every fighting game you could ever play, will always have strategy, footsies and mind games regardless of the execution level. So a game with a high execution level is actually more difficult to play. Its an extra part of the game that must be performed now and that’s what creates the difficulty in a game. Adding extra yet different pieces to a game creates the difficulty which is why the “technical” fighters always have about a billion options to choose from and the “casual” ones usually omit pieces.
melee? that’s kinda pissy, but its fun.Let Josh 360 show you some moves
[media=youtube]ChJaTFDLRj8[/media]
this man can make beats on his arcade stick and come through crazy with the fly/unfly combos. I’m surprised he didn’t use cyclops to show the infinite.
But execution heavy characters are still around and they require just as much, or even more practice to pull off their combos. I’m pretty sure one of the people here explained that term. I feel that if you learn a lot about a character who has enough options to be regarded as an execution heavy character, characters with the opposite factor can come easy whn you are in the learning phase of that particular character
Ehhh… im sorry… i dint get why u quoted me and then said i have the execution of Desk… when i said i failed at playing Slash I-No because my execution istn good enough. Did i fail to catch something there? 0_0
Wow. Get your English together and I’ll give you a response.
Execution heavy games offer more levels of difficulty and in competitive games you get more sporadic levels of player skill. Neither non-execution heavy games or execution heavy games are better or worse, they’re just different. Chess is a great a game, and you don’t need to be jackie chan to move a chest piece. It depends on what you want from a game, some people like the idea that real life execution and skill will open up and unlock more options to deal and avoid damage in a video game, so they play fighitng games, FPS or RTS. Some don’t so they play RPGs or MMORPGs. IMO execution heavy games are better for competitive play.
[media=youtube]EytHvB0MNd8[/media]
Some one please correct me if wrong.
I think execution heavy are things that test players dexterity and endurance as some one else said… And when in fighting game it can add or subtract on some perspective.
I dont know about slash I-no, but I do think Ino requires a fair amount of execution to begin using her viably due to most of tools and options in tradition scenario having execution as an artificial barrier. Majority of her commands requires extra input than others and when the application is generally the same. While GGAC is execution heavy in it self, characters like I-no and Bridget requires more so. (not to under value their design because they are properly one of the most versatile characters in the game )
IMO, the only thing an execution heavy game has over a more basic-centered game is more difficulty. When you get down to the point, both types of games have the same aspects such as mind games. In execution heavy games, there’s often more options to consider. Like take a game like ST compared to a game like MvC3, both are execution heavy to some extent: ST has a lot hard links and a very small, 1 frame, if not random reversal windows as well as just random stuff in general while in MvC3, there are more cancels as oppose to links but things can go on for a long time which take a lot of memorization and you also have examine your spacing (not saying that you don’t in ST…trust me, you do) and deal with the fact that you just can’t see things sometimes. One of the main differences between these games, as stated earlier, is what you have to worry about or think about. For example, lets take something like oki. In ST, you have to worry about crossups usually or whether chip will kill you if they lay something down meaty. In MvC3, you have to worry about the same thing but you also have to take into account things like if your opp. is using a character like Dante or somebody else with a teleport and also the kind of assists they are using, or if they can try and set up an unblockable. I think all in all, it’s just that more options or variables is added in execution heavy games that put more stress on the player to adapt if they want to win. I don’t think its a question of what are better games. I like ST just as much as I like GG. Both are executionally difficult to some degree but in GG there are almost a retarded amount of things you have to worry about in order to be successful in it.
My 2 cents…sry for the long wordy post.
I think the real question is, does that 20 hit combo in MvC3 or any other game with very long combos add anything to the game that SF’s 5 hit combos don’t?
well the thing is that execution heavy isn’t restricted to just combos…as stated earlier in the thread, it can also add a whole new dimension of mind games. Combos themselves will never make a game deep. Doesn’t matter if your character has a high execution combo that does full damage, ain’t worth anything if it can’t hit people. But if a character has a high execution mixup that forces a mistake with low execution combos, that’s worth a lot.
So that’s just a very long way of saying maybe. Does your 20 hit combo lead into a mixup opportunity or some situation that you can take advantage of?
execution heavy just means that it requires a lot of dexterity to play well, often the combos require very precise inputs, or other mechanics in the game are hard to pull off.
