Fei Long Q&A: Ask simple questions here!

Classic Fighting Games Ultra Street Fighter IV
1221

Uhhhh I don’t know if it is the speed or not, then biggest thing I can say for you to do is 1) use lp rekka its easier to use as you can two in one the command, and will make it easier to hit confirm. 2) know that you are canceling the cr.lp into the rekka, meaning you dont have to wait until the lp is brought back as soon as it makes contact you can cancel it into the rekka. 3) This may seem obvious but is a problem for some, be sure you are hitting forward when you do the rekka motion.

For the cw>cl.hp>rekka/flame kick watch this video. It seems to have helped a lot of people get this down and understand what plinking and double plinking are all about. If you have any questions about it lemme know. hope this helps!

[media=youtube]m2E4PJ09OE8[/media]

note: this video can be found in the “read this first” thread under “any help with hitting cw>hp>rekka?” heading incase you lose the link or can’t find it again.

1222

@ Twocan: Double tap the LP, use negative edge, or bring your input presses closer to that speed. If you’re doing it and it and the LP whiffs, you either get cr.LP and nothing else, OR cr.LP xx st.LP. This depends on if you double-tap, use negative edge, or if you just press the buttons quickly.

1223

@H1gg1n5
thanks for that vid, it helps on the CW hp timing a bit just need to practice. The plink timing is a bit hard. Also for fei do we only need to plink s.HP’s and s.MP’s? Because I know there are some moves that are unnecessary to plink, but there are some that should always be plinked. Which ones are those?

@nosone
All i can say is magic, at first i thought I was doing it a bit too fast, but you were right. I made my inputs even faster and it worked, thanks.

1224

No prob :slight_smile:

Kind of a tricky question that you just asked here though. You would plink any medium or heavy normal that is used as a 1-frame or even a 2-frame link. Check the frame data provided in the SRK wiki for Fei (link at the top of every SRK page). It really helps to learn the frame data for Fei as it will help you to gain a better grasp on his combos and such.

1225

I had a question about the frame data. I’ve looked at it many times, but still don’t fully understand it. I see that the time it takes it dependent on frames, so that’s fine. But not always why a move an opponent will do comes out before a move that I do. Case in point; I played Sagat, and I assume the guy must’ve been plinking the entire match (I lost for the record to him; TWICE) without doing any special moves at all. He would do the cr.HK, which every time beat out my cr.LP or cr.LK.

So my question would be, does plinking override the frame data? Or was the frames just faster for Sagat to do the cr.HK than it would be for me to do cr.LP?

And does anyone do any practice sessions? I’ve been trying to main Fei for almost a year, but I still feel like I suck with him.

1226

Frame data is abolute–you can’t get around the speed (or slowness) of a move in 99% of cases. Range and hitboxes are another issue though.

This term “beat out” that you’re using is being thrown around very loosely. There are different ways for an attack to win:

  1. Speed: if move X is 3 frames and move Y is 5 frames, given that both are launched at the same time and within the correct range, X wins. This is meant in a literal sense–the moves must be pressed in the same 1/60th of a second to count as “at the same time”.

  2. Hitbox: if move X’s hitbox touches the move Y’s hurtbox, but move Y’s hitbox isn’t long enough to do the same, move X wins. Note that invincible moves have no hurtbox, which is why they’re not able to be hit during some portion of the attack. Check out the hitbox data in the READ THIS FIRST thread to understand what the difference between a hit and hurtbox are.

  3. Throw priority: if move X is a 3-frame jab, and move Y is a 3-frame throw, move Y wins as throws beat attacks if they become active at the same time, within the appropriate range. If both moves are throws, it’s a 50-50. Some moves have throw invincibility (Abel’s regular Tornado and U2 come to mind).

  4. Airborne status vs. Throw: aside from special throw-invincible moves, all airborne attacks are unable to be thrown by standing throws (except for those that target air opponents like Falling Sky).

Likely, what happened was, you pressed cr.LP out of range and Sagat pressed cr.HK only a few frames after. This gave the illusion that your cr.LP was ABOUT to make contact but was beaten. In reality, you just missed and he punished you.

