Lei ver. 2013 changes

Classic Fighting Games Street Fighter x Tekken
1

We should have the patch notes for the Tekken side in the next couple days.

So, what do we want to see for Lei? All buffs obviously!

Some things I’d like off the top of my head:

-Ability to block in stance and remain in your stance!
-Faster and more damaging razor rush like Tekken Lei.
-Faster uppercut
-Improved dashes
-Health boost
-Better AA buttons

Things I want that we’ll never get:

-Panther should walk under fireballs
-Phoenix Illusion!
-The five gates…hey, a man can dream right!? :slight_smile:

I think the fact that the Tekken cast are getting the ability to do Tekken like juggles (that’s what I’ve heard anyway) will be good for Lei. Hopefully we can come up with some more stance juggling.

It goes without saying that the palm semi-infinite will be gone but to be fair when did you ever use it anyway?

2

Apparently a patch preparing the game for vita compatibility just out on PSN that also nerfed his “palmfinite”.

3

Looking at the patch notes today has me excited!

I’m expecting good things now for Lei! :slight_smile:

4

Seeeexy Lei changes, overall pretty cool stuff.

• LK - Can be canceled by Snake only** Interesting, s.LK is a decent footsie tool, and snake got some buffs, so this could be useful to fish for.**
• MK - Can be canceled by Drunken Master Walk only** Again, interesting. Wondering what he is at on block because that’s a really nasty way to get into a quick high/low**
• HP - Added 6F to boost combo (On hit -7F/On block -12F)** eh**
• cr. MP - Added 6F to boost combo (On hit -5F/On block -9F)

  • Damage 60->50** eh**
    • cr. MK - Added 6F to boost combo (On hit -5F/On block -9F) eh
    • cr. HP - Damage 90->75 not a fun damage cut, his combo damage seems like it’s going to take a small hit
    • j. LP - Hurt box reduced sounds like a guaranteed A2A now
  • Hit box enlarged
    • Vertical j. MP - Hurt box reduced again, great A2A
    • Vertical j. HK - Hit box enlarged pretty cool i guess?
    • Comet Kick - Block stun reduced by 3F (On block -6F) very lame, easily my least favorite thing on the list. It definitely limits the strength of fishing for comet kicks or normal xx comet kick
    • Guard Cancel - Startup 9F->6F
  • Landing recovery reduced by 7F
  • Hit box enlarged Very welcome change to his AC, especially since you can no longer combo off them :frowning:

Drunken
• (Drunken Master Walk) LP - Reduced hit stun by 15 (On hit +5) here is some interesting stuff, pokes that are not only safe but give advantage?
• (Drunken Master Walk) LK - Reduced hit stun by 10 (On hit ±0)
• (Drunken Master Walk) MP - Reduced hit stun by 25 (On hit +2)

  • Reduced push back on block on hit getting this to consistently hit is awesome
    • (Drunken Master Walk) MK - Startup 10F->7F
  • Reduced hit stun by 15 (On hit -1)
  • Upper body is invincible against air attacks
  • Midair hit causes knockdown was already a decent AA, but this makes it pretty reliable I’d say
    • (Drunken Master Walk) HK - Hit causes vertical float knockdown this is an interesting change. HK is safer now I guess, with maybe a combo opportunity?
  • Reduced by 8F (On block -14)
  • Move back distance is same as back turn kick of Drunken Fox Combination
    • Drunken Rapid Fists - Added forward movement Has more range, connects more often, is 11f and this is an overhead? sweet
    • Drunken Fox Combination - Reduced 2nd hit by 37F (On hit ±0) safe now? good confirm?
    • Staggering Slide - Reduced by 27F (On block -15) eh, still unsafe as hell
  • Attack properties changed from high to low duhr
    • Tiger Sip Blow - Reduced by 14F (On block -10) again, not as unsafe, but still unsafe
  • Reduced push back on block and hit

Back Turned
• (Back Turn) LP - Hit stun reduced by 3F (On hit +8) uh whaaa? +8 is pretty nice
• (Back Turn) LK - Hit box reduced kinda lame, this had the best hitbox of his BT normals, not sure if the extra hit stun on LP/MP makes up for it
• (Back Turn) MP - Hit stun reduced by 5F (On hit +6) this is good, not sure if these “hit stun reduced” changes affect block advantage, assuming not
• (Back Turn) HP - Reduced push back on block and hit hell yes, more consistent BT target combo. this annoyed me
• (Back Turn) HK - Invincible against air attacks wow, like completely? great AA that can juggle if they jump in on you BT

  • Reduced by 5F (On block -5)
  • When 3rd and 4th hit frames connect with midair opponent, causes similar float to Reverse Double Kick on hit
    • Sailboat Stretch - Damage 120->130 a slight throw damage buff is welcome, still eh.
    • Closing Fan - Damage 120->130

Panther
• Panther - Hurt box reduced nice. panther is becoming a new favorite stance of mine

  • Walk speed changed to be same as Ryu forward walk for both panther back/forward? not sure on this
    • Panther’s Scratch - Can be canceled o_O niiiiice. I like this one. Wish it didn’t whiff at ranges, but being cancellable is very helpful, wonder if the hit stun is enough for comet kick.

