ahh you’re right, after a brief test I must have found a comfortable window mid flurry after noticing it was harder to cancel and just kinda registered it like that. checking now it seems to be cancellable on every hit, but a bit strict in timing.
Hol Horse changes courtesy of BuddyWaters:
[details=Spoiler]Hol Horse:
Adjusted function of some command moves and normal moves, made it more pleasant to attempt combos
Adjusted downward end of hit box on standing H and HHA so that they can now hit Iggy
236+H, when strengthened with S and used in the air has been adjusted as follows:
Guard Gage damage changed from 20->125
The second hit has been changed from tailspin throw to weak damage, but the opponent’s recovery takes longer.
The broken bottle attack that triggers his GHA now works OTG
236+A adjusted as follows:
Normal H version on the ground takes effect at 15f instead of 12f.
Normal or strengthened H version on the ground have smaller hit boxes and will not hit a crouching opponents (the max for this is about Jonathan’s crouching height.)
Strengthened versions on the ground take effect as 12f instead of 6f.
HHA takes effect at 3f rather than 1f.
Jump+H hit now does strong damage instead of mid. (As far as the reaction type, not the damage itself.)[/details]
Man, this guy got a slap on the wrist for this patch. Even with the taunt combo nerf, he still builds a ton of meter, and now he even has another cheap dump for it now that his GHA OTGs. Him and Diavolo are still gonna be strong as hell.
I assume they mean AFTER the super flash. Still, his HHA was 1f after the flash before? Man that’s fast.
Iffy translation (or maybe iffy wording on CC2’s part), but I assume here they mean they jacked up the hitstun without modifying the damage.
I find this very unsettling given how “pleasant” Hol Horse’s combos already were, lol. Doesn’t get much more pleasant than having a mildly position-dependent crumple move you can perform from almost any state…
just got home…
so much fun stuff found already >:3
Not sure if this has actually been discussed before since 1.04, but Jotaro’s DP has been seriously nerfed. It actually loses/trades to things now, and the L version is very punishable on block now as opposed to before.
Good changes overall. Taunt combos being needed was gonna happen eventually. Glad for the changes for Giorno and especially Lisa Lisa. I’ve been playing locally and online, due to the play I actually consider Lisa as my secondary now. The increased damage to her leaping throw is incredible to her overall game.
Leaping throw, nothing. Try the insane guard damage on her flipkick string, and ESPECIALLY the combo options she gains from her crossup hop jump attacks and her HHA being slightly faster (and thus able to combo from 236H!). Try these combos which Mange on the JBA boards vetted for me:
For more Lisa Lisa info, check out my crude guide on the JBA forums:
http://ls57tiger.freepgs.com/jojo/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=41&t=6614
Giorno is really good, too. He still has a great meterless neutral game like in 1.03 (good defense, good offense, good oki), and it’s now even EASIER to get in with Gold Experience Requiem because of the buff to scorpions. Super-fast counterpoke into stun, free dash in to set up Giorno’s stupid GER loop. Giorno is now DEFINITELY the best of the “3-bar” characters (Giorno, Kars, Pucci).
From what I tested:
-All versions are now more punishable on whiff/block, and there’s more recovery on hit.
-In terms of PCing it (and HHA cancelling), only the L version still allows you to cancel it on the last few hits, M and H can only be done up to the middle. Applies to on hit, block, and whiff.
-The M version executes as fast the L version now, but does a bit less damage and number of hits. So damage wise it’s H > L > M
-L has no invincibility at all now, M and H have it from the start until the first couple active frames or so, with H having the most invincibility time since it still has the longest startup before it’s active.
Looks like they want us to make use of the different versions in different situations now instead of L or M being the go-to for everything.
-L for PC juggles
-M for anti-air on deep attacks/wakeup
-H for anti-air when you have more time to react, longer invincibility and damage.
Thanks for the combo, though the timing to combo 5L after the jumping jH rekka ender is a bit tricky.
Also, it may as well be considered a 1-bar combo since she builds that .25 meter back
Yeah the hop > jH > L is timing-dependent and slightly spacing-dependent. I need to sit down with the combo and figure out what quirks it has on different characters with different string starter. I’ll sit down later this week and break it down a bit.
Even without it, it’s still huge that she can combo into super without a crumple now. Lots more and cheaper combo options now than she used to have.
