How do you record "Active Frame" in a fighting game?

[dhampirneclord]

Trying to build a frame data for a unpopular game that has no frame data avaliable.

Its easier to get startup,on block,on hit,total frame,But having problem acquiring Active Frame for a move,Is there any tech for this?

By the way,invincible frame is also kinda of difficult to get.

[Darksakul]

Don’t make multiple threads if they cover the same topic.

[dhampirneclord]

Don’t make multiple threads if they cover the same topic.

Actually its a completely different topic,this one is about building frame data for Active Frame.By the way do you have any suggestions?

[Darksakul]

Don’t make multiple threads if they cover the same topic.

Actually its a completely different topic,this one is about building frame data for Active Frame.

Do they concern the same Project?
Its both about Frame Data.

You don’t need two threads, you could easily combine these two into a single thread.

We also need more information.
You told us nothing of what game you are working on or your system specs.

It is like going to a doctors office and not telling him your symptoms but you are still expecting a diagnosis.

[dhampirneclord]

Don’t make multiple threads if they cover the same topic.

Actually its a completely different topic,this one is about building frame data for Active Frame.

Do they concern the same Project?
Its both about Frame Data.

You don’t need two threads, you could easily combine these two into a single thread.

We also need more information.
You told us nothing of what game you are working on or your system specs.

It is like going to a doctors office and not telling him your symptoms but you are still expecting a diagnosis.

They are not the same Project,the other one is just about input,i already replied in the other topic.

Its about games in general,for example,for any game that i want to know the startup of a move,i’ll just simply record the game and see when does each move hits.

but for active frame its kind of hard to tell.

[Darksakul]

Don’t make multiple threads if they cover the same topic.

Actually its a completely different topic,this one is about building frame data for Active Frame.

Do they concern the same Project?
Its both about Frame Data.

You don’t need two threads, you could easily combine these two into a single thread.

We also need more information.
You told us nothing of what game you are working on or your system specs.

It is like going to a doctors office and not telling him your symptoms but you are still expecting a diagnosis.

They are not the same Project,the other one is just about input,i already replied in the other topic.

Its about games in general,for example,for any game that i want to know the startup of a move,i’ll just simply record the game and see when does each move hits.

but for active frame its kind of hard to tell.

Hard to say, it can vary from game to game and since you gave us nothing to work with. Each Game engine decides to do things differently.
Trying to record footage off a screen with a camera is the worst way to go. Its nearly impossible to get a good sync on the frame rates if you want accurate data.

The actual start it that exact moment you hit that button or key. Some people go as far as include a LED in their setup to know when that frame starts using the camera method.

Video Capture with a dedicated machine is more accurate. You can include side by side capture data with camera data if need to be.

I starting to think you want ether a easy hand-out solution where we hold your hand though the steps or you are trolling us.
I don’t do hand holding, if you are willing to learn I will show you want you need to know or at least point you in the right direction.

So far you just been fighting me on both threads, two threads that should be one by the way.
You haven’t said a thing about what you are really doing to make me think otherwise.

[dhampirneclord]

Don’t make multiple threads if they cover the same topic.

Actually its a completely different topic,this one is about building frame data for Active Frame.

Do they concern the same Project?
Its both about Frame Data.

You don’t need two threads, you could easily combine these two into a single thread.

We also need more information.
You told us nothing of what game you are working on or your system specs.

It is like going to a doctors office and not telling him your symptoms but you are still expecting a diagnosis.

They are not the same Project,the other one is just about input,i already replied in the other topic.

Its about games in general,for example,for any game that i want to know the startup of a move,i’ll just simply record the game and see when does each move hits.

but for active frame its kind of hard to tell.

Hard to say, it can vary from game to game and since you gave us nothing to work with. Each Game engine decides to do things differently.
Trying to record footage off a screen with a camera is the worst way to go. Its nearly impossible to get a good sync on the frame rates if you want accurate data.

The actual start it that exact moment you hit that button or key. Some people go as far as include a LED in their setup to know when that frame starts using the camera method.

Video Capture with a dedicated machine is more accurate. You can include side by side capture data with camera data if need to be.

I starting to think you want ether a easy hand-out solution where we hold your hand though the steps or you are trolling us.
I don’t do hand holding, if you are willing to learn I will show you want you need to know or at least point you in the right direction.

So far you just been fighting me on both threads, two threads that should be one by the way.
You haven’t said a thing about what you are really doing to make me think otherwise.

I don’t understand why you consider that i’m “FIGHTING” you,i told you everything on the other thread.You are talking about system spec for game i’m talking about typing letters in a .txt file or testing joystick in control panel,well of course thats for the other thread,it has nothing to do with this one,what you’re saying is a bit off topic don’t you think?Again i appreciate your reply,but thats simply not what i’m looking for,thx.

And i’m not using a camera,please stop confusing the other thread with this one.I record game with fraps,bandicam,or other software,and i had no problem(literally…) acquiring frame data other then “Active Frame”…

And if your talking about game difference,please tell how different is it about acquiring Active Frame in a video.

