know, I can’t really figure out why X-23 has to TK Crescent Scythe to make the cancel come out earlier. Is it intentional or a glitch? I feel it’s an unnecessary execution requirement but I practise doing it during combos anyway due to the big damage damage it grants you.

871

Yeah, beats me too. Luckily, playing on hitbox, it’s an easy thing to hit the jump along with any attack buttons so it’s not really a hinderance.

I have to assume it’s unintentional and just came from them adding the CSxxTA in ultimate. Seems unnecessarily complicated, imo.

872

Does this Tiger Knee’d CS helps to execute the TA of that part of those combo?

873

Yup, that’s right.

874

Hey guys, apparently I am quite dumb. I’ve been using cr.M st.H MFC st.MH MFC j.MMHS Talon L st.MHS for quite a while as my ground combo, and apparently it reduces like crazy. I was getting a lot of damage off it still, but that was because of Nemesis assist. I’m now in the market for something that does more damage and has enough hitstun left to allow me a relaunch from Rapid Slash. I got cr.M st.H MFC j.M dH CS+L TA+L, catch them into launcher (I am actually able to do two loops of that guy, but way too much hitstun for Vergil relaunch, and frankly I’m not consistent at two loops of it yet), and the obvious but annoying cr.M st.HHHHHS. So, this is awkward, but I’m looking to shorten my old BnB, and still keep some semblance of damage, so my one relaunch off Rapid Slash can kill some people. Any ideas?

875

^^^in your old combo, did you mean mirage faint H for the 2nd “MFC”? if so, instead of j.MMHS TA-L st.MHS, you can do j.MH CS-L TA-L st.MHS

you could also look at my combo video and choose which one you want.

876

I didn’t Mirage Feint H, I cancelled again and just jumped. I’ll check it out, I’m just looking to see what has little enough hitstun deterioration to actually allow Vergil assist to relaunch with an ankle slice, too much and they flip out before s.S hits.

Thanks for the suggestion. I am able to lab later today. I’ll have something.

877

This isn’t really important and I keep forgetting to post it, but one day I was wondering if X-23 would be able to do those TAC resets I keep seeing from Filipino Champ and Tokido. Taking Merkyl’s SJ-height combo, I added one plus one and it surprisingly works.
Although I’ve been using sj.S instead of sj.H, bringing a character down from launcher height is possible in the corner. The trick is to hit with sj.L right after a launcher (when both characters are still going up) and slowly chain it to sj.S. X-23’s body will prevent the opponent from flipping out of the corner and the S will connect regardless of direction they’re teching. But like many other M Talon combos, the timing for most of it varies depending on character and the direction they tech. It also works on all characters (except RR, but he doesn’t need to reset in the first place). Done correctly, it’s very hard to react to this reset as the L and S will come out very close to each other.
So yeah, not too sure how useful or practical this reset is, but it’s a little bit more of X-23 tech and even although I haven’t tried it in matches much, I didn’t feel like it was particularly hard to pull off.

Here’s Merkyl’s SJ-combo again for those who don’t want to search for it.
[spoiler=[media=youtube]5GrnHHNvtSk[/media]

878

you put the spoiler tag on wrong or something.

879

[media=youtube]5GrnHHNvtSk[/media]

The answer is yes, it’s good, and it’s pretty practical. I’ve been apply it to my game for a few months now, lol. I actually still use sj.H as the meaty starter, but I should give sj.S a try as well.

There are two opportunities for height adjustment in the combo: how late you cancel into M-Talon, and how late you cancel the falling j.M into j.S. The height is more lenient than it seems - you just need to bring them low enough for j.M to connect. The combo does need to be adjusted on the fly vs. differently weighted characters, so practice.

A few things you have to remember is that they actually have to be trying to block TAC for it to work, which means you should also have actual TAC combos in your gameplan - I’ve noticed that “smarter/patient” players will not block TAC the first time, or even the first few times. IRL strat only, you can usually tell if your opponent is trying to block TAC just by seeing movement in your peripheral vision (unless they’re so smart, they’re mashing on unmapped buttons - not even joking).

Bonus content: if they’ve blocked the meaty sj.H, d.H, do not cancel into M-Talon, which can be throw punished. Instead, let yourself fall a little longer, and cancel into L-Talon. If they push a button, they’ll get hit, and you can combo. If they pushblock the L-Talon, you get a guard break airthrow. If they patiently block everything, I believe you’ll be at disadvantage, so be careful. I believe the safest option if they block the reset is to let the d.H fall all the way to the ground, but it might still be possible to get punished. You can also cancel d.H into H-Talon, which will allow to block no matter what, but you’ll be falling like a rock all the way from SJ height, opening yourself up to a mixup.

880

You could do the TAC reset into a combo as mentioned above and you can also go for a front grab which lets you combo if you have the right assist.