Snake
• (Snake) LP - Startup 5F->3F This is really welcome, I want to use snake a lot more and this well definitely help
• (Snake) LK - Reduced by 3F (On hit +3F/On block -1F) A better footsie tool for a quick forward moving stance, sets up if you get the hit.
• (Snake) MP - Startup 8F->6F

  • Block stun increased by 2F (On block +2F) again, yay.
    • (Snake) MK - Increased active hit frames (5F) **interesting, would’ve been cool if they made this one cancellable. 5 active frames means you can make it +4 meaty though, so links into snake LP stuff are possible. **
    • (Snake) HP - Counter hit causes crumple pretty cool addition. still an 11f move though, so not sure how useful it will be.
    not a crazy amount of buffs, but I’m definitely liking snake a bit more

Dragon
• (Dragon) LP - Can be canceled by Dragon’s Spite …okay? maybe useful for CH AA xx dragon spite? not your go to normal cancel into dragon spite since [DRG] MP is actually quicker
• (Dragon) LK - Reduced by 3F (On hit +3F/On block -1F) a welcome frame buff (+2/-2 with stance change?)
• (Dragon) HP - When it connects it causes same float effect as last hit of Snake Bite Combo guaranteed combo on normal hit? this thing catches neutral jumpers at like midscreen, so very scary
• (Dragon) HP - Combo count usage changed to 2

Tiger
• Tiger - P attack, hit stun of K attack, block stun, push back on block, all changed to be same as current H. version verrry welcome
• (Tiger) P - Active armor frames lengthened (10F) **Okay, thank christ. I really have hated tiger so far, especially because of T punches shitty armor. **

  • Counter hit causes wall bounce
  • Damage 70->100 Overall great change to P.
    • Double Tiger Palm - Hit box enlarged
  • Startup 14F->10F
  • Block stun increased by 3F (On block +2F) **Aaand some more great changes to tiger. Bigger hit-box, dragon spite > tiger palm a 3f gap? +2 on block which probably makes for some great meaty shenanigans **
    • (Tiger) K - Can be canceled by Double Tiger Palm only that’s…cool? I guess sweep goes from being -4 to +2 with a palm cancel?

Special move meter gain:
• Reverse Lotus: Whiff 10->15
• Floating Lotus : On hit 40->15
• Comet Kick: Whiff 10->15
• Comet Strike: Whiff 5->10/On hit 40->30
• Tornado Kick: On hit 20->30
• Tornado Kick (deviation): Whiff 5->15/On hit 20->15
• Spinning Headbutt: On hit 40->50
• Drunken Fall: On hit 40->50
• Tiger Sip: Whiff 5->10
• Tiger Sip Blow: Whiff 5->15/On hit 30->40
• Double Tiger Palm: Whiff 15->20/On hit 40->60
• Leaping Crane: On hit 15+15(30)->30x2(60)
• Orchid Palm: Whiff 15->0/On hit 40->60

5

Yeah, this is looking really positive for Lei - some really solid changes enabling more options during stances. Whee!

6

Thank you for breaking this down. When I initially read the changes I immediately thought “RIP Drunken Stance” but this clears up a lot. I wish I had some frame data on Lei but I can’t find any. I do like the fact that he can now change his normals though. BTW I know we are both on PSN so if you want to get in the briefing room and level up, then just let me know.

7

Lei Frame Data

8

The stance buffs are great but I’m a bit sickened they nerfed his normal stance. I mean, its what you have to rely on the majority of the time.

I’m liking that they took a page from the Tekken book and gave us some more transitions. I’m looking forward to seeing what new combos we can come up with.

Cheers for starting that lad.

9

Hit stun reduced is usually a mistranslation. Japanese blog usually states “less recovery” for those, so I doubt frame advantage upon transitioning stance (eg. Dragon LK -> Crane) is changed.

Overall I like the changes. I’ll try to translate from Japanese blog to clarify the hit stun reduced stuff.

