LK > MK target combo gives you time to charge, c.LK > s.MP > f.HP seems decent if they’re standing and you don’t have charge. c.MP xx FK is also good. If they whiff a DP, go for s.HP - df.HK - HK FK.
Jab, c.HP and FK are the most important ones. s.MK, b.HP and f.HP work from certain spacings.
It’s okay as a poke. Not great, but okay. Mostly a combo/frame trap button.
It’s mostly good for spacing yourself when you have a boom on the screen tbh. You can space it to be safe, or use it as a quasi-dash to land throws. Not sure about how good the move is at dodging lows, haven’t really tried using it.
All flash kicks are upper body invincible once active frames start so you can use MK or HK flash kick (especially with his crouch walk) to anti air from a stupid long distance.
Gonna try to hit as many questions as best I can from reading the frame data.
Whats the point of st.LK. It’s 5F startup and it seems like other lights are either better or faster or have longer range. This only seems to have the target combo That target combo is plus on hit too. So s.lk > s.mk, c.lp xx FK is a combo. I’d probably recommend opening up with a jump in though since the TC is -2 on block. That is unless you want to go into a 6 frame frame trap.
While st.MP is + and can be good to combo and doesnt seem to have too much in the way of frame trap potential and short range and non-cancellable. I feel liek this move shouldnt be used too much?** I’ve found the following frame traps so far: 1 frame: s.mp, s.lp and s.mp, c.lp 2 frame: s.mp, s.mp 3 frame: s.mp, c.mp 4 frame: s.mp, s.hp
Whats generally a good way to punish with him since he doesnt have ant input specials flash kick is always good. The light version has a 4 frame startup.
His best air to airs seem to be j.LP and j.MP does this seem about right? I agree, unless you want to count his air throws
He has so many anti-air options its hard to find which one is most consistnet. st.LP is the quickest, cr.HP has the biggest range and Flash Kick has good range and priority. 3HK is one I considered but it seems like the other ones do it better. df.hk combos into flash kick
Are any of his target combos worth using? Bullet Revolver and Swing Out both knockdown, so they may be worth considering if you want a KD and don’t have a charge.
Whats his general best meaty? UDK, backward HP and st.HK all seem good to me but I just dont know what benefits others would have over the other? b.hp has 8 frames of startup, 3 active frames, crush counters, and is only -1 on block (b.hp, c.lp is a 5 frame frame gap). I’d say that would be the best choice so far.
As far as his longest pokes go, it seems forward HP is good if you dont think they’ll crouch and maybe want to bait and is faster than st.HK. st.HK seems better than forward HP if you think the opponent will crouch. cr.MK seems good to make them respect blocking low. Are there any other good pokes that would be worth using in netural like UDK (only -1)? f.hk, f.mk, b.mk, f.lk, b.lk are all good for certain situations. You can combo off of a counter hit into a light with f.mk or f.hk
It seems like with Soumersalt it generally only seems worth to use LK version since it has the fastest startup and EX when you want the hit invul. Maybe HK for damage. MK version doesnt seem worth it. All the flash kicks except the ex version do the same damage.
While he can do kinda well on the offensive he seems to prefer patient zoning. I like to go offensive sometimes, what are some good tools for doing this? His overhead is slow but his dash > grab seems decent enough. 18 frame dash. Almost as good as Nash’ dash (17 frames)
So far I really like the Versailitiy of his V Skill. Can be used to power up booms, a funny anti-air, protect yourself again projectiles, and maybe use to bait jump ins while you charge a flash kick. Are there any other cool uses? I’ve considered using it as a meaty but it doesnt seem worth since it’s too slow and on hard knockdown there are probably better options. I haven’t had a chance to play around with this move too much yet. Sorry
st.HP is good for the Crush Counter so would you only use it if you tihnk the opponent will press buttons super up close? Could it function as an ok anti-air? If you can master doing s.hp, c.mp xx SB, b.hp xx SB then it is a very good string to put into combos. Outside of combos though I probably would only go for it when I’m fishing for counter hits.
Backward HP… seems like a good high priority poke but so far all Ive found is that it’s good for meaties. What situations woudl it be useful? Well it crush counters for one. It’s also good for frame trapping and as a combo extender after a sonic boom (booms are +8 on hit)
Is cr.MP can be an ok poke or is better for block strings and combos +3 on hit and +1 on block.