Plinking doesn’t speed up a move; it just gives you additional chances to get it out. This is used to make sure that you nail 1-frame links by giving you 2-3 extra “inputs”–kinda like the TURBO function.

Add me on XBL if you want to get some sessions in. If you have a mic we can go over some things that you’re not too sure about.

1227

Hello, well i got a few noob questions here lol. Im trying to learn to play relying on fei’s normals, focuses and rekkas, leaving out cw and flame kick for a while so i can get accustomed to it. Anyone have tips on executing these combos?

cr.lk–>cr.lk–>cr.lp xxHP.Rekka

cr.lk–>cr.lk–>s.lp xxHP.Rekka

cr.lk–>cr.lk–>s.lp–>cr.lp xxHP.Rekka

My main issue here is cancelling more than 1 move into the rekka. For example if I were to try and cancle cr.lp or s.hp, s.mp, s.lp or just one move into a rekka its simple. But if i do something like cr.lp–>cr.lp xxHP Rekka, then it gets odd, i just cant do it. Any tips?

Do the cr.lk’s need to be plinked? I see some people plink em on youtube, but im not sure.

And lastly im trying to get the timing for this in training mode, I watched a vid describing the timining and plink, but maybe i just need practice

HK.CW–>s.hp xxHP.Rekka

1228

Plinking is just adding an extra frame to a move, in other words making a 1-frame link a 2-frame link.
It can also be used on other links though, like cr. MP into cr. MP. I’m not too sure how this would happen, but I think you can plink counter hit-cr. MP into LP/EX Rekka by doing cr. LP, then plinking the MP, and if LP is done too early the EX version will come out, which has the same start-up frame as LP rekka (7 frames). I may be wrong though.

1229

With these combos the last input before the rekka must be linked for the rekka to come out properly. Also the cr.lk>cr.lk>cr.lp>rekka is a one frame link so that will take some time to get. All of these combos should go like this example cr.lk>st.lp>(delay)cr.lp>rekka or cr.lk>cr.lk> (delay)cr.lp>rekka

The CW combo, the best advice I can give is to P-link the HP when fei’s feets hit the ground after the cw hits.

As far as the plinking of cr.lk you are probably seeing the person crouch tech and then going from that into the BnB. Also the cr.lk can be chained so you shouldnt need to plink it at all.

Keep at it, youll get it! just try to work through the timing.

1230

@H1gg1n5

thanks dude that delay tip has me getting the combo now. Just some practice and it’ll be constant. Also ive beein trying double tapping on the cw combo, it works a bit, ill try plinking and dbl tapping also. Thanks.

1231

To be technical about it, plinking doesn’t add a frame to the move itself; it manipulates the input leniency on button presses. In reality a 1 frame link is still a 1 framer, you just get extra chances to get it, effectively making it easier. For the cl.HP link out of CW it looks like:

HP…HP
…HP…HP
…HP…LP

The first line represents the press/release of HP alone, the second line is where the system changes MP to HP, and the third line shows the final LP you would get if you missed the chance(s) to get HP. The cl.HP itself is still a 4 frame move, and the frame advantage on HK CW is still +4. These factors don’t change through plinking so even if you plink outside of a link combo, you won’t get any “enhancements” to your moves. This is strictly for links and some kara-moves.

You also have to note that the stronger move is the only one that can be plinked. In the case of plinking a Rekka, its not possible since the inputs DO overlap (note the diagram), giving you EX rekka always. You can drum it though, which is slower than plinking. If you drum it, you’ll get whichever Rekka strength you hit first, followed by the others in whichever order you pressed. Also, CH cr.MP gives +8, making LP and EX Rekkas already easy to do if you see the CH. With the frame buffer from cr.MP, you can easily roll the QCF and press punch on confirming the CH.