EDIT:
Reduced recovery on hit - Drunken LP, LK, MP, MK
Reduced recovery - Drunken HK, 2nd hit of Fox Combination, Staggering Slide, Sip Blow

Reduced recovery on hit - Back Turned LP, MP
Reduced recovery - Back Turned HK

Reduced recovery - Snake LK
Increased blockstun - Snake MP

Reduced recovery - Dragon LK

Increased blockstun - Tiger Double Palm

Now… I do not know why they sometimes said “on hit”, but it doesn’t necessarily mean that recovery isn’t changed on block. They’re always somewhat ambiguous when it comes to patch notes, and we’ll have to see how it exactly changes for those “recovery on hit” lists.

Also, the frame data was wrong. Judging from the patch notes, Drunk MP was -23, not -22. Same goes with Tiger Double Palm’s start-up and advantage on block :(. Ah well, it’s gonna change anyways :lol:

10

^^ Yea, I wonder what joker figured out that frame data in the first place :P.

Definitely. For a while there I had dropped SFxT and was pretty much solely focused on TTT2 and Marvel, but then I watched gamer bee vs tokido breakdown and realized how much I miss this game, especially when it’s played correctly.

Hopefully the patch shakes things up in a good way.

11

I’m the same way as you swoops, but with different games. That being said the patch notes for Lei seem to be deserving but coupled with the overall changes to the game and the changes to the rest of the cast I can’t help but be excited to get back into it.

12

Seems his palm loop is gone from the xbox now as well. Was playing a bit last night and could only get 3 reps.

Oh well, it was fun while it lasted! :slight_smile:

13

that list of lei changes looks like my programming homework…lol

14

New changes to him, but I’m pretty sure everyone saw them already:

j.MP - smaller hurtbox (I’m pretty sure this is both nj and dj)
j.HK - larger hitbox (I’m pretty sure this is both nj and dj)
Drunken Rapid Fists - Recovery reduced by 5 (on block -10)
LK Reverse Lotus - When cancelled into back turned stance, Lei can move right after he lands, Lei’s airborne height lowered
Back Turned Stance - Faster walkspeed
Quick Combo (lol) - Quick combo 4 changed

The complete list is at the Japanese Capcom website (in Japanese of course) - http://www.capcom.co.jp/sfxtk/system_update.html

15

I wonder with the LK lotus change will you be able to continue combo off the first hit? Hmmm

16

From the ground probably not. LK Lotus*4 isnt fun to look at even tho it doesnt do optimal damage. I’m assuming you can do BT MK xx HK TC into cr.HP xx HK Lotus if you hit airborne opponents. It will have to be done early anyways since LK Lotus doesnt have invincibility.

Or maybe it can be done in a juggle. Of course this will all depend on how low Lei got to on his LK Lotus height change.

17

Anyone been able to find anything out about his lk lotus? I played around with it for a few minutes last night but couldn’t get anything to work.

18

the stance cancelling is ridiculous now. mk > drunken and lk > snake (with his 3 frame jab) open up most of his stances, everywhere from his dragon/tiger frame traps (tiger palm is +2 now) to pretty much the only legit jab pressure left in the game on snake. There’s also simply cancelling your stance into a crouch Steve Fox style and going from there. You can link s.mk into c.mp by stance cancelling, which is a good hitconfirm from midrange footsies into a launcher combo. Also, you can simply go for the high/low off drunken (do a c. lk for the low, not that punishable string)

19

I tried to hit ppl with the tip of LK Lotus and did BT into LP or LK, but it didn’t work if they did empty jumps. Then again I don’t think anything can be done if it’s midscreen hit.

From what I tested, Lei’s ground combo from cr.HP xx flip kick will do max damage if you link that into launcher. I did this yesterday:
cr.HP xx flip kick -> crouch cancel -> st.HP xx Launcher -> partner launcher combo. OS the crouch cancel -> st.HP xx Launcher with MP button as well so that if you screw it up (but the timing is right), BT HP will come out instead, allowing you to go for HP MP LK LP (BTW this almost always fully connects now). Does more damage than flip kick -> BT TC -> another TC -> cr.MP xx Lotus depending on the partner.

Come to think of it, this might have done the most damage in vanilla as well since the only difference is that cr.MP got the dmg nerf (cr.HP dmg nerf is applied to both sides). It is difficult to do at first, but after you get used to it, you will be able to combo with either st.HP or HP MP TC into drunk almost every single time (but it’s almost impossible to CHOOSE to land st.HP :lol:).

20

BT hk for anti air is really nice! You can do BT TC to setup drunk stance on the opponents wake up. Unfortunately drunk mk isn’t worth much as a standalone antiair.I was hoping to be able to do something that would lead into another stance but the only thing I’ve been able to get off thus far is hk for a follow up which can be canceled. Anyone found anything else for a viable antiair that leads into stance changes?