Features you do NOT want to see in modern fighting games

[Little_Goten]

But what about K-groove?

Every time I hit someone out of the air and they block it, I start to rage. I guess it’s just because it’s different than I’m used to.

I still like CvS2’s K-groove though. Running and flashing red FTW.

[leileilol]

Fatalities in a Capcom game

[Snoe_Cone_XV]

Hate to burst your bubble, but that’s been in almost every street fighter.

I’m talking about shit like :df::f::db::df:x2 = dp

I don’t mind short cuts that make sense.

[ilitirit]

I’m talking about shit like :df::f::db::df:x2 = dp

That has more to do with large timing windows than lenient motions.

You can actually do 62141236 in ST and it will give you either Tatsu, Shinkuu, DP, Shakunetsu or Fireball depending on your timing (and whether or not you have meter).

[FaceMeAndBeBroken]

http://www.pcgameshardware.com/screenshots/medium/2009/06/Yoshinori_Ono_Producer.jpg

[Coth_X]

Is that for a particular version? I thought all the stage sizes were different.

http://nki.combovideos.com/data.html#stagespeed

No each stage has a different frameskip but all are the same length.

-trolls suck-

[Coth_X]

That has more to do with large timing windows than lenient motions.

You can actually do 62141236 in ST and it will give you either Tatsu, Shinkuu, DP, Shakunetsu or Fireball depending on your timing (and whether or not you have meter).

Depends on button pressed. Since special moves follow a prioriy scheme. If you don’t have meter and we assume its fast enough that motion would always be a srk with punch.

The problem with shortcuts is that annoying stuff like the sfiv feilong flamekick.

Honestly shortcuts and blown open input windows are stupid.

Reversal windows should be reduced some too.

-trolls suck-

[d3v]

That has more to do with large timing windows than lenient motions.

Depends on button pressed. Since special moves follow a prioriy scheme. If you don’t have meter and we assume its fast enough that motion would always be a srk with punch.

The problem with shortcuts is that annoying stuff like the sfiv feilong flamekick.

Honestly shortcuts and blown open input windows are stupid.

Reversal windows should be reduced some too.

-trolls suck-

I like Mike Z’s solution to this in SkullGirls.

SG Q&A Thread - Launch Party April 10-11th

In SG, instead of having a particular bit of code that determines if you entered a QCT, an another that determines if you entered a DP, the actual motion is written out in script (D,DF,F+P, for example, or F,D,DF+P) and what the motion contains determines how long you have to enter it.
I did a huge amount of empirical testing between 1999 and 2006, and arrived at the following conclusion to make motions “nice” for beginning players while not having them last too long that veterans would expect them to have expired: for two directions next to each other like D,DF or DF,F you have 4 frames of time per direction required. For directions not next to each other, like the F,D in a DP or the D,U in a charge motion, you have an additional 4 frames between them to traverse intermediate directions.
Practical examples:

• A fireball is actually written as D,DF,F,X+P where X means “any direction”. D,DF,F each contribute 4f of time, and since X is easily reachable from any other direction it adds an extra 2f, for a total of 14f to enter the motion.
• A DP is written as F,D,DF,X+P, giving you 4+extra 4 between+4+4+2 = 18f.

During that length of time, you can do whatever else you want as long as those directions are present, same as in other games.

[ilitirit]

No each stage has a different frameskip but all are the same length.

I know the stages are different speeds but has it been confirmed that the stages are the same length? IIRC, Sim’s stage is the fastest and Ryu’s is the slowest.

Depends on button pressed. Since special moves follow a prioriy scheme. If you don’t have meter and we assume its fast enough that motion would always be a srk with punch.

I’m pretty sure that when T.Akiba tested it he was using fully overlapped inputs, so he was pressing kick + punch at the same time. I’ll test it later.

[Mr.X]

I only have a problem with long stages when the walkspeed and/or dashes are slow (SFIV)

[Coth_X]

I know the stages are different speeds but has it been confirmed that the stages are the same length? IIRC, Sim’s stage is the fastest and Ryu’s is the slowest.

