Sorry for being off-topic, but what exactly are the reasons SFxT failed? I tried looking up online, but never came up a coherent explanations with the flaws of the game and such
Is it the mechanics? The overall combat system? The DLC bullshit?
I mean, I really love the game, it just sucks that almost nobody is playing it these days, and also the network connection can be really crappy at the same amount of connection stability bars as in SF4, where I can play that just even at 2 bars
If there ever was a post or a thread on the topic on SRK, sorry for posting here
Gem system which basically tried to throw strategy/RPG elements into SF and was implemented extremely poorly at launch. Auto block gems ruined online experience for a lot of players as there were many people who literally had the game block for them.
Gave no explanation that they packed 20 dollars worth of characters on a disc when people were
already pissed off about multiple SFIVâs, Jill/Shuma DLC and Ultimate MVC3.
Cross Assault was a disaster and helped fuel Kotakuâs bashing of the FGC. Nerd Josh ended up winning much more money for being on a FGC version of Big Brother than people who fought tooth and nail to win Evo. Nothing against him for winning, but it just showed the disparity between what you get paid for being Hollywood and winning at Evo.
Terrible organization with the rules around gems where some tournaments used them and others didnât.
Which that issue led to people playing usually without gems and not optimizing combos so time outs became rampant during the early meta. Stream monsters regularly got bored of anti climatic time outs.
Lastly and probably most importantly the game was competing with its own brand. 2 other Capcom games were already big and established and like the past has proven, itâs tough to get competitive players to play more than a couple Capcom games before they get burned out or just stick to what is played by more people.
SFV is simply the sequel to SFIV so it doesnât really have to compete with SFIV like an Alpha, XTekken or VS game would. Itâs easier for it to work alongside and transition with the player base. SFxT after itâs 2013 patch fixes was actually a pretty decent game. Unfortunately it launched so poorly when 2 other big Capcom games were already in the scene, that it just couldnât compete. When you have 2 other games to compete against you have to come in with less drama and BS than those other games or youâre out of the game quick.
Honestly, the DLC stuff left a bad taste in everyoneâs mouth. That alone gave it a bad start before release. In tournaments, the game constantly had time overs, and that made people hate it even more. People also constantly complained about the gem system. The 2013 update was great and made the game much better than before. Unfortunately the damage was already done by that point. Most people were just turned off by the game and hated it entirely.
I stopped playing SFXT well before the update, but I know that it ended up being a more solid game than people would like to admit based on watching it. It just had a bad start it couldnât quite recover from. I donât think there was a strong scene for the game in Japan, either.
Yeah no arcade release didnât help at all. Pretty much made it so only the most hollywood SF players really had any reason to take it seriously. Hopefully SFV being console only doesnât hurt it too much with the Japanese player base.
I guess thatâs another improvement SFV could have. Work towards an arcade release since the Asian scene relies on not having to sit near a console in their house to play.
Yeah, we could only really know when we test it out during beta. It could turn out walk speeds are just fine, actually. The issue then would be to communicate to Capcom to keep it like that, because we never know if thereâs a possibility that they could even make walk speeds slower. Itâs neat that theyâre even doing a beta in the first place, but their track record in listening to the competitive scene is wishwashy, but the current game is just so good as if they listened to the scene.
Alright, I want everyone to make one more quick list of what they want generally improved with SFV so far.
Whatever seems to be the most common between the lists after this post and whatâs in the first page Iâll post up on Capcom Unity. That way we can have a unified list in a Capcom forum for them to easily see.
My Current List:
Improve walk speeds a bit for faster characters (Chun/Cammy) and increase them significantly for slower moving characters (the rest). Maybe make a slight nerf to dash speed/length to compensate.
Extend the range of throws. Letâs not have another game with Melty Blood throw ranges please. I hear of people whiffing throws at the same time trying to tech each otherâs throws.
Continue to make a bit less emphasis on light attacks going into damaging combos and improving the hit boxes of medium and heavy normals.
Strengthen V Reversals. These have a chance to be strong in a game with weak reversals, but reports are they are very slow and V Triggers are too good to burn your V Gauge for them.
More chip on normals or slower recovering chip on normals. Right now the white chip seems to recover too fast for how slow the walk speeds are and how short throw range is.
Continue to emphasize true block strings. Letâs have more air tight strings and not so much gaps in stuff like SFIV
Slightly improve walk speeds universally for the cast, keep walk speeds in proportion to each character but just bump up everyone a tad.
