Fighting Game A.I Sucks

Current Fighting Games Fighting Game Discussion
1

You know i really dont’ want to go out on a rant here but fighting game AI really does blow … hard.

“Psychic” AI doesn’t help anyone in fact it actually hurts everyone’s game because if you adjust to the cpu patterns that will only hurt your game against a real person and capcom really missed out on a opportunity to help would be fighting game players.

For those who don’t know but i’m sure everyone does “Psychic” AI is really just input reading AI, in super turbo it was at it’s worse and it’s still a crappy overall AI system in cvs2, mvc2 ect.

Mvc2 had the computer given extra stamina to make up for it’s weak AI system and the AI system in general just makes people worse than they have to be.

Ever wonder why people throw fireballs non - stop? cuz the AI is a sucker for them and if you dont’ get any competition you’ll be playing the computer and get your ass handed to you later.

It’s easy to complain , but here’s a few ideas:

Incorporate “reaction time” , no psychic dping my jabs, furthermore no cvs2 parry my jab into level 3.

Reaction time would also get rid of being thrown out of… everything… the computer has a AWFUL system especially with shin akuma and the like if you stick out something you will most likely get dped/level 3’d/ rolled through or teleported through and if you don’t they throw you … how does this help anyone? all this does is force you to use crappy computer only tactics that don’t help anyone out.

Now if you sharpen the AI either by making a grid or something so it can detect where the opponent is and where fireballs are and incorporating reaciton time (wait a reasonable ammount of time to simulate a human’s reaction time) so it doesn’t jump out of everything right away then I think it might be better.

I know they probably wouldn’t get it right the first time and it would probably take alot of work but maybe if they took the time to incorporate a good AI system (one that is good on the offense aswell and can also be a decent example for beginners to base their strategy off of) they could also find out if some characters are somewhat overpowered or not because they’d have to spend more time in the actual game play aspect of the game.

Just a suggestion.

But imagine if you could actually have fun playing the comp and get the simulation of playing a real person or at least close to it.

edit: i also know right now isn’t exactly the best time to be asking stuff from capcom … snicker but still i think it would help and it is probably a good idea.

edit 2: just a small improvement to ai would probably help

2

Yeah, all fighting game A.I. should play at Choi/Ricky level.

3

Reason #247 to try VF4:Evo: Great AI, no cheating; it puts in its commands every frame just like a human. Sometimes you can find an exploitable pattern, but practically nonexistant in other fighting games.

Edit: ‘but practically nonexistant compared to other fighting games’ is what I meant.

4

True that, but now if only I can learn to actually play it! An AI like that isn’t truely flawless, but it’s a step in the right direction. The future of fighters is going to be interesting to watch as it is, but I’ll bet the AI gets better, especially considering the console sceene is practically it right now.

5

Good 2D AI: Eternal Fighter Zero.

6

Who actually plays against the computer these days?

And if you’ve ever played ST: nonstop fireballs isn’t half bad there.

7

really good 2d AI: KOF95, SS2.
really good 3d AI: VF4Evo

SNK used to make great AI, but then they realized it was turning people off.

Capcom and Namco have never made a good AI, though Namco’s SC AI is respectable.

8

wasn’t snk known for making input reading AI that was mega cheap especially in bosses?

9

Unfortunately, a game table of such complexity would be pretty much impossible to construct right now (even worse if the computer has to navigate it to select the right moveand it does). A full game table for even Chess is impossible for us to build right now.

I think the computer is only good for practicing things like parries, hit confirms, combos, and stuff like that. Once I get a joystick, I’ll be fighting the AI in 3S to get used to playing on stick.

10

AI in VF may do input like a human player, but you can’t make AI strategize or react like a human player, never will. Best that can be done is to tell it what moves to use at certain ranges, reactions to your attacks when it’s not doing anything, and possibly anything cheesy that human players can’t do (SNK bosses, Liu Kang’s repeated bicycle kick in MK3, reverse throwing even when they’re in frozen frames in MK, ect). Soul Calibur II’s hardest setting has the AI to a guard impact on almost all your attacks, but you know it’s done on purpose. Most of it however seems just unneccessary and not needed.

Some AI is just way too easy when you learn how to play the game and how to beat it, even on the hardest setting (SF Alpha 3, Soul Calibur). Either way, AI doesn’t help a player play the game, since AI has predictability. Using skills you abuse to beat AI likely won’t help you in real competition play.

11

i think it’s possible just use the same input reading methods and enhance them but then put in recovery time so in a sense it can respond to the situations but while still not given a unfair advantage which will help players develop strategies.

Maybe even factor in how many times a player does a move and once a player does it 2-3 times then maybe have it run the counter situation once the player is in that position he uses that move in relation to the cpu.

Yea it would take alot of memory and shit to do right but i don’t think it’s too impossible.

12

That’s one thing that disappointed me in Tekken 5. I’m using Feng Wei, and every single AI short of Warlord level falls for his back and both punches shoulder tackle. Every. Single. Time. It’s pathetic. Beating AI Dans in VF4 feels like a real accomplishment. The VF4 AI, in my opinion, “feels” more like a real player than any other AI to date. The Dan and higher level AI in Tekken 5 is utter shit.

13

Yep. Nothing like getting whooped by the first team in KOF95. Seriously, it’s pretty bad when you have to rely on the “magic move” or certain patterns to beat the AI, otherwise it’ll stomp you. The best AI I’ve played against was in VF4:Evo.

Nothing beats human competition though.

14

VF4: Evolution is the only fighting game to date where the computer has been worth playing. True, computers do not match humans, but at least the VF4 AI has setups, punishes when you make a mistake, and uses viable combos. The lack of the latter part in recent games, particularly Tekken 5, is aggravating.

15

ST AI – motherfucking cheating bastard.

16

Im happy playing the AI on #R, set on maniac level. It’s not that cheap and it’s fun to play. Only till you get up to I-No, then it sucks.

I’ve never played VF Evo so I can’t comment.

17

#R AI is decent at best. the computer only does basic combos, does crappy dust combos, almost never uses, RCs/FRCs, randomly gets hit by meaty attacks, and randomly super jumps. plus there are patterns that the cpu does that when learned, make the computer a joke. example: sols pattern of short VV, short VV, long VV. or testaments pattern of abusing his 2HS and following with a GD after about the 2nd or 3rd 2HS. and dont forget Venoms bad habit of summoning ALL of his balls no matter what and hitting them with his dust. and has far as i-no being hard on maniac, shes not. just over powered and predictable.

18

You can successfully rush that AI with enough practice. I’ve done it with Ryu and Cammy. Vega’s the only real bastard because of his almost unbeatable jump kick and his claw that can stop you from mid-range. But if you can cause him to do his backflip, you can throw him, make him block a jump kick (wait a half-sec so he’s recovered when you do, so you don’t get nailed by his forward flip), and he almost always backflips again, repeat.

And then there’s Akuma…

19

Thank you. It’s nice to see bitching about things in fighting games and have VF4 and EVO (for the most part, but stick with EVO since it’s onl $20) address the complaints only not to be played.

Nice job people :tdown:

20

Street Fighter Alpha 3’s AI gives me good practice.