Burst is the opposite of a comeback mechanic. Burst increases each player’s defensive options, effectively increasing the size of each player’s life bar. This is contrary to X-Factor and Awakening which increase each player’s offensive options, making comebacks more likely, and favoring the player who’s behind on life.
Wow this looks so good for 3D!
Except, you know, that’s totally not true.
Defensive bursts allow someone who’s about to lose escape the combo and get one last chance to turn things around. Then there’s Gold Bursts, which fill the meter to max, therefore inherently increasing players’ offensive options. Every single Burst system in ArcSys games is a comeback mechanic, but obviously the games don’t suffer for it; in fact they end up giving the game more depth. The same is true for other comeback mechanics, such as KOF’s system of being able to store more meter as you lose characters.
Just because X-Factor, Pandora and the like end up crippling games doesn’t mean that comeback mechanics are poison. X-Factor and Pandora are poison because they’re bad mechanics, not just because they facilitate comebacks. Don’t place all comeback mechanics in a vacuum.
Gold burst is an offensive move, not a defensive one.
They could go the Injustice route and make the OG costumes unlockable in-game. My guess is that they will make non-ponytail Ky payed DLC, though.
…That’s exactly what I just said.
On the list != Confirmed to be making games Day 1.
To put it in perspective, here is what PlatinumGames’ Tatsuya Minami has gone on to say about them also being on that same PS4 list:
So, in short? Don’t expect to see anything from P* for a while in that area. And since then, other smaller Japanese developers have been spouting similar rationale when prompted. “We’ll be there, eventually~!”
Even Mori hasn’t been exactly forthcoming with talking about ASW’s PS4 plans beyond some vague details regarding a new IP, and then goes back to talking about more BB episodes still on the way. Which likely will take precedence because they need money now in order to invest in PS4/Durango-level development. Costs are only going to up next generation, after all.
Besides, this is the same company that was perfectly fine with releasing two more Guilty Gear XX revisions on the PS2, two years into the PS3’s lifetime. And likewise, just because the PS4 is coming, doesn’t mean that they’re likely going to completely cut off PS3-level development right away.
You said Gold Bursts increase your options because they give you full meter. They also don’t get better the less life you have. You can do it at the start of the round just as much as you can at the end of the round. That’s not a comeback mechanic. Burst in a combo is debateable, but Gold Burst is pretty much no argument.
I understand you’re not saying burst is a bad mechanic, but really, it’s not a comeback mechanic either. It doesn’t favor either player (at least, in a mirror match), which is not true of X-Factor/Awakening, because those mechanics give an advantage to whoever gets to low life first. You can burst out of a lethal combo, so what? Your opponent can then do the exact same thing to you, making your comeback more unlikely.
Just about every fighting game since Super Turbo has had something that can be interpreted as a “comeback mechanic”. The only thing that has changed is their egregiousness in effecting the dynamics of the gameplay. Ultra and X-Factor are just emphatic and obvious in how they even the playing field because they’re so (over)powerful. They were intended to be comeback mechanics first and foremost; as opposed to something like Burst or Guts, which can be interpreted as a “comeback mechanic”, but were more probably inspired by a desire to add a number of unique, supplemental elements to the core gameplay, making the core dynamic in more subtle (and more interesting) ways.
In other words: I think japanese fighting game developers see FGs as a seesaw experience that should be guided by more than the participants disparate weights and abilities to apply a force to the ground (jump).
People are too busy seeing things in black and white to realise that what matters is the SCALE of the comeback mechanic; a super or a burst is nothing like an ultra which is nothing like X-Factor. And don’t let someone who joined 3 months ago tell you otherwise.
Calling Burst a comeback mechanic is like calling Parry in 3rd strike a comeback feature.
It’s like calling a DP, a dead angle, an IB or anything you can gain an upperhand with a comeback mechanic. The dude thinks a damn shift in control and initiative is a comeback mechanic.
“I’M SPACING CORRECTLY COMEBACK MECHANIC LOL”
Ever since the Daigo parry vid that is what casual gamers are lead to believe anyway.
I hate the unreal engine but damn did that look good for a game in development.
they are a mechanic that gives you 100% meter for no effort as long as you hit one not-that-hard to hit attack. meter in GG allows you to do huge damage combos, apply tough to crack pressure, and have multiple huge utility moves at your disposal (force breaks). how is that not a comeback mechanic.
terrible false equivalency
bursts are nothing compared to x-factor and ultras, for sure. but to call it something that doesn’t allow for some big turnarounds (for less effort than if the mechanic was not in place) is just wrong.
Set one year after Overture.
So uhh…Ky’s wife, Dizzy, wonder if she be back in this…
Anyways, game looks damn nice. Although it’d be funny if hitting with a dust did that cinematic camera turnaround every time.
This is that thing people do where they rationalize that such and such mechanic that they like isn’t one of those evil comeback mechanics for various reasons.
The ability to use the Burst meter for a variety of functions at a variety of times is a large part of what makes them good mechanics in the first place. I don’t think I need to describe to you just how versatile Burst functions are in ArcSys games. But you can’t deny that they can be used to facilitate comebacks. This element of them doesn’t disappear just because they aren’t as blatant and hit you over the head with the fact like with Ultras and Pandora. The latter two, and other bad comeback mechanics, are usually designed specifically to be that and only that, and do a lot of the work for the player. Good ones are more versatile in their use and require more effort on the part of the player to make full use of them.
Even a mechanic favoring a player at lower health isn’t enough to make it bad on its own. Again, KOF XIII’s meter system lets players with less characters be able to store more meter than those with more. But that meter still has to be earned normally, and those 5-bar HD combos don’t execute themselves. I’d say many would agree that the game is more enjoyable because of this.
Maybe if you actually read my posts, you’d realize that I agree with you completely.
I’m just tired of people pretending that their favorite games had no comeback factors.
Because they aren’t designed to help you COME BACK. Yeah, meter can HELP YOU come back, but what happens if I land a gold burst at the start of the match and use my meter to kill you in one combo and a reset? Was that a comeback? Do I get MORE meter if I do it at 25% health? Does it make my combos do more damage? No, it’s available from the start of the match and doesn’t get stronger the less life you have. You’re essentially calling meter a comeback mechanic.
You’re projecting elements from examples of badly-designed mechanics onto your definition of what a comeback mechanic is, when it’s really just as simple as the phrase itself: a mechanic that can facilitate comebacks.
Please tell me where I equated player skills, decisions, and actions to an automatic function of the game.