Make light attacks generally not link into medium and heavy attacks. In Third Strike that didnât really occur and only a few characters could convert from lights into special attacks into knockdown, such as Yang cr.LK cr.LK xx ex rekkas. I think they can make it so universally characters can convert into knockdown from 1-3 chained light attacks that directly combo into a knockdown special, but it wouldnât be huge damage output compared to medium into heavy into special or medium in medium into special type of combos.
Thatâs all really. Canât really say anything until I try the game. I feel like V-Reversals are more for guaranteed unsafe strings like V-Reversal against a cr.MK thatâs canceled into Hadouken so you punish the Hadouken animation rather than the cr.MK in itself. I see it like guard cancel roll in KOF. You use the mechanic against confirmed unsafe strings, not as a free get off me move just because. Once the opponent starts to not commit to strings that are unsafe against V-Reversal, then you get more breathing room to play and keep your V-Meter for something else.
Throw range I canât comment on because if walk speeds are improved, then short range throws that are supposed to mimic Third Strike type of throws and game play is fine. Wouldnât want to weave in, then bob out to bait throw whiff but still magically get thrown. Having a slightly better walk speed should compensate for throw range.
Having things true string and not true string are each good depending on certain contexts. Wouldnât argue for or against either one. Would have to play the game first to see how it pans out.
Thatâs all Iâm going to keep saying, I donât really know what to say about the game other than marginally increasing walk speeds universally. I have to play the game first. Iâd say letâs wait until the beta, which would be a different build anyways by then, and then make suggestions based off of that as Capcom intended.
-Faster walk speeds all around to encourage more footsies based mindgames pre v trigger activations, I shouldnât have to wait till the middle of the round to play a strong character
-Specials and ex specials can also chip kill (but not normals)
-Increase throw range to what it is in SF4 in general
-Stages are still to big and that will encourage runaway zoning and gameplans
-Reduce some of the hit stop on certain normals, the huge hitstop in the game currently serves as a big disconnect with the action.
-Apply the dash buffer at the end of dashes to buffer into themselves to also apply to normals and special attacks
-Special moves that donât move the character forward to be made less negative on block to allow for more special move poking (birdies chain as an example)
-If ânormal moveâ chip damage stays as it is, make it non recoverable. If normal move chip damage changes, then make it do more recoverable damage or make the recoverable damage last longer.
-take out the new Kara crouchtech. It WILL become the standard once people learn to use it. Tough execution isnât a good method of balancing and if itâs easy enough to find in one showing in E3 then it will be easy enough to master and the only thing that will have changed from sf4 to sf5 with respect to crouchtech is that itâs execution will have become harder. Teching on the ground while crouching should give you no tech at all.
Make V-reversals the same for everyone. Being a universal defense mechanic I donât see why it has to be different for everybody. From impressions they donât work as intended for a couple of characters.
adjust the stun on counter crush. The way it is now seems difficult to react to. Adjust the stun to give the player time to dash or jump in to do damage.
Bring back taunt buffs. Apparently the command taunt is now PPP+KKK. You I gotta press all the buttons just to taunt a small bonus would be nice for the trouble.
Iâm not going to post a list until I have tried the beta myself. I donât want to get ahead of myself and put wrong impressions till I have found out from a personal experience.
I will post the list once the beta starts for Steam this fall.
I think keeping the fast dashes should be a priority IMO. However, characters being able to dash so quickly looks a bit silly with the gameâs current walk speed to me personally.
See I canât tell by all the gameplay footage that thereâs anything I can say âthis needs or could be changedâ about. Iâm trying to be objective as possible with SF5, and Iâm comparing it to 4, or even alpha. But I canât just say âBisonâs c.MK needs to be able to cancel, Birdie, needs to be a charge character, Chunâs lightning legs needs to be a piano inputâ. I just canât conclude one way or another about any adjustments. Like even V-trigger meter depletion isnât the same for everybody, but that could be intentional.
Then that really changes the dynamics of the footsie/spacing game, which encompasses factors of:
characters walk speed advantage, both forward and back walk
quality and speed of their pokes
who is zoning out who
Larger grapplers would suffer from the inherit disadvantage of slower pokes and slower walk speed, which reduces their chances to whiff punish. Blocking will leave them vulnerable to grey health. They need to be compensated with more health to cover the likely grey health they WILL receive, a mechanic to circumvent the offensive pokes like a V-Tigger, or high quality lights to counter defend.
