Yea her teleport puts her in front of you instead of behind if you are in the corner.
I meant in my above post to snap in phoenix and kill her with dirt nap when you get 4 meters before she has 5.
also, her fireballs only barely travel far enough to hit you from a super jump at full screen, so a really good way to avoid chip damage is that when she shoots the balls, super jump, so the balls follow you in the air to the top of the screen and than d. H so they have to come back down to the bottom of the scree, youll see them do a little S shaped path trying to catch you and that will ensure that they time out before they get to you.
Yeah she would be impossible if that was the case. Capcom was thinking about balance to some degree when they made her. They weren’t just like “let’s just put in a character that has no strategy to be defeated”. They probably overdid a few things (the healing factor and X Factor) but other than that both versions of Phoenix are characters you can definitely base strategies around. Right now people only have strategies for fighting regular Phoenix and that’s why people are dying to Dark Phoenix. Their only strategy against D.Phoenix is to not bring her out or put the stick down if she does come out. People went through the phase of acting like Sentinel was some unbeatable force and now it’s the Dark Phoenix phase.
Unfortunately without the Japanese regularly playing the game at the arcades the development of high level strategies in this game is really slow. Which powerful characters like Phoenix/Dark Phoenix take advantage of players with weak strategies easily. Which was the same case for Sentinel.
Yeah if you can find a way to build 4 meters before she gets 5 that could definitely be a viable strategy. I guess it depends on who is on your team.
Advanced combos 4 and 5 are exactly the same except for a hyper tacked on at the end. Seems pointless to list twice like that.
Lol damn, thanks for that. took out one of them =p
I remember someone a while back mentioned about holding down S the whole time you’re playing X23 to make her FHC (feint hold cancel) game easier to utilize. I figured it would be too cumbersome to use and figured my execution with it doing it by pressing and holding the buttons each time was good enough but of course in tournament at the absolute times you need the combo to hit it drops. Which of course I went into training mode and started messing around with just holding S the whole time I’m playing 23 and I’m starting to like it a lot. Like I can just go around turning all of my normals safe on block or whiff whenever I want without having to sit there and watch a normal whiff first or anything like that. Like one of the problems I was having was trying to get in range to land a s.M into combo and sometimes I would just be right out of range and whiff. With the S hold cancel if I see myself whiff s.M at all I can hopefully on reaction motion qcb+L and hold L to cancel the whiff recovery of the s.M.
There’s pretty much like no reason to not do this I figure now because it ensures that you pretty much wont drop the FHC combos on hit unless you just totally get really lazy with your inputs. Even if you’re trying to like do a mirage feint all you have to do is just make sure you tap the attack button instead of holding it and it will still feint even though you’re holding S. Once I get adjusted to it I think this little trick alone will make playing 23 a lot easier. You’ll always have access to the feint cancel game without having to press 2 buttons together anytime and it means you can just create safe block strings and make everything safe on whiff just cuz you want to.
That was probably me :lol: holding down the bottom left button isn’t a big deal for me IMO. Its always nice to have access to that power haha… especially for punishing assists! Its good for s.M too because I think that is a great move, aside from being so bad on whiff… comboing s.M into itself is a little tricky but I think its a valuable tactic to practice and implement in the long term.
I’m pretty sure that doing some s.H feint cancels after landing Akuma tatsu assist is the best way to squeeze more damage out of that combo without having to take to the air, too. I’ll have to test it out because tatsu scales hitstun pretty bad, as does s.H… but it’d be nice if you could get the same damage as tatsu assist, jump up H xx 236L, s.M without the difficulty and unreliability.
edit: you can do 3 s.Hs. it is stronger than going air to air too
I dont know why I didn’t think about that…
The reason I didn’t hold S was because I was having issues going into H fient
After the feint cancel combo I can never remember to let go (I play pad)
But if just tapping hard gets me the feint while holding S then it makes it much easier 
Also, I’m unsure because I’ve just started this but how are you guys managing 1mil+ damage with the dhc glitch?
I’m using trish low voltage into wxp then round harvest but round harvest takes them so high so all I do is lay hopscotches (3) and all I get is 859k
Can I get more with round harvest?