I really don’t wanna response to any sort of arguement,i’m just asking some simple tech question.

If you are curious about what game,its not a single game,i do frame data building for alot of old Fighting Game,even for the ones in 90s and for some fan made games too.

[noodalls]

It’s not easy to determine. The easiest way is if you have hitboxes to simply count the number of frames when the hitbox is active. If this is not possible it gets quite a bit harder.

I did quite a bit of work in Tekken trying to determine active frames. Tekken has never (to my knowledge) had the ability to show hitboxes. Also, I had access to a two player programmable controller as well as 60fps capture, which were necessary for my methods. Terminology from here is going to be related to Tekken.

• for high moves, hold down until a set frame, then release and see if the move still hits. e.g. let’s say a jab hits on frame 10. Have the opponent ducking on frame 10 and standing on frame 11. If the jab still connects then it has at least two active frames. Repeat on frame 12 etc. You do need to know a bit about the system, e.g. does the game immediately go from crouching to standing in one frame.

• For low moves, you can do a similar method by jumping, and seeing how late you can land on an attacking low.

• Mid moves were obviously harder because you can’t duck or jump them. Things that I used were tech rolls or movement. Tech rolls in tekken have large amounts of invulnerability, so you can negate the first few frames of an attacks active frames. Any other invulnerable move works. Tracking can be a problem. Similarly dashing into moves late (or tagging in for TTT2) provides another method.

[dhampirneclord]

It’s not easy to determine. The easiest way is if you have hitboxes to simply count the number of frames when the hitbox is active. If this is not possible it gets quite a bit harder.

I did quite a bit of work in Tekken trying to determine active frames. Tekken has never (to my knowledge) had the ability to show hitboxes. Also, I had access to a two player programmable controller as well as 60fps capture, which were necessary for my methods. Terminology from here is going to be related to Tekken.

• for high moves, hold down until a set frame, then release and see if the move still hits. e.g. let’s say a jab hits on frame 10. Have the opponent ducking on frame 10 and standing on frame 11. If the jab still connects then it has at least two active frames. Repeat on frame 12 etc. You do need to know a bit about the system, e.g. does the game immediately go from crouching to standing in one frame.

• For low moves, you can do a similar method by jumping, and seeing how late you can land on an attacking low.

• Mid moves were obviously harder because you can’t duck or jump them. Things that I used were tech rolls or movement. Tech rolls in tekken have large amounts of invulnerability, so you can negate the first few frames of an attacks active frames. Any other invulnerable move works. Tracking can be a problem. Similarly dashing into moves late (or tagging in for TTT2) provides another method.

Thanks for the Suggestion!

I’m a Tekken player too ^_^,the only data that is not avaliable is exaclty active frame for every character(you could find any other data in the japanese tekken wiki page i think),good idea on mid moves,it would be a good news to tekken players if you could finish this project.

For me i’m actually building frame data for 2D games mostly,the only way i could think of is wakeup overlap,i knock 2P(if i’m 1P) down,and overlap with the move i’m testing(perform the move on wakeup),but its still pretty random because i can’t really perform as accurate as 1 frame with my hand(since you need to add 1 more frame to see if it hits).Does your programming controller has the function of setting on what exact frame you want the move to be performed?

By the way,are you the one who made “noodalls Tekken Throw Break Trainer”?

[noodalls]

Yes, I did make the throw escape trainer. I’ve just scored the gamemaker humble bundle, so when Tekken 7 comes out I might try to remake it.

I can’t see myself ever going back to finish frame data for T6/TTT2, however if capos make it into T7 I might try to do a very thorough test of that game.
http://www.tekkenzaibatsu.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=4578664#post4578664
http://www.tekkenzaibatsu.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=4593610#post4593610
This was my active frame testing for that game.

If you’re testing on PC, I would have thought investigating scripting would be the way to go. I never really worked out how to use it, but some people made some very powerful scripts for investigating things. Also, you could use some program like fraps or OBS to eliminate the need to use a camera.

Still curious to know what games you’re looking at.

[dhampirneclord]

Yes, I did make the throw escape trainer. I’ve just scored the gamemaker humble bundle, so when Tekken 7 comes out I might try to remake it.

I can’t see myself ever going back to finish frame data for T6/TTT2, however if capos make it into T7 I might try to do a very thorough test of that game.
http://www.tekkenzaibatsu.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=4578664#post4578664
http://www.tekkenzaibatsu.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=4593610#post4593610
This was my active frame testing for that game.

If you’re testing on PC, I would have thought investigating scripting would be the way to go. I never really worked out how to use it, but some people made some very powerful scripts for investigating things. Also, you could use some program like fraps or OBS to eliminate the need to use a camera.

Still curious to know what games you’re looking at.

The thrower escaper is god like

I do use Frap most of time,Camera are for other things.

Currently Melty Blood,TouHou Project.

BTW whats gamemaker humble bundle?