Grey health is going to be enticing for mindless footsie spam - just hope Capcom has the footsie meta game locked down tight. Not sure how theyâre gonna do it. Buff the light attacks defense, or give it some kind of counter advantage against medium and heavy pokes?
I think grey heath naturally disadvantages an ethic minority of the cast. What do you guys think?
They were many and varied. Iâm not sure if I stand alone on this, but I personally found the game very dull to watch to be honest. It was somewhat repetitive for lack of a better way of explaining it. I also felt a lot of the post-release promotion of the game was disingenuous and forced in some ways. I might stand alone on this view also (and this is another aspect difficult to put into words) but there was something false about a lot of the âbuzzâ when it was released. Capcom marketing promotion notwithstanding, many people wanted to like the game and it was almost as if they were trying to convince themselves that they did. The fact that it didnât have legs for long after its release perhaps reflects this.
The SFxT criticism outside of gameplay/mechanics/etc was also emotionally charged for many. The DLC fiasco and general consensus on aspects such as âgemsâ and so on derailed a lot of critical discussion in some ways, while still being relevant to why many disliked the release.
Another subtle contributing factor was how the beta/test releases were in many ways a better game, or at least showcased better potential than what was eventually released. I found the beta very interesting though with subsequent reveals as to how things were being further fleshed out, my interest waned. SFxT underwent a very strange transition from where I was sitting.
Lastly, many release bugs and issues soured the actual release, which made it difficult for the game to prove itself to many with subsequent patches. My understanding is that the patched version of the game was actually quite decent, though by the time said patch landed, many folks had made their mind up about the game one way or another, which for many was predominately negative and as such they moved on.
I remember allocating setups to the game at our gatherings here in Sydney, and there was just no interest. We instead converted said setups back to Marvel and SFIV and they were quickly swarming with players again. The game had its fans for sure, but I donât think they were a large slice of the FGC pie at all.
Actually it was already confirmed I believe that neutral jump attacks are still in. Itâs only close normals that are now replaced or now can be used as command normals. So basically everyone has multiple command normals now that you can still use at close range if they were previously a close normal. Ryuâs close s.HK is now a command normal for instance.
[list]
[] Walk speed needs to be increased slightly over the entire cast, however, Bison/Birdie need to remain slow given their tool set. They just need to be faster than what they are now but slower than the rest of the cast. Increased walk speeds improves the footsie game and the throw game.
[] Throw range needs to be increased slightly. Throws are good in this game because it actually develops the up close meta some more. However, the fear of throws isnât as strong because of slow walk speed and weak throw range. When people got use to throw range they became less afraid of throws which weakens the throw bait and frame trap game.
[] V-Reversals need to be faster on start up. Too easy to block them right now effectively making them useless for what theyâre intended for.
[] Reduce reversal windows out of block stun. Theyâre pretty much the same or similar to SFIV so we need to get rid of mashing DP in block strings.
[] Increase hit stun on Crush Counters. Right now crush counters are done with punishable heavy attacks and the crush counters themselves donât give enough hit stun to react for a beefy combo. Most require you to dash in first and you need quick reactions for that. The risk/reward scenario for attempting a Crush Counter set up is not worth it, at the moment.
[] Specials shouldnât activate off of whiffed normals. It created an imbalance between characters because characters like Bison benefited from this greatly while characters like Nash suffered from it.
[*] V-Triggers need fine tuning across the board. Some characters V-Triggers are too plain while others, such as Bison, are more robust and provide more unique attributes to the character. Would like to see V-Triggers to be more unique rather than giving one buff.
[/list]
[list]
[] Give us Training Mode thatâs worth a damn. Memory feature in USFIV was a step in the right direction, but the benchmark has been set high as fuck by some of the fighting games that are coming out nowadays (SkullGirls, VF, etc.). Donât let us down Capcom.
[] Make the character portraits match the character colours and have them face the right way (like in 3rd Strike, but was botched for SFOE).
[] Like This!
[] And not like this: Note how Twelve has the same P1 and P2 portrait, facing same way and same colour
[*] When you take recoverable chip from normals, donât make the damage go red then white (takes too long to process and is an unnecessary delay for gameplay). Just have it go straight to white like focus attackâs in SFIV.
[/list]
