Thank you both for your responses! @Teyah I’m definitely in the competative scene so this information was helpful and since I brought a Kai I’ll be swapping it for a V4 asap 
While I agree with one party here that say Teyah’s results are not accurate because you cant calculate the lag in ms since you have to rely on frames rather than actual milliseconds for the data but I also agree to teyah POV that his methodology is correct and this is the best you can do while calculating the lag. Since we are talking about opinions here like Mr. Darksakul gave his opinions vs teyah’s opinions, I would like to add mine.
I think Teyah’s results might not be on the dot (exactly in milliseconds) but the input delay results between different sticks he has shown cannot be denied or rejected (if it can be then please feel free to bring your own testing to falsify him) which has got many ppl butthurt here because their stick is inferior to others. Even before this thread existed, I always thought if there is a possibility that my stick might be laggy as i was using a fake Chinese 360+ps3 stick which felt a little laggy? then this thread came into existance.
and yes if you are into competitive fighting games and you choose characters with 1frame links (i am a rufus player in SF4 and takuma player in kof xiii) then these results will definitely help you.
No problem - if you still have time to make the exchange, that’s a good idea. For now I would avoid anything with a touchpad from Hori, as it would use the same slow PCB as the HRAP4 Kai.
Not sure why you took that personally, tbh. Input lag is relevant to all competitive players, if you happen to be one that’s great, it (and my thread) is relevant to you too, whether you choose to ignore the info presented or not.
Uh, you can calculate it to the ms. You just need a lot of presses.
I’m enjoying the way this conversation is developing into ‘if you don’t care about lag you casul’. From irrelevant to classy in such a short space of time, well done everyone.
@Teyah
I going to bury the hatchet,
What supposed to be my own reasons for objections are getting as twisted by people as other people started to twist Teyah’s data.
Yes I scrutinize and pick-apart Teyah’s data, but I at least try to do it from a scientific standpoint. When personal bias comes in is when we need to stop and reevaluate our selves.
And with in the scientific community there still room for differential opinions, it’s how science reevauates themselves.
I still be in the house what considers input lag from controllers at best minimal to what effects players.
I do want to end the notion if you “don’t care about lag you are dirty casual” thing, in the end that isn’t serving anyone and only divides the community.
As I look at the grand scheme of things, I did care about lag, I just have a slightly different outlook that whats common in here in this thread
In the end Teyah’s results are part of a larger set of tools of knowledge someone can armed themselves with.
Also as someone else told me the other day (its not tech talk related but it the saying fits)
if someone hating you and your work, you are possibility on the right track.
I don’t want to take sides in a flame war but this is getting out of hand.
That all said, for stick input delay statistics please see @Teyah 's thread
For other info on those sticks go to Definitive Retail Playstation 4 Arcade Sticks List with Info/Facts/Photos/Advantages/Disadvantages
Now tot he OP’s question: the Real Arcade Pro 4 Kai & the Real Arcade Pro V4 ‘Hayabusa’ are vary different sticks, and they have different PCBs.
Which one is better, I am not saying at this time (Don’t PM me later and ask).
Hello,
According to teyah.net/sticklag/results
Real Arcade Pro V4 ‘Hayabusa’ has (+4.80 ms)
Real Arcade Pro 4 Kai (+14.80 ms)
I thought these were the same sticks apart from different layouts. I have done some research and the majority of people say it’s exactly the same on the inside (PCB) but these results beg to differ. Can anyone shed some light on this subject , owner, testers?
that was tough to read
While I agree that the information is not useless, it should be noted that having a lower lag level isn’t necessarily going to help with 1f links- consistency is what’s important there. So if you switch between a 3ms and a 25ms pcb, it’s going to throw you off based on which you practiced on- either one is perfectly capable of hitting 1f links consistently if that lag amount is stable. Where it may make a difference is the speed at which your attacks come out- someone consistently 1f behind may lose counterhits/throw techs, late cross up blocks,etc.
Frank you are right that we can adapt to the lag and that it’s miniscule compared to reaction time and all the other combined lag. We can adapt to the lag from the LCD and to the lag from the sticks, easily.
The difference is that while the players use the same or similar display in a competitive setting, they will often use different sticks.
It wouldn’t be fair if one of the players had to play on a laggier separate display, but that’s effectively what happens when the other player has a faster stick.
It’s fine when the difference is negligible, but that’s not always the case. The difference in input lag between the laggiest and fastest PS3 PCB is more than double the difference in display lag between a CRT and LCD.
The difference between the display’s lag in ms and the controller/arcade stick is we know the exact lag in ms from actual devices that measure it and the controller is pretty much just a battle of which beats which in tests(like the hook up 2 sticks to one button and see which char lands a hit), the control with the least amount of lag on this test is at a 0 ms baseline but in reality it might be 3-6ms so push all the sticks with more lag much higher than people think in terms of ms, or maybe they are so close that each one is 1ms higher than the other.
The brow beating by some people in this thread is unreal. Grow up people. Information is information and it’s value has been discussed a ton of times already. Some of you are fine with 20-30ms extra of lag potentially. Others are not. Those are just opinions that you’re going to have to deal with.
Forgive my ignorance, or maybe I just missed this part somewhere, but I’m confused as to how this is a comprehensive list when all the test results seem to be based on a single game? Wouldn’t that make this data specific to the Guilty Gear games tested?
What happens if u test Ultra and get different response times, or if u have a situation like PS4 USF4 having it’s input delay decreased through a patch?
This would still remain to be a good way to compare sticks, apples to apples, even if the amount of lag changes per game.
Completely agree with your point here. if one can adjust the lcd lag, one can definitely adjust with their stick input lag if its consistence. I failed to mention which you pointed out that since I have a hori rap4 kai, I will always lose to trades/counter hits, and reaction time which includes punishes on reactions.
60f/s input loop is a 60f/s input loop regardless. The results are deltas and the specific game shouldn’t matter unless the tested game or your preferred game have a timing inconsistency. The deltas measured do not need to take into account the inherent input-to-render delay, which varies from title to title.
See http://www.teyah.net/sticklag/overview.html.
Another thing surfacing repeatedly in this thread is disbelief in the averaging. This comes up a lot in any lag discussion involving discrete values (i.e. frames vs continuous measurement). If you do not believe that you can arrive at a precise average by taking a lot of these deltas, you have probably not tried it yourself.
You will not always lose on reactions, it just means that in the worst case your window of opportunity is a (very) teensy bit smaller.
The only scenario in which you would lose for certain would be when you and your opponent press buttons at the exact same time for moves that have the exact same startup speed and priority.
Will these sticks show the same amount of lag when played on PC?