You might be able to SJ up and do a combo into Hyper, but you’d need two bars for that. Basically, best results are to DHC into a character that sends them up into spin state but doesn’t connect so you juggle them.
Maybe Trish could combo into Round Harvest, get X-23 to whiff WXP somehow and she could land a juggle, but it wouldn’t be a lot of damage, that’s the problem.
If you’re playing X23 and Trish you’re better off putting people in situations where they’re forced to block the round harvest then set up unblockables. Watch the matches I played against the Viper/Dante/Trish player in the video thread to get some ideas. You can still do the DHC reset for extra damage because 859k is still nothing to sleep on and can kill top tier characters like Magneto and Ammy. It’s just you wont be able to kill the likes of Wesker or Dormammu at the start of the round without a better follow up character.
Speaking of X-23 and Trish, inspired by a player called Bashi, I was able to create this combo with my team of X-23/Trish/Dante. This combo is probably character specific, only tested on Captain America though.
Same 10stars starter(I’m getting bored of copy-pasting this lol): L, M, H>qcb+H, J.M, J.H, air D.H>qcf+L(land), M(1 hit), H>qcb+H, J.M, J.M, J.H(land), J.M, J.M, J.H, J.S>qcf+L(land), H,S(super jump), J.M, J.M, J.H, air D.H>qcf+L(call Dante’s Jam Session), fully charged Medium Ankle Slicer>Weapon X Prime.
DHC into Trish’s Round Harvest. Then tag in Dante and do the following: (as soon as Dante finishes his tag animation)Acid Rain(qcf+L, qcf+L)x2, S, J.S, dash, Cold Shower(df+HHH)>F+H(Stinger)>S+attack(Bold Move)>air qcf+L, qcf+L(The Hammer) into BeeHive(f, d, df+M, f, d, df+M) into Million Dollars(qcf+any two attack buttons.)
You only need 1 bar to start off with initially to DHC because X-23’s combo will give 1 bar and you can DHC. Dante’s combo will give you 2 bars, that’s a guarantee. So when you finish with Million Dollars, you still have 1 bar left.
1,285,000 damage. 142 hits. Does 1.1mil damage before Million Dollars. So you can kill Wesker and below and gain 2 bars LOL.
*Notes
Keep an eye on how the opponent falls during Acid Rain because they may fall left or right and you may have to reverse the command of your second Acid Rain depending on which side they fall on. It’s possible to add another Acid Rain, don’t know how it would affect hitstun decay though and it’s finicky since it’s quite random whether or not you can connect another a 3rd. The funny thing is, I actually screwed this combo up because I cancelled the second BeeHive too early so the very first hit didn’t conenct, only the kicks. So this isn’t the true damage. Doesn’t matter anyway, anything dies.
Usually, the S, J.S part will put them in the corner even if they switch sides. However, it may not happen, so if you end up not putting them in the corner, you have to Cold Shower, then Bold Move cancel into Dante’s teleport, then Hammer, then go on from there so you can land it midscreen.
Don’t use this on a Phoenix team, you will give them loads of meter(almost 4 bars lol.)
EDIT: Adding a third Acid Rain to this brings it up to 1.3mil and 149 hits.
Thx guys!
I’m so silly, if I read the whole dhc glitch thread I would have saw, that someone else had the same problem
I’ve decided to just go into Hsein kos tenrai ha hyper right after round harvest which brings me to 910k which I’m more than happy with (even though its 3 meters)
As soon I get the chance ill watch the vids that you’re talking about dj
It’s great cause I get to see x23 play and round harvest setups
I have a question: Are there any real advantages to even usiing her MFC? It seems like something she doesn’t even need, just an extra tool. However, the TC lists it as something she NEEDS to make her competitive. I’m just wondering what does this add to her game.
If I’m reading MFC correctly (mirage feint cancel), then yeah it can be really useful. Being able to just throw out standing without the huge risk it would normally carry makes her suddenly have a long range, hitconfirmable anti air that’s safe on whiff AND block and can even combo into itself for decent damage. And this doesn’t just apply to standing H, it really applies to any normal (standing M MFC seems like it’d be pretty useful as a ground poke imo).
