And he still can’t beat Pyro… or stand even with other FFA 3s players. Sure outside of FFA, he’s the best 3s player. But with lack of comp, he’s growth would be limited. Valles got the best comp in the USA.
Maybe not Pyro. But Justin consistently beats Raoh and Kokujin… two very respectable japanese 3s players. Not to mention he was 1 win away from beating Ohnuki at taking 1st at Evo 2k5.
The fact that Justin can pull all of this off with his lack of comp says that maybe he doesn’t need as much comp as you think he does to compete with the best.
Valle’s definitely got the best comp in the USA to practice with… but Justin’s still a force to be reckoened with even if he doesn’t practice with the best comp.
I don’t think anyone’s arguing that Justin isn’t a beast…
The argument is that Valle can get A LOT better from now until August because he has access to playing the best 3S players in America. Justin probably isn’t going to improve too much from now until then (not that he necessarily needs to).
All that’s being said is don’t sleep on Valle because Justin is better right now. Valle has the means to improve greatly.
This shit is gonna be so hype.
I honestly wouldn’t be surprised if Valle won 4-1.
I also wouldn’t be surprised if Justin won 4-1.
Let’s do it cole. Tag/Dr/3s/ST/and uhhhhhhhhh Soul calibur 2 :smokin:
this is going to epic…
Cole,
I responded to your PM, but I’ll mention it here a bit.
About Tekken: I am not, nor have ever been, a huge Tekken fan. Even a *little *Tekken fan. My suggestion for Valle vs Wong was to see who is the best **Street Fighter **player ever, across a gamut of “SF/Capcom games”. Even if Valle and Wong were godly at MK, VF or even GG, I wouldn’t have suggested those. I am talking about Street Fighter here people! Hadouken!!
That being said, I *suggested *this Epic battle. But since it has become official, and I am not SRK staff, I imagine Wizard and crew are working hard to fit this into the EVO schedule, have the big screen ready, systems, etc. I am not a part of that. So if there’s any initiative to add games at this point, you’d want to post with Wizard and EVO Staff in mind.
I am a Street Fighter fan at heart. And I think the 5 games, 3/5 each, is *more *than enough to get hype over *and *illustrate who’s the better of the two. Even if Valle beat Wong at Tekken, or vice versa, that would just show me that the winner should have spent more time playing Street Fighter! Really, I don’t think Tekken should, or needs to be added.
My apologies Cole. And congrats on EVONorth ST Victory! Now just beat the Wolfe’s and reclaim dominance.
-Vic
HOLY SHIT Vic! Just got a load of this, and this is some ill shit! I love watchin’ Valle play. Best exhibition ever!
This is a sick ‘homage’ to Valle, to give him the official opportunity to defend his title, or pass his torch. Either way, this is the illest money match of all time.
I got $20 on Justin > Valle in SSBM
You do realize Valle was much more out of practice than Daigo since he never practiced 3rd Strike for real to begin with. Give credit where credit is due. Overall, Valle and Wong have more accomplishments (and won more money) than Daigo. They just aren’t japanese, which seems to be necessary to have people rooting for you in the fighting game scene.
Valle was also sloppy, out of practice, maybe a little drunk or sleepless, and he won, in 2 games, without practice and without comp for the past few years.
What I meant were money matches with top tier teams and good money. No stipulations.
Justin playing 3 Capcoms for 20 bucks vs someone is not exactly a Duc vs Sanford type of event. From this point of view, Valle vs Wong is something else.
quoted/emphasized for truth, good shit. fuckin japan fanboys. well they are good though no doubt but sometimes the fanboyism gets out of hand.
If I had money I would put it on Valle. Well see if I can make it to Evo this year.
Though people seem really confident in Wong, maybe some of you big spenders want to offer me 3:1 odds?
this post offers nothing. just a bunch of rhetoricals.
Even so I think it’s hard to decide who is actually “more accomplished” between Daigo and Valle/J Wong. Two different spectrums. In Japan you usually dont win any money in tourneys and if you do it’s not much. They just play for pride and bragging rights. Just beacuse J.Wong is almost making a living off fighting games doesn’t make him any more accomplished (by itself).
