Think it’s down to the super attack being tied to a revenge meter now, and not being affiliated with the EX bar anymore. I don’t even dislike ultras that much honestly, some are pretty cool to get off(Fei/Cammy U2 are dope) and some offer great utility.
BY THAT LOGIC THE KKK HAS THE PERFECT SOLUTION TO RACISM.
I don’t mind it this way.
How would you “fix” it oh great one?
Nerf EX moves in general to only be small improvements to the base attributes of the ability like extra damage, range, safety on block etc, with occasional exceptions for extra functionality depending on character archetype like 2 hit fireballs or EX command throws strike invulnerability. Base special moves should be strong enough to stand on their own. SEVERELY reign back the idea that an EX move = destroys fireballs.
Buff meter build.
Make supers strong. If a character needs anti-fireball tech, encourage the game design to be about building a super to punish. This does not mean that every character’s super should be 5 frames full screen and fireball invul.
Remove ultras.
I disagree. I think Ex Moves should not only be potentially stronger, faster, more hits, or more invincibility, but I think they should add new properties to the moves for flavor (See: Bison Ex-Headstomp/Ex Psycho Crusher from Omega mode). This creates new options/combos/opportunities for the character that he or she would not have normally. To offset this, ex meter build should be slower, forcing the player to really think twice about when to and when not to ex move. They already have Ex meters that vary in size, this will help balance characters that have powerful ex moves or v-triggers by giving them shorter meters or longer.
I’m fine with this since, for the most part, this is how Ultras (and DMs) are supposed to work. The real problem with Ultras in IV anyway is the fact that in certain matchups, you’re bound to see it more than once. You get Ultras like Rose’ orbs or Elena’s healing that just end up stalling the match and reversing momentum, multiple times per match due to how quickly you build Ultra in IV.
If you think about it. EX’s are basically level 1 Supers from the Alpha series. And even then, they had some of those properties (such as going through fireballs).
More importantly, building around “supers to punish fireballs” means that you either make it so that taking hits is the way to punish fireballs (since supers are tied to revenge now) or that you switch them around, tie V-trigger to revenge and make it worse by having what may be an even bigger matchup changer tied to revenge.
Alot of people seem to be missing the point that “v-trigger” effectively means that every character has a genei-jin/astral vision/orbs type super at their disposal now. This means that EX meter (which is basically super meter) is more important in the match up once again (like in the 3 and Alpha series) since at full stock, it does bring something that greatly changes the match up.
More importantly, there are no other options, aside from EX, that are fueled by that mater. IV has the same issue as GGAC when it comes to meter where you save meter for the either the cancel mechanic (FADC/Roman Cancel) or the move boost (EX/Force Break) (and before someone complains, Pachi and Ishiwatari explicitly mentioned this issue with GG when they changed the RC system in Xrd).
So you’re not really looking to fix it, you just want to avoid it altogether.
YOU CAN’T RUN FROM YOUR PROBLEMS BRO. BE A MAN!
Ultras being present would be w/e with those changes.
Ultras should just not exist in the first place. This discussion is like trying to make the best halloween costume for a kid in a wheelchair.
My attempt:
EX meter can still be used for EX specials.
V-trigger can be activated once per round anytime regardless of your health. It doesn’t consume meter at all but here’s the catch: the duration of V-mode is proportional to the amount of EX meter available when the player activated V-trigger. That way there’s still the incentive to build meter and the tension between using it for EX specials or keeping it for increased V-mode duration.
Meter can still be built during V-mode. Supers use the entirety of the EX meter, and Ultra comes out if V-mode is also activated.
Revenge meter is erased forever.
Taking away revenge meter and making Supers run on EX wouldn’t fix the issue, since once again, you have another mechanic that draws from the same meter that may actually be better than super (V-trigger).
Why are we already saying V-Trigger is better than a Super? In what situations? In what matchups? At what points in the round is it better etc etc?
Just going with what we know and have seen so far. Ryu’s permanently adds additional hits to his fireballs, that alone is pretty match up changing, and with only 2 stocks to fill, you’ll likely see Ryu players building fireball hits instead of using super. Meanwhile, Chun Li’s makes her able to do Morrigan-style bullet hell lockdown, in a Street Fighter game. So yes, at this point, both V-trigger activations that we know of do seem to be quite better than super.
Additionally, we know that they are tuning the EX meter the same way meter length in 3 was tuned based on super art. So we know that the team is working on making V-trigger a very important part of the meta.
EDITL The other thing to consider is historical precedents. We’ve already seen that the more things you tie to super meter, the less you’ll see super as those other things will get used.
V-Trigger is permanent what the fuck? I thought it was a timed buff or something. Permanent doesn’t swing well with me personally.
Keep your pants on Sally. Any hit characters eats kills it.
At least, that’s been the case so far.
Sorry, I took them off in quite a rush. That seems completely justifiable then, if it stays true across the board or each Trigger has one downside that can fuck the whole thing up so it isn’t just a free DBZ SSJ power-up when you get full bar.
Actually that’s just the case with Ryu. Chun’s goes away only on knockdown I think.
Ryu keeps the extra hits on his fireballs. All he loses is the guard break on the last hit.
It’ll probably vary from character to character as far as what they lose or gain or what the deactivation means are.
I like it. Makes each character more unique.
I’m quite optimistic about the V-trigger idea and how it handles meter.
I say experimentation over all. We saw II, we saw air blocking in alpha, parry in 3 and focus in 4. A mechanic which uniquely alters an individual character just seems like natural evolution to me. On the discussion about supers, ultras;
The damage output that we’ve seen on ryu’s ultra/super so far looks way less dramatic and punitive than it was in all of SF4. It takes a hefty chunk but it doesn’t seem to be bad enough as to warrant an overly defensive 2nd half of a match.
Heftier chip damage on blocked normals and the seeminly aggressive gameplay tendency that V-trigger appears to foment, along with crouching lp not being the be-all end all anymore, is a very welcome change in my eyes. I think i’m just speaking my mind now. Whatever, the more I look into the new game gameplay system the more excited I am about it.