As far as BnBs go, it seems jab jab Somersault seems like the best especially from a jump in. Besides like cr.MP Boom/Somersault are there any other worthy simple BnBs to learn? s.mp, c.lp xx FK is a good one. If you get a jumpin j.lk, you can go for j.lk, df.hk, FK. I wouldn’t recommend it without the jumpin though in case it is blocked
j HK generally seems like his best jump in but it has a weird arc where it can miss sometimes, are there any other good jump ins besides like jHP? j.lk is his crossup
Guile in general seems like a good beginner character since he only has two specials and lots of normals and rewards good fundamentals and patience since he doesnt have many shenanigans or mixups. Does this sound right? I see Guile as an easy to pick up character but a VERY hard one to master with the way his V-trigger works
Are UDK and backward/foward MK basically mostly good if you think your opponent will throw out low moves in neutral? I haven’t had a chance to test, but it if works anything like Nash’s f.mk then it should clear lows. So yes to your question
It seems popular to use V Trigger mostly for combos but I feel like it can be a good neutral tool since the opponent will have to block it if they have dont have some kind of armor/Critical Art to beat it. Can it be used raw to approach opponent and scare them with approaching mixups well or is it better to just save these for damages? You can always use VT outside of combos for any character. I’m sure there are plenty of uses for his VT besides just a combo extender. Though I’m sure that will be uncovered over time as people become more familiar with him
While his crouching Walk is a neat idea in theory. I havent really been able to use it well against a competent opponent. Has anyone found any good use for it? It feels too slow… You can’t even really use it to walk behind a light sonic boom. I dunno. I’m withholding judgement on this one. Maybe there is some cool high level applications for it that aren’t super obvious out of the gate
His bazooka knee in theory seems cool to approach behind a Boom or approach to get closer to opponent or an anti-air… however every attempted application of it seems to not be as good as other moves. Am I using it wrong? Seems about the same as Nash’s f.lk to me. 8 frames of startup as opposed to Nash’ 7 and 5 active frames instead of 6. So it should be a decent move to close the gap to your opponent after a knockdown to setup a meaty. You could use it to dodge cross ups from your opponent instead of dashing
His st.MK is strange it feel like it could be a poke or anti-air but the angle isn’t good enough for either. Is it even worth to use this attack? I have to test to see what you are talking about.
Another thing about his VT: I’ve done some full-screen activates, thrown a boom followed up by 2-3 LP breaks, and used that as an approach tool. If you jump and time it properly I believe you can use it as a left-right-mixup.
Besides the shown corner combos/damage, his standard j.HK/j.HP > c.MP > Sonic Boom > Trigger > Guile High Kick > Flash Kick > Sonic Hurricane is so simply to pull of and does 450-470 damage. Even a simple Flash kick > Sonic Hurricane does 410 damage without trigger. That’s quite insane for this game.
The gief matchup is actually really hard for me. It’s rediculous, he can grab you from so far away and then use his stupid v trigger to go straight through a boom and CA you. Fucking stupid.
He just killed me in 3 hits what a stupid character.
How is it fair to have an unblockable CA that does 50%. Fuck right off gief, and why the hell does half of his moves just go through Guiles back fist. What a joke.
Flash kick isn’t punishing shit and Guiles buttons loose to everything. Cool
And his fucking air spd erghhhhhh what an overpowered piece of dog shit.
Yea I actually lost both of my Gief sets but it was fun. Problem was, so much of Guile’s game is projectile zoning and Gief has a plethora of tools to neutralize that.
I pretty much got my ass handed to me for about 4 hours straight today. I won a little under 43% of my matches and dropped my first 8 sets lol. I disagree with folks saying that Guile will be an easy character to pick up, he is damn tough to use.
I also started doing better when I said to hell with V-Trigger and started V reversal more. Getting that space is so key to me and honestly I wasn’t getting much damage outside of a few gimmick stuff with v trigger so I kind of scrapped it altogether. With as much as I use v skill, I was able to v reversal twice and still have v trigger towards then end with low health.
All and all he is really fun to play but he is going to take some time getting used to.
As a Gief user, although tough to tell at the moment for the matchup, I still think Guile owns Gief. Gief is only giving you trouble because those players have been using him for some time whereas Guile is only 12+ hours old. I fought one last night and the first match gave me trouble, but after that, it was in my favor. The matchup is new for Guile/Gief. As long as you can keep Gief out and spam the right Booms, you can out footsie Gief and punish a lot of his unsafe shit.
No need to shit on Gief by comparison. He is easily one of the hardest characters to win with against most of the cast, and with time, Guile will blow him up.
Ive just come to the conclusion that he is pretty terrible.
His FK’s don’t hit shit and have the range of my tongue, his normals are slow and just seem to pass through everyone’s models like they are ghosts and there are so many anti zoning tools in this game it renders him useless. Once gief has V trigger it’s game over, you can’t throw booms or you instantly die. It’s pathetic and it’s not fun loosing to a had acted than can jab you 3 times and then still command grab you.
What a joke.
Bring on Balrog, unless they also make him underpowered in which case, shieeeet
Yea you are probably right. I started to get the hang of it at the end but I just couldn’t close out the round, especially when Giefs in V trigger a lot of my arsenal became unusable.
Isn’t the Fk supposed to be auto correcting? Maybe my timing is off but I am missing hard with it on deep crossup jumpins.
Nope it just got consistently harder. The gief realised he could just command grab me from anywhere he liked, also that he can absorb all of my shit and then just throw out his own crap without it being punishable by anything even a reversal flash kick.
His air SPD his stupid, I’ve come to get over the fact that command grabs in themselves ruin the whole pace of the game but an air one… It’s just stupid. Jump and get command grabbed or stay on the floor and get command grabbed hmmm, I suppose I’ll have to take the one that does less damage.
I don’t know the frame data, but you can punish a lot of Giefs vtrigger when it is active. So long as you don’t Boom within range of his vacuum, you can stuff just about anything he does. Neutral or block during the vacuum, you can hit Gief. It’s really sad for Gief users actually.
