So far the bad/troublesome matchups seem to be the charge characters, grapplers, divekickers, and my personal issues with rose and cody. Anyone else wanna throw someone in before we start discussion? Or at least vote on who to discuss first?
I don’t think the twins are too bad. I’ve only played against one yang and he blew me uuuup but i feel that had more to do with me not being able to get used to the artificial increase in his cr.mk range, due to the walkspeed buff, than anything particular about the matchup. It’s very doable to react with psycho sting against their divekicks. The grapplers do feel really rough though. You can tickle them with pokes and antiairs for a while but it never feels sustainable and once they’re in it’s done. Bison also feels pretty bad but i’ve always been garbage against grapplers and lame bisons (and all other lame characters) so i dunno.
i think i will update the topic tomorrow. Sorry for the wait.
I haven’t played much, but I seem to have a lot of problems against Cody, Grapplers and Guile -_-;
Every other character I think I have a legit chance against~
I don’t think this has been discussed yet, but I think Poison needs to go on that list of characters we have a lot of problems with (at least me). One of my main training friends mains her and it seems everything she does is quite safe and can even beat Decapre. I know I mentioned this before, but tonight we played about 20 matches, and I BARELY squeaked 5 wins in, and those were close matches.
I think the main reasons I find this match hard is I have to take stupid risks to win, and if I don’t nail these guesses correctly, I die. The reason is simple, almost everything poison does is safe.
Just some examples of what is completely screwing me up:
-
lp rekka (1st hit):
Safe from a distance. So if she does c.lp, c.lp, c.lk xx lp rekka, she’s pushed you back far enough for it to be safe and she can continue her pressure. -
lk flip kick (whatever it’s called) :
same as the lp rekka really. -
overhead:
Safe, pretty quick and she can easily combo from it if it’s far enough. It’s like decapres overhead, but just…better. -
c.mk xx fireball:
yes it is safe (just like for everyone else), but in the corner she can just keep doing it (mixing it with ex) and lock you down. My friend does this whenever he can push me into the corner, and with a mix of that, her rekkas and her overhead it is pretty damn exhausting to block. -
Her jumping HK:
Easily one of the most annoying air to airs I have ever encountered in this game. Whenever I would try to jump in, my friend would do this, and there is nothing you can do. It at worst trades with decapres jumping HK. It’s a lot better than what most people would believe it to be. Maybe my buddy knows how to use it correctly, but when he does, there’s little I can do. -
Her backdash on wakeup:
I mentioned this earlier, but I am still having problems stopping my friend from doing this. c.lk OS sweep doesn’t hit, st.FP does the close animation, S.hk does the close animation. The delayed hands does work sometimes, but not always and it seems like he can dash twice to avoid lp hands.
I really feel this matchup is in poisons favor. I think a lot of people glaze over her because they are playing really bad poisons, but when she chooses to rush down, she has a solid mixup game that most people don’t see coming. If she decides to turtle, her buttons can not only keep decapre out, they plain out beat them on jump ins. Maybe as I play the match more I will get a better understanding of it, but as of now it is making me want to pick another character for this match up.
focus fireballs, get u2, stare at her
depending on what strength of fireball she’s using, either the mk to fireball or fireball to mk is not a true blockstring iirc.
sometimes you just gotta do the hard read and walk her backdash down, not everything has to be an OS. chris g likes to do this all the time
Is Anthony playing Poison now? -_-;
Her overhead is NOT safe. It’s -8 on block bro. But yeah, I haven’t run into any really good Poisons online yet. The only one I thought was any good was when I randomly play against BrolyTraps but I was using Juri at the time~
If you guys don’t mind my asking,
- I used to use Cammy’s s.HK against Gief all the time and it used to win against a lot of his options – is Decapre’s hitbox on s.HK different?
- Also, I used far.s.Fierce on accident as an anti-air… It kinda worked like Akuma’s far.s.Fierce >.> I could be wrong~
- How to punish Blanka balls on block? I tried Scramble Slide but I missed… Maybe I did it wrong?
i played broly once. he plays poison very different from how most poisons play. i played wolfkrone too he plays like all of them do but just obviously better. i think broly is so different because the nature of how he plays. i don’t think he can play poison in the way thats more common
I’ve been having trouble with Cody, T.hawk, Bison the most.
I don’t think the twins are inherently difficult, yun is just OP in general.
Ok so right now it seems like the list of troublesome matchups is:
Guile - I have a lot of trouble with him. I try to just play lame and focus most of his booms but usually whenever I get close I get blown up by flash kicks. Baiting is definitely your friend in this matchup but I seems to do so at dumb distances and get hit anyway.
