Frame Data?

I have no clue why it is important. We can see what is good and what is effective. Knowing the frames is just a way to have an excuse it seems for people playing stupid. If someone could tell me why it is so important to know then I might change my mind.

Knowing which moves are safe to use seems stupid to me too

^^What he said, only scrubs use frame data, all the real pro’s have spliced their DNA with a Flies.

They don’t need frame data, they can SEE the frames man.

Got a dude up in Tijuana I know if you are interested.

http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/6691/earlysz6.jpg

Frame data will de-bitchalate yo’ ass. Good.
WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

You should know whats safe after you use it a certain number of times. I guess a lot of people don’t pay attention to situations in this game.

unless you can see the exact frame you or your opponent are recovering, you wouldn’t necessarily be able to tell which moves will work to punish what, and what is safe, and what isn’t… what is safe against one player may not be safe against another because of how they play, but ultimately, the frame data will tell you what is safe ALL AROUND

but why would anyone waste time trying to learn that kinda stuff anyway, who needs frames when you can try every move on many opponents and see if it’s safe that way… :rolleyes:

Its even more than knowing whats safe, but knowing what is unsafe can give you a real advantage over your opponent. If you know the frames of certain moves you will know if what they are doing, although looks quick and unpublishable, actually can be clipped with an uppercut or something. Like who knew you could just throw Zangief out of his banishing flat even if you’re hit with the weakest version?

Beyond that, especially in this game, it can help you understand how to create combos with certain characters based on link opportunities.

Over all having a deeper understanding of the game cant hurt. You dont have to memorize every last move but knowing your character and what they are capable of I think is pretty important.

If I can get an interview with Daigo, or Ojisan where they talk about frame data it would be appreciated. Frame Data is mostly theory crafting. Strategies and play styles have been developed through trial and error. I highly doubt people create a play style thats effective just by looking at frame rates. Yes, it is important to know. If it doesn’t apply to the situation its useless. Now, recovery times and things of that nature are HUGE. Maybe thats a part of frame data but it seems if that were the case people are just trying to be elitists.

Hehe…

trying to have a deeper understanding of the games system by learning some frames makes us elitists…? what does waiting around for daigo or ojisan to say something is important make you?

you speak about the importance of finding things out on your own, but then you say something isn’t important unless daigo says it is…

What the hell are you saying? Frame data is a huge advantage and everyone should be thankful for it. Without frame data, David Sirlin wouldn’t have c.strong’d 34 times. Understanding frame data helps you understand the attack inside and out.

Baseball players taking steroids? Now those guys are elitists…

Frame data is cheap and you should never play cheap:mad:

By the way welcome to SRK

learning frame data in 2d games, i will admit, is overrated for the most part. Most top players don’t look at em. You just start to know what beats what through experience and trial and error. You don;t need frame data to do that.

But then there are the people that already figure things out through experience and maybe they want to learn why x beats y. It’s curiosity that gets some players. I like to break the engine down as much as possible and figure out all the little nuances. I find that fun. Sure I know that ryu/ken c.strong beats blanka’s slide clean in ST. But I’m not satisfied with that, I want to see why, I like that closure. And maybe also learn why another person’s c.strong(guile’s in particular) who has the same type of punch and range, loses to the slide clean.

I know when an opponents super is executed, I know there are times where it seems like I can counter it, and sometimes I can’t. I don’t want to settle for random, I wanna find out what makes it work.

Do I need to know why? No. But I like to understand things I like. It’s like, I can be working at a manufacturing plant. And my job is to hit all these buttons and turn all these knobs at specific times of the day. The directions are laid out flat to me on what I need to do. I get curious and I want to figure out and learn WHY I am pressing these buttons. It wasn’t necessary for me to know why I was doing this routine at work, but I wanted to know and it may make me more efficient in my job.

thats my 2 cents

Frame data is nice, but being able to see hitboxes is where it is at IMO.

Thank you very much. This is basically what I looking for.

this thread sucks

well before you go saying what does and what doesn’t seem important you should atleast know what frame data entails. What do you think recovery time is measured by? that’s right, frames. so by definition recovery time is frame data and therefore by your own admission frame data is huge. there you go. no need to change your mind, you already thought it was important but you just didn’t know it.

Frame data also allows for you to create mixup situations as well. Especially when you consider meaties. Also knowing how many frames it take your character to jump can create some pretty good techniques as well. Jump data is really important for games with jump cancels like Guilty Gear. Where you can time 1 frame jumps. It’s also important in footsies as well.

I don’t normally use frame data, but I’m going to start. In the past I always was a roaster browser, and only playing most of the roaster in crappy ways. But I’m just going to memorize the frame data for 2 characters in SFIV, and then see what situations I create.

I believe you will become a whole lot more creative when you use frame data. For example you can safely bait some moves.

Let’s say that I know if I jump in with character A and my opponent will AA my character with ABC moves. If I’m at a range, then this move will trade or hit from this distance. Frame are important here. Hitboxes are as well. When you want to bait pokes when playing footsies, frame data can help as well.

I’m sure a lot of good players don’t use it, but I’m not very good without it. Scrubs like me need it to at least know how things add up.

Well Daigo just told me that frames ran over his dog and that’s why he doesn’t use them but that doesn’t mean all frames are bad.

Thread served purpose, OP owned himself imo