I’m pretty sure that when T.Akiba tested it he was using fully overlapped inputs, so he was pressing kick + punch at the same time. I’ll test it later.

There’s been no reason to think stages have different widths. Tho it wouldn’t matter.

It doesn’t matter the point is, if you don’t have meter and you do all of ryu’s special moves in one frame and press punch and kick you will get srk. This has been the age old problem with walk forward sweep hado producing a srk. Srks have the “hardest” input therefore, capcom gave it priority over all other shoto specials.

I like the idea of reading the last few inputs to determine the move. That way f d df f would be a qcf motion.

-trolls suck-

[Mad_Mistress]

There’s been no reason to think stages have different widths. Tho it wouldn’t matter.

It doesn’t matter the point is, if you don’t have meter and you do all of ryu’s special moves in one frame and press punch and kick you will get srk. This has been the age old problem with walk forward sweep hado producing a srk. Srks have the “hardest” input therefore, capcom gave it priority over all other shoto specials.

I like the idea of reading the last few inputs to determine the move. That way f d df f would be a qcf motion.

-trolls suck-

Problem with that is a lot of people learn to do DPs by doing F,QCF or 6236 to get used to it. The best way to avoid this (and also how it is in Skullgirls is to have it so HCF overrides DP motion, so if you are walking forward and want a fireball, to make sure you don’t get a DP you do 1236 or DB,QCF.

[Coth_X]

Problem with that is a lot of people learn to do DPs by doing F,QCF or 6236 to get used to it. The best way to avoid this (and also how it is in Skullgirls is to have it so HCF overrides DP motion, so if you are walking forward and want a fireball, to make sure you don’t get a DP you do 1236 or DB,QCF.

That’s just a habit brought on by the current dominant system. We should be doing srks with the zig zag in the first place. a system that reads the intended inputs would simply require people to do the motion as it is decribed to be.

At least in theory.

-trolls suck-

[jedpossum]

Is that for a particular version? I thought all the stage sizes were different.

http://nki.combovideos.com/data.html#stagespeed

I tested the arcade version by using player 1’s X placement(at memory location FF8454)

[thelgndwilnvrdy]

Games that don’t significantly develop characters between iterations. OMG you seen that SF5!! They gave guile a new move…now he got that forward knee! Dayummm they gave guile that forward knee…shits gon get ugly son!! That ain’t shit ryu got a back fierce now…and it’s 2 hits!! Wow I can’t wait to test the new possibilities. Can u imagine the mixups and mind games with a forward and back fierce

Lame

[ilitirit]

if you don’t have meter and you do all of ryu’s special moves in one frame and press punch and kick you will get srk

I tested this with macrolua and as expected, tatsu has higher priority than SRK. 62141236 + k + p gives tatsu. 62141236 + p gives SRK.

[my_name_is_better]

BlockStun Cancel.

No, not like “Bursting” or anything, just the ability to Cancel the guard animation. I have seen in it some old fighting games (can’t remember the name exactly), where characters cancels blocking into special move into super.

In case I was wrong about this info (hazy memory), think of X factor instead.

[jedpossum]

BlockStun Cancel.

No, not like “Bursting” or anything, just the ability to Cancel the guard animation. I have seen in it some old fighting games (can’t remember the name exactly), where characters cancels blocking into special move into super.

In case I was wrong about this info (hazy memory), think of X factor instead.

You mean these series of games? Darkstalkers, Street Fighter Alpha, and Real Bout.

[Hecatom]

BlockStun Cancel.

No, not like “Bursting” or anything, just the ability to Cancel the guard animation. I have seen in it some old fighting games (can’t remember the name exactly), where characters cancels blocking into special move into super.

In case I was wrong about this info (hazy memory), think of X factor instead.

usually the games that have alpha counters, have them for a good reason, the preasure game its really good, plus in many instances you could get a guard break, or other kind of penalty for only defending, plus they always cost metter

[Coth_X]

I tested this with macrolua and as expected, tatsu has higher priority than SRK. 62141236 + k + p gives tatsu. 62141236 + p gives SRK.

Did you try p + k?

I’m curious if the game simply takes the first punch or kick it gets.

-trolls suck-