Japanese don’t take the money as seriously and the winners always split it amongst the other Japanese at Evo. The money they win at SBO is usually spent just blowing it amongst each other on hotel stay and booze. Which is really all they can do considering what they win at SBO is chump change compared to what Toyota sponsors at Evo.
Tournament wise I guess you could say Valle/J.Wong have done more but Daigo has done a lot in different games as well (Vampire Savior, ST, GGX2, 3S, CVS2 etc.) so if there is a margin it is small IMO. I think one reason the Japanese are so strong to begin with is because they play out of love for the game. They dont need money incentives to get out and beat someone. They just like to understand a good game and be better than the rest.
Definitely money plays a factor since essentially the world revolves around money but IMO needing money as an incentive to challenge/beat people is still not as strong as the incentive to just want to win. J.Wong, Valle and even the Japanese play for the money but above that they play to win and that’s what counts most.
^
Nobody plays SF “for the money”.
Not even Justin. If it were really “for the money”, we’d all be doing something else. There’s no money in SF.
Actually Justin really does make a living off of tournament winnings, and that’s 100% fact.
It’s definitely not a first priority. You still have to like what you’re doing and want to be good at it in order to win. No one can just come up off the street and be like “you guys are paying 5,000 bucks for 1st place? Yeah I’ll try” and earn money. If you’re trying to make some extra dollars here and there and are decent at fighting games you can make some extra money.
There is definitely an incentive with the money especially at something like Evo where 3rd and 4th place can mean the difference between a 1,000 dollars. This isn’t stuff you can live off of (yet) but I remember how dissapointed ComboFiend was when he barely lost that match that could have earned him an extra G or more. Granted you could play poker for one night and make more money than at multiple local tourneys (or even regionals) but winning that tourney money does help to pay a few things.
Yeah, he makes a living… but that still isn’t WHY he plays, or WHY he’s good, which is being suggested.
If it were really “for the money”, there’s tons of other shit he could, and should, be doing.
Well I think he was just trying to draw the distinction in how money factors into our fighting community versus the japanese fighting community. Someone had said that JWong was more accomplished in part do to the fact he’s won more money, when the japanese community doesn’t place the same emphasis on that part of the game.
I mean early on people were talking about making sure Wong and Valle got money to play each other, since they needed some “incentive” to play one another. So even if ultimately they play an exhibition just for the community, all DevilJin was noting is the different mindset that comes with the money becoming a partial factor in our competitive gaming community.
By no means was he trying to say that the only reason people play is for the cash prizes.
At least that’s what I got from his post.
I was responding mostly to the “the Japanese play for the love; they don’t need the financial incentive” aspect of the post. Seemed like typical SRK Japanese slobbery to me.
Well it’s more like they dont really have much other incentive to begin with. They’re not even making the money we usually make at most local tourneys. Many of their tourneys are akin to the “put your dollar in to play” tourneys of the old days. Only big tourneys have any real pot or winnings. In the US any tourney you go to you’re spending 5 or 10 bucks per game and we usually do multiple games at once during tourneys. That’s not neccessarily ballin as far as money is concerned but you can easily lose 40 to 50 bucks at a console tourney.
Granted you could easily lose 40 to 50 bucks at the local Japanese arcade but there’s no money necessarily earned for winning. Which means if you suck there’s less incentive to keep spending money to begin with. You could potentially come out with 100-200 bucks for a tourney win at a local US tourney with only investing 10 bucks. If you’re not that good at poker that’s still decent money.
US players (especially high level players) make a good bit of change off of money matches which I can’t see would be very much looked upon in Japan. Some of the money obviously goes into other betters’ pockets but 5G’s over a money match is still 5G’s.
To be honest…some of the stuff that I say may sound like Japanese fanboyish stuff but I just know that the Japanese look at accomplishments differently than we do here. The fighting game atmosphere overall is not quite as money driven as that in the states. Not that we’re making a ton of moeny here either. That’s all I’m trying to say.