Street Fighter, and…?
No, really, Street Fighter (and SSB I guess) seem to be the only fighters that fits this description.
EDIT: I just realized that I bumped an almost month-old thread…
Execution heavy would be characters like Hawk and Zangief in ST. Especially Hawk’s negative edge Typhoon loops with built-in Dragon Punches. Basically just imagine doing 360s followed by DPs followed by more 360s and more DPs, all taking place in the same time frame that it takes to do a 3-hit BnB combo.
BTW, ST’s reversal windows are not random, they are 1 frame.
Am I the only one who finds Viper easy as hell execution wise? Yet I still can’t play MvC2. I don’t even think my execution is that good.
The concept that high execution destroys strategy is false.
The concept that high execution limits the number of folks able to effectively play the game isn’t. This may or may not put people off, which often depends on how well people know they’re being limited by execution. Getting killed by big hard combos is a lot more in your face then being killed by braindead option selects.
Combos alone also don’t make a game high-execution-look at Tekken. Combos aren’t that hard, but all that backdash/sidestep cancelling is very execution-heavy.
What folks should criticize isn’t execution, but arbitrary execution. SF4 is probably the worst offender in this category.
Fox is not the only execution heavy character in this game, he’s just one of the fastest. People who might not fully understand what execution heavy means may get the impression that speed = difficulty which is not necessarily true (although in many cases it is).
Anyway, it’s not simply easy games people look down upon, but just too much leniency period, even in technical games. 3rd Strike for example:
[LIST]
[]You are Ibuki against Chun. You have a mixup opportunity on her, so you do some block strings and attempt to do the usual baits and smart pressure, maybe throwing in some option selects to prevent getting hit with her c.mk for free and capitalizing on her attempts. It’s not the easiest thing in the world, Ibuki has to work hard to pull this off, not just because of input windows but due to the nature of her moves and the nature of Chun’s.
[/LIST]
[LIST]
[]But in the case of Chun, capitalizing on opportunities does not take nearly as much effort. She has numerous ways to confirm her high damaging super that don’t require fast reaction, inputs, or any kind of huge mixup effort. Her pokes are long range, high priority, fast, safe, can do things like hop over low moves and let her kara throw with tons of range. Her options are much easier, simpler, and yet still amazingly effective.
[/LIST]
Point is, people frown upon getting rewarded for things that you don’t really earn with hard work. If a character or game is considered “too easy” (hehe) you are rewarded for much less effort (less skill needed). That’s why lots of people praise execution heavy games, because the higher level of consistency necessary does not take away the level of strategy/depth the game has, and adds layers of skill.
Not to say that easier games can’t be good, just pointing out why lots of people prefer more difficult ones.
Zero Lancer
also…don’t forget melty blood.
edit:
generally, most “new school” fighters are combo heavy/oriented(high hit count combos)…and i know, for me at least…its harder, more time consuming, frustrating, and exhausting to learn and master these established combos in these new school fighters than learning the spacing, footsie type old school fighters.
i know i get way nervous every time i go to the arcade…not because i’m afraid of losing. i ALREADY know i’m gonna lose against those monsters that habitat the arcade…its coz i’m afraid of looking scrubby by dropping a air combo, or two.
which, btw, i do all the time:(
the reversal window is not random. However when you play at the higher speeds there is a chance that the window you need to input a reversal will be skipped and you end up not getting a reversal (due to frame skipping being the method that capcom uses to speed up their games).
I execution isn’t just combos, its being able to execute what you want when you want it. That could be timing your fireball corner trap to toss out the next fireball as soon as the first one gets blocked or hit (basically turning your fireball into a 1 frame link with the last one to minimize the oppurtunity for your opponent to get out of the trap).
In ST or HDR, reversal frames are never skipped, even at higher speeds. The only types of frames that are skipped are animation frames (aka display or video frames), which makes it look like the game is moving faster.
But the actual hitting frames or invincible frames or reversal frames (or any other type of frames other than display) are never skipped at any speed. So you will never miss a reversal in ST as long as your timing is good.
Off course, it’s all a matter of opinion. As Tokido once stated “maybe it’s ok to have an easy character after all.”