I’m not personally consistent with it yet, but I’ve seen DevilJin apply it in matches to some effect (though it was only in combos from what I recall. I’d love to see somebody start messing around with standing H’s applications in general)
It’s not really the focus of the character or anything, but I think something as flexible as unconditionally canceling the endlag of your normals seems like something to explore.
X23 is such a bare bones character without the feint cancels it’s ridiculous. Like if you aren’t using them you might as well just be using Wolverine. You get to do the same shit, get more health, and your character looks meaner and more ferocious.
I mean…in my videos I guess a lot of the time you would just see it in combos because well…that’s the whole point. It allows you to just throw s.H around the place and if it hits it becomes a combo. Basically what you’re doing is turning a high priority, big anti air hit box move into an attack that’s plus 12 on block, can easily be cancelled into a L or M mirage feint to get around advance guard and if it hits it pretty much just gives you combos. The only other regular application you’re going to get out of the s.H cancels is getting another viable anti air but s.M anti airs just as well and is safer to throw out in general. If someone calls like a bad assist like Akuma tatsu (which you can see in some of my earlier videos) you can just start s.H MFCing until they pushblock you away to do big damage to the assist. If you’re afraid of them pushblocking you you can just launch the assist up in the air and do more damage and move away from the point character.
Her ability to frame trap just goes through the roof once you learn this stuff. It’s just like in SFIV when people complained that Cammy had no overhead game and her mix up was bland. Though once they learned how her frame trap game was ridiculous she just went up. In one of the videos I put up there’s a few parts where I’m playing against Steve H’s Wolverine and I put him into frame traps with the s.H MFC. Knowing that he’s probably going to try to poke me with a c.L (and he probably had no idea that i was plus 11 or 12 on block) I did an instant air d+H which instantly brought me up and above his c.L and then came down on top of it and that was all I needed to land DHC reset death combo on Wolverine.
Actually…to be truthful in that video I think I just L mirage feint instead of MFCing because people are so afraid of pressing buttons that you can just slip a L feint in then jump on top of their crouch normal. The only way to counter that technique is to keep blocking or anti air it with a standing L attack which loses to the plus 12 frame trap H or poking with your own c.L. It’s the small things about X23 that are going to make her a lot better that NOBODY is doing.
A lot of the reason I probably dont do it more in block strings is because the level of play in general in this game is still rather low and people still push block EVERYTHING. So I never really need to frame trap a whole lot with it since I can easily just slip in a L or M feint and just go to town when people mash on advance guard.
ok sorry to digress from the mfc discussion which i greatly enjoy but
v.joe i’ve never fought one but he looked so hard for x
like he justs runs away and boomarangs you to death, it looked so hard to get a hit on him
i’ll have to watch again to see how well tatsu was using his assists(which I assume he was doing)
but those who have experience is it as tough as it looked?
you have Hsien-ko assist…
- wavedash in
2.block+call assist - ???
- Profit
no no, not me, I’ve never had the pleasure to kick his little ass
but on the wnf stream tatsu played one and it just looked frustratingly difficult
sorry I should have stated that I didn’t want ask the question in the vid thread and for got to reference it lol
Well luckily unlike Dormammu he didn’t really seem to land big damage off of those boomerangs which gives her more room to land one hit and kill him or severely hurt him. I was playing against this one decent Dormammu player in tournament yesterday and I can say I’d rather be fighting that Viewtiful Joe that was doing 20 percent bnbs on a hit than the Dormammu who was doing half life combos anytime he hit my X23 while putting a ton of shit on the screen to make it harder for me to get in. It will definitely take more work to learn how to get around that than Joe boomerangs I feel. Not to say the boomerangs aren’t a good zoning tool but at least you dont have to worry about taking a bunch of damage.
I play Joe, and the character is more about avoiding damage, and being mobile than anything else. Since i play laura too, i wouldnt want to fight her head up with him because just like most characters, she severely out ranges him. so the idea is to run around tack damage on while not getting hit and than when they get frustrated or leave themselves open thats when you go in for the big damage comboes. since it takes a lot of work to get in on somebody as small as him.