I’m not exactly sure of the meter build, either, so I’m not sure yet how much starter bar you need to build the 1 bar for the HHA. I’ll try it out later this week, I guess.
as a Jotaro player, I am totally down with all the changes they made to his DP. it was just kinda like a throw it out whenever you wanted and there wasn’t enough differentiation in the versions. I finally got a PSN point card today and bought a few of the DLC characters before that campaign thing ended.
I’ve barely gotten to play any but it’s so fun getting to try new stuff out. just a clarification: for when you do the “incorrect” SM, does it still do the actual dodge AND penalize you with the 40% or just penalize you and you block like normal? I dig that they’re trying to make SM more nuanced, but if it still dodges, it’s not like you won’t gain a lot back when you’re hitting the opponent. I like the air counterhit thing though.
just a heads up for anyone who is experimenting with quick stand on: it automatically applies a 25% scaling value on the ensuing hits and doesn’t let you gain back any meter for any of the subsequent hits, no matter how long the combo is. this makes it useful to use at the end of a long combo or to go into stand quickly if you just barely only have 50% of a bar, but it’s more worth it to use PCs in longer combos (both in terms of damage and meter gain).
another huge change in the overall game is that many moves now have specific IPS values. for example, Jolyne can’t do more than one Stand On j.L to prevent her from doing her old infinite. other random ones that I noticed:
Josuke’s Stand On 623 has an IPS value of 4. can’t get an entire bar from the corner loop anymore haha.
Jotaro’s 63214A has an IPS value of 2
You still dodge like normal, just penalised with the 40% when you do it.
I’ll try those those combos out for Lisa. About the leaping throw, just meant in an overall mind game setting. Its low damage pre patch just wasn’t scary.
About Giorno, well I always considered him top 5 in the game. Due to his overall play style. No need to go in the specifics.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVv-ABbDJ-E day one hermes combos
I LOVE the hermes changes for 1.04. it’s not as far as i would have taken it but for the most part she’s pretty damn strong now.
She gets 290 for one stand rush off a 2A!
So, who can explain to me why CC2 thought they had to nerf Yoshikage’s 5C? The thing has such bad range now I often have to omit it from combos. Probably the thing that bugs me the most about him now, not even the fact that he lost a ton of his oki from coins now sincr they explode upward now.
What sort of combos does the shorter range show up in? I don’t use him much, but jump attack > LMH ground chains were still fine last I checked. And what was the oki from a coin like before compared to what he can do now?
5H does seem a little harder to hit sometimes. maybe they did it to prevent you from always getting an easy primary bomb combo from any range?
My go-to, I need easy damage combo was always 2AA 5BC Puttstun jC 5ABC 236C xx HHA. And now, because the range has been nerfed, that combo won’t land unless I am pretty much on top of them. Even if you get a max range 2A 5B, the 5C will totally miss where before it would connect clean.
LeeBee may be right about the Primary Bombs, but it’s still an investment of meter because you’d need to Stand Cancel to get into Son. I have a feeling it’s just something I’m going to have to live with ._.
As for the coin oki, in 1.03, the explosion on the coin would pop the opponent up and back just a little. Now the coin explosion launches them sky high. It’s better for ground juggles, but now you can’t do a late cross-up jump for an additional mixup, you’re forced to stay on the ground, which gives the opponent enough time to sidestep or just dash forward to negate the situation entierly.
oh I just saw now that I misunderstood what you’re talking about, Turbovec. stand off H. yeah, it seems like Killer Queen doesn’t move as far forward when you use it anymore.
I guess the solution to your problem would be to walk forward a little after you hit j.H and then it should work.
Oh my god. I feel so bad for Abdul players. He is totally free on wakeup now. They moved his S/off DP to his stand on DP and made his old armor DP a 421 attack. That’s my biggest ‘what the fuck, why?’ thus far.
The other changes they made to him are kind of invisible to me. You can stand rush life tracking fireball and it seems like combos into red bind from hell2u stand rush are a lot easier/more consistent (i’m getting 427 off a 2A from S/on with one stand rush/one meter) but like, who the fuck cares about your damage if you get knocked down once and vortex’d to death? lol
He’s obviously still fine and i’m sure i’m overreacting, but man. Why would you ever s/off with him if literately everything is in s/on?
Almost not related but Bamco announced “Naruto Shippuden: Ultimate Ninja Storm Revolution” and CC2 is still making it,
now I don’t really care about Naruto but if they are going to use the Jojo’s engine I may pick it up.