1232

I know already that it won’t make a 5-frame start-up move hit after a CW. What I’m saying is that by plinking, the link becomes 1 frame “easier” to pull off because it gives you extra chances. I think you’re misunderstanding me. lol

1233

My mistake then-- just your wording had me confused. That would be correct then :razz:

1234

It’s alright. lol

Anyway, I do have some questions. Edit: It’s quite a lengthy post, sorry. I don’t expect you (or anyone for that matter) to give in-detail explanations of it all, but I’m just curious about these things.

First one: What are your reasons for using U2, and how do you justify which characters to use it against? I usually use it against characters where I feel like I don’t have a chance of landing U1, or against characters that who have moves I can easily react to with it, or against characters with very good wake-up game or dive kicks. I’ll write down the characters I use it against and my reasons for why. Feel free to tell me why U1 would be better though, or if you can add any reasons for why U2 is a good idea.

Viper: Obviously, because of her Burning Kicks, plus I can’t juggle with CW into U1 after an FADC. And her Burning Kicks aren’t very hard to relate to 'cause I’ve seen a lot of Viper matches, and I used to main her, so generally I don’t really consider them a threat.

Chun-Li: A lot of moves hit twice, so usually focus isn’t an option, and there aren’t many times where I can actually punish her with U1 because she has a lot of double-hitting pokes, and her pokes in general are just incredibly fast. However, her DF + HK gets completely shut down because of U2, and I don’t have to worry about EX FK magically turning into EX CW or EX Tenshin, as either U2 or EX FK will come out as she crosses me up, and both work. The other reason, which is probably the more obvious reason, is her flip kick which gets picked up by U2, and it’s not hard to react to at all.
Not to mention, cl. MP > HK CW > cl. HP > Rekkas (or FK) works against Chun, and it does about 400 damage and costs no meter.

Zangief: Simply to get some air from his jump-ins, 'cause that’s probably the scariest thing about him. At least to me it is. I don’t get to use it beside those jump-ins, but to me that’s alright, 'cause Zangief usually loses the ground game, and the skies are always protected. :smiley:

Guy: His elbow can be countered with this, and sometimes my reactions are on point enough to react to him suddenly stopping in the air (which is a confirmed elbow - and FKs have a tendency to sometimes trade with elbow… probably because I do it too early). Not to mention it stops his run>slide and run>overhead; or it can at the very least scare the player of using it. The overhead can be countered on reaction, so I don’t have to worry about that, and the slide can be focused, and his run>stop can be Rekka’d, so he has to take a gamble everytime he wants to do that.
I’m also pretty sure U2 works against his Hozanto (the one where he attacks with his back), and it’s safe on block, and I know that some Guy players like to use that. But that’s barely ever I get to use it against that. It’s mostly just elbow and overhead.

Seth: His dive kicks get shut off, and I’ve seen quite a few good Seth players use his “toe kicks” in the corner, where it can be almost impossible to block online because of lag. So it works against that too. And Seth has some good oki-zeme, so it helps shutting that off. Seth is generally not that hard to fight against because Fei hurts so much against him, but if Seth can keep his pressure going, then it can almost feel like you’re trapped. And U2 helps against that in my opinion.

Akuma: This one, to me, is tricky, because it really depends on the Akuma player. If he runs around and spams fireballs, then obviously U2 isn’t gonna help at all. But if he plays rushdown, like I think Akuma should be played (in general at least, probably not against Zangief and other strong ‘melee’-characters), then U2 will help against his dive kicks and ambiguous cross-ups. It’s pretty much for the same reason as the rest of the characters (with the exception of Chun)… that I want to shut their offence down, because without that offence it won’t be much of a problem to take them down.
Plus it’s not very often I get to use focus in my experience. At best I would get a focus from a sweep, but they can cancel that into U1 (good players can anyway), so getting to use U1 is only a slight chance… from my experience anyway.

Other question is: How do I do the input for cr. LK xx cr. LK + OS LP Rekka? I’ve tried doing it, but it doesn’t seem to work. Is there any video of it up on YouTube or something?

