you need to delay it a bit and let the command dash travel a bit and then do the tenko.
It is safer to “test” your opponent by blocking after Orochi and taking a mental not of what your opponent does after.
Does he just block?
Does he stick out a slow normal that would allow you to sneak a jab in for a counter hit into full combo?
Does he use a 5f Medium button that would blow up my attempt to keep my turn?
I think instead of sticking out moves that can get blown up in order to test your opponent it is better to analyze what they DO in fact do, and apply a counter measure to that after you have actually been able to make an analysis. Instead of sticking a button to see if they can in fact punish it.
I haven’t really been doing a lot of 2 bar combos, but I want to start mixing them into my gameplan. The max stun/dmg for 2 bars mid screen would be something, JF Tenko, Lk Mujin Kicks, EX Tenko, EX Orochi, no?
Yea but that combo is inconsistent. I think the timing on EX Tenko changes with the spacing. I think if you are mid screen and you’re going to do a 2 bar combo you should exclude LK Mujin Kicks and just do Tenko, EX Tenko, EX Orochi. It does 30 less damage and 40 less stun and it’s easy and consistent will given up a jabs worth of damage.
If you are close to the corner go for the full EX Tenko combo because it is easy then. You just do EX Tenko as fast as possible after LK Mujin Kicks. You just do EX DP instead of Orochi if you end up right at corner.
One more thing. If you have an 8 button stick I found out if you map your spare 2 buttons to 2 punch and 2 kick you can do EX Tenko and EX Orochi as fast as possible because you can plink just like you would JFT’s.
I think use just one EX in combo is a better option. Sure, we gonna get an huge combo with JFT,mujin,ex tenko,ex orochi,but save bar for a possible ex ressenha AA it’s better. Then do it ex tenko+ex orochi consistently isn’t easy, the risk to waste a whiffing ex is high. We need to learn how use our meter outside Super and AA, since most of the cast did that with ease,Karin’s specials aren’t that abusable,but I’ve seen too many Karins lose matches because they wanna go for a CA combo. Put even only the EX Tenko after a jft–>lk mujin isn’t like Ryus cr.mk xx ex hado, but we need to do something similar. Even EX Orochi–>HK Mujin could be useful for damage and corner carry,I will test those options tomorrow.
Yeah I’m hesitant to go for 2 bars since Karin loves having her bar for AA, it’s just something I thought about doing more often. After the insightful comments I think i’ll just stick to one bar most times unless the situation dictates I go for more damage/stun
Edit: Just went into training mode, and you are right, excluding the Mujin Kicks makes this combo infinitely more consistent. Thanks for the heads up
If you want to use two bars for an easy combo you might want to opt for doing something like crmp > stmp xx ex orochi > lk mujin > ex tenko. Ending in ex orochi gives you virtually no setups since it gives same knockdown as regular orochi but has way more recovery.
Ex tenko is an excellent ender that gives you an actual safejump against both quickrise and backroll.
Lots of interesting things to consider. Thanks for sharing!
Interesting, so the EX Orochi won’t give you access to the 5Lk meaty after Sappo step?
is there a trick to get consistent with jft -> orochi?
do you have to use a different sappo (the one with mk or hk?)
I just use the light kick sappo. Just do it really quickly. You just need a bit more muscle memory and then it will become much easier
I found some really cool Karin tech off of Guren Kusabi (V Trigger Elbow > Slide) so I made a video about it.
You can check it out here:
What is the optimal 1 bar combo? There are so many options between EX Tenko, EX Orochi,…
Thanks
i use cr mp st mp ex orochi and then hk mujinkyaku
For one bar, doing cr.MP > st.MP > JFT > LK Mujin > Ex Tenko seems to be your best bet at midscreen. In the corner, st.HP > JFT > JFT > Ex Ressenha seems to be the best you’ll get. Both of these work off of jump-ins as well, of course.
From the guide’s frame data, cr.mk -> jft looks very unconfirmable. Am I messing something up in the calculation below?
Cr.mk has 3 active frames, 13 frames of recovery, and is -1 on hit. That means that the opponent is put into 3 + 13 - 1 - 1 = 14 frames of hitstun. Jft has 6 frames of startup. That means that you need to start jft, at the latest, on the 14 - 6 = 8th frame after cr.mk hits. But 8 frames is not enough time to anyone to physically confirm the hit (in fact, SFV has around 9 frames of input lag).
Karin V Trigger Okizeme and Mixup setups,utilising almost every (V Trigger) move.Big damage and stun build using 1 to 2 ex bars.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbdbWtQSHws
Notes:
qcfP>up+K does not crossup Birdie and Zangief.
qcfP>up+K crosses up every character if done in the corner.
That is disgusting. Great find. I didnt know you could time crMP stHP to meaty combo like that, I’m stealing that too.
Nice vid, I found some of this stuff the other day fucking around on my friend’s copy, but there was still some sick stuff in that vid that I didn’t know was possible.
I’ve been abusing st.lk negative edge buffer into either JF Tenko or EX Shoulder depending on positioning and meter availability. Sure you guys know this, but after CC st.HK, you can combo into VS for like a full bar and then cancel that into VT for safe activation and either extended combo for meter (VT moves don’t combo) or oki and positioning (it’s a much more reliable confirm than Tenko imo and better when you need that V gauge for the comeback.)
cr.MK hit confirm is absolutely essential as ilitirit was saying, as her options after a blocked cr.MK aren’t very good presumably on purpose, but the long cancel window of the cr.MK makes it possible with enough practice. st.LK into EX Shoulder (IDK what it’s called) is NASTY, for two bars you’re getting 250+ damage and 450+ stun (forgot exact values) off of a 2 hit light confirm and advantageous positioning, it should be abused IMO as you can gain meter relatively fast with her.
Ending with EX tenko midscreen gives most dmg and a lot of time to do a setup as you’re +48 against quickrise, so it’s definitely best for setups. However, going the EX orochi gives more stun and a lot more corner carry so go for that if getting them into the corner is your gameplan. My guess for why a lot of top players including Mago usually does this is for that reason and the consistency, it works every time. Doesn’t require any special timing to it. Also the damage difference is pretty small compared to the stun gain (-20 dmg +46 stun)
Dmg/Stun
crmp > stmp > JFT > lk mujin > ex tenko = 299/430
crmp > stmp > ex orochi > hk mujin = 279/476
If you really want to burn two bars and want a great followup, doing ex orochi into lk mujin > ex tenko is your combo of choice.
crmp stmp xx jf tenko > lk mujin > ex tenko > ex orochi = 349/530
crmp stmp xx ex orochi > lk mujin > ex tenko = 315/510 (Also doesn’t require any timing, just do ex tenko asap after lk mujin)