Bison(Dict) - For some reason this matchup doesnt really bother me. I just hang back out of his range and when I’m ready I’ll spiral arrow/dive kick in. It doesnt really seem like he can do much about it. Be careful of his stomp, it will beat your stinger. And if he’s playing around doing stomp/devils reverse(is that what its called?) in the opposite corner you can hit him with AA U2. Also I switch sides on him A LOT. It may just be scrubby online Bisons but it seems most of them love to hold back on the stick and just cant adjust in time. I saved a few of my replays so if I can upload them i’ll share with you guys.
Honda
Vega(Claw)?
Balrog(Boxer)? - All I have for this is to spam hands. I never even really use hands until I run into Rog and it seems to save me everytime.
Rose
Cody
Yun
Yang
Rufus?
Poison - Stay back and slide under fireballs. If she has you in the corner and is doing fireball “block strings” you should actually be able to stinger through them with mp. Be careful jumping in, as her DP is absolutely ridiculous.
Zangeif
Hugo
T. Hawk
So these are the little tips I have for now. I’m by no means a great player but I’d still like to help in whatever way I can. If I can manage to upload some vids to YouTube then I’ll be sure to share them with you guys. And feel free to copy and paste this format, as it may make it a little easier for the topic creator to update the first posts.
im garbage and won’t attempt to give any advice but here’s the hands safejump list for those characters:
guile - light
bison - light, medium, heavy
honda - light, medium, heavy
vega - medium, heavy
balrog - heavy
rose - heavy
cody - light, medium, heavy
yun - light
yang - light, medium
rufus - light, medium, heavy
poison - heavy
hold uf and do late j.hk after any of the versions of rapid dagger listed. if they don’t quickrise wait a frame or two after landing and do nj late hp
here’s some theorycrafting though:
i’m thinking maybe use u1 for guile? i feel like there’s so few opportunities to actually punish booms with u2. i’m thinking, absorb booms til u1, attempt to walk him to the corner then activate. he doesn’t have any particularly good ways to circumnavigate the stream so he has to deal with you getting in for free and mixing him up at that point. thoughts?
I thought U1 vs Guile was the standard anyway. Doesn’t seem like U2 punish vs Sonic Boom is practical, and he’s not exactly throwing out punishable moves on the regular either
I thought U1 vs Guile was the standard anyway. Doesn’t seem like U2 punish vs Sonic Boom is practical, and he’s not exactly throwing out punishable moves on the regular either
Very much agree. I kind of go through a flow chart when deciding on Ultras as I assume most people do. What I don’t do is use W-Ultra as in my experience that takes the damage down too much on both Ultras such that now neither is a credible threat. That said there are a few matchups where I was using U1 where I’m now giving U2 more consideration. Most notably Hugo who can, as best as I can tell, anti-air grab (EX only?) over any non-meaty U1 that’s approaching him with the idea that whatever he eats as a punish on his recovery is going to be preferable to eating U1 + mixups and possible follow-ups.
so basically, the consensus is, broadly speaking, use u1 in matchups in which it’s difficult to get in (and the opponent is lacking strong tools for circumvnavigating the stream) and use u2 in matchups in which it’s easy to be aggressive?
problem is u1 and u2 are too good, i guess you can choose based on playstyle more than mu
Characters like Akuma/Bison etc are probably never going to get hit by U1 in the neutral game, in those cases I’ll pick U2. Mostly go with U2 for punishes and the ‘no jumping’ scare factor. Right now I always change between the 2, mostly U1 online though because I can’t seem to get U2 to AA fast enough online, this is just my scrubiness though.
Characters like Akuma/Bison etc are probably never going to get hit by U1 in the neutral game, in those cases I’ll pick U2. Mostly go with U2 for punishes and the ‘no jumping’ scare factor. Right now I always change between the 2, mostly U1 online though because I can’t seem to get U2 to AA fast enough online, this is just my scrubiness though.
can’t do it either, but wouldn’t it be better to aa with stinger then follow up with u2 anyway?
Yeah it is better when they jump in at you, raw AA ultra if they neutral jump etc. I always forget you can get U2 after stinger AA.
Also you can do dash AA ultra and it will catch jump backs as well. Pretty satisfying catching someone jumping back full screen away (AKUMA)
just dicking around testing how some moves interact with guile:
cr. jab stuffs upsidedown kick so tech with the cr.lp~cr.lk plink
cr.mk counterpokes backfist up to 3/4 screen away
cr.mk low profiles guiles st.hk from a very particular range (about two training squares), if you’re too far off it’s fine, both moves will whiff but too close and you might get counterhit
cr.mk low profiles guiles st.mk without a problem slightly outside of his st.mks max range.
cr.mk low profiles guiles st. hp slighlty outside of st.hp max range.
always buffer mk to lp hands for safejump
knee bazooka high profiles early cr.mk quite reliably
rolling sobat high profile cr.mk very reliably.
basically, jab tech is pretty good, cr.mk is pretty good except sometimes