Edit: Also, I’ll be replying to that comment you made in the video section later today, I think, but I just haven’t gotten around to it. I really appreciate the feedback though. It’s very much appreciated. :smiley:

1235

It’s a loaded question-- 70% of the time it’s up to preference. I pick Ultra 1 in many cases since I’m quite comfortable with having it and using it in bait situations and punishments. Overall though, U2 adds more to Fei’s defense and really changes the game. It’s a given that either Ultra provides great comeback, but U1 can be forced through offense while U2 is best left as a defensive option.

A full U1 gives you a safe-jump opportunity while a 3-hit juggle U1 brings the opponent into the corner where you can start zoning him; both allow you to nearly halve the opponent’s health by will alone (if you use the juggle starting with a cl.HP combo). In my experience, having it or not having it changes little in the way the opponent plays. They’ll still throw out those big 1-hit pokes and use the same attack patterns. This can work to your advantage if you’re good at playing Fei’s normal offensive/defensive zoning game without the aid of U2. This can also give you a chance to catch onto their patterns if you were struggling before. On the other end of things, U1 won’t be a powerful tool for keeping the opponent off of you if they’re dominating on offense. If you’re losing and the other guy is great at doing safe-jumps and such, you’ll wish you had U2 on hand. For characters where the cl.MP xx HK CW combo works, I also agree that U2 would be better then.

U2 shuts down formerly “safe” cross-ups and high-pressure mix-ups. On the other end though, it invites smarter playing by the opponent. You’ll get baited A LOT when you face high level opponents, and they’ll also start playing more defense when your bar starts to flash. Since it typically only flashes at half health and lower, you’re giving them a signal to play it cool and hold onto whatever lead they may have. That could suck to fight against. Of course, if your bar is flashing when you have the lead on your opponent, that may be a good thing for you as well since they’ll be less inclined to rush in to make up for the life deficit. In either case, don’t always expect to actually use U2, just hold onto it for what benefits it may bring.

[edit] Oh also, Guy’s Hozanto is armor breaking so U2 would lose to that one. Just saving you the trouble :slight_smile:

For the cr.LK ~ Rekka OS, my inputs are something like:

:d:+:lk:+:lp:,:df:,:f:+:lk:+:hp:

I do an OS tech in the beginning just for the heck of it. There’s an awkward rhythm to it–not fast at all. You actually have to wait for cr.LK to almost end before finishing the motion. Try that input in open space and see if you can get the cr.LK and the Rekka to come out properly. Then speed it up progressively. There’s a point where going too fast just won’t work–don’t cross that point and you’ll have the timing of the OS down. If you do it in front of the dummy afterwards, you should get cr.LK > st.LK.

1236

I agree 100% with Mignon on the U2 uses he mentioned. Also, @nosone, I’ve been trying some OS yesterday (for the first time, lol), specifically against Chun and Vega. I tried to OS Ultra 1 against the Vega’s flip, and it works either after a sweep or a throw. When Vega is backdashing, though, it works just after a sweep. Same for Chun. Is it normal or am I messing something with the timing?

1237

I also use U2 against Ken. It shuts down a lot of his cross up bull shit and gives you one less aspect to worry about.

I’ll also pick U2 against overlay aggressive players and not use it.

1238

There’s some info on that in the matchup thread with Vega in it that might help.

1239

What is the timing/visual cues to get the 3 full hits of Ultra1 after Chicken Wing?

Everytime I do it I only get 2 hits :S

What’s the trick to getting the sweet sweet third hit?

1240

After Chicken Wing it only works on a couple characters: Honda, Dhalsim, Dee Jay, and Rufus (there may be one that I’m missing, but I dunno). Each character has a different falling animation and different timings. The trick is actually in the timing of when you do CW after Flame Kick. For Dhalsim, do it immediately. For Dee Jay, do it as you would normally do a CW combo. For Rufus and Honda, it has to be timed meticulously.

All other characters fall after 2 hits, no matter what. You can get 3 hits directly after a Flame Kick> FADC, but only if you omit the CW. Launch the Ultra as the opponent’s body falls just slightly from its peak. This also misses on a couple of characters and forces a 2-hitter, but I believe the only character that can’t be hit by either a CW > Ultra or a straight 3-hit Ultra juggle is C.Viper. Ibuki can be hit by the CW > Ultra at least.