Hey guys, so the Elena board is pretty dead. I’m sure this has been talked about, but one thread on the Elena board is just depressing.
So recently I started playing Elena more seriously. I’ve found that her normals are fucking amazing. Does anyone think another character has better normals and pokes? Normally my strat is to keep them away with poking and wait for them to get frustrated and do something stupid. This is when they throw out a shoryu and the hurt begins.
So how do you guys play Elena? As a new Elena player, do any Elena vets disagree? Do people consider Elena best with offense? defense? mixed?
I don’t think there is a rigidly defined way to play Elena that you can just watch in a match vid like you can with Yun or Chun-Li. Some people like to turtle or use healing, some people like to rush with kara throws and mixups.
She’s so unpopular that it doesn’t seem like there are a whole lot of authorities to ask about this sort of stuff, I mean we have some pretty good Elena players here like Skankin, and there are vids of Elena playing at SBO and stuff, but I don’t think anyone’s bothered to get to a really high level with Elena (like Aruka is with Ibuki).
I think the reason no one’s bothered to get very far with her is because she’s kind of like to Chun-Li what Sean is to Ken…similar, but way worse. Everything she can do, Chun can do better, except for maybe her overhead, her crossup, and her ability to be from Kenya. If you’re gonna bother learning to hit confirm off crouching MP and kara throw and memorize a whole bunch of proper distances to use certain pokes, you might as well go all the way and pick Chun.
its one thing to use her because you actually feel like you’re better with her than other characters. but why stick out as a shitty elena player, instead of a subpar chun player? its the people who actually think about tiers in the first place that lets it affect them. if you lost you lost cause the other guy was better than you during that match, whether it was yun, chun, or 12. on that note, having some type of aversion to a character because they’re “top tier” is retarded. hate a character cause their not you’re style, not because of how good they are.
Pick Elena if you want more THEORETICAL damage potential than Chun (although much harder to pull off, and not even possible vs some characters), a better hi/lo/throw mixup WITHOUT meter, and a few more options in certain matchups (mostly stemming from SA3). If you want a character with more solid pokes and easier damage in general, pick Chun.
I’m not a shitty Elena player. I’m better with her than I am with chun. I like her style more than chun also. Your saying I should play chun and stop thinking about tiers? Are you even listening to yourself? “Play a top tier characters, don’t think about tiers”.
Also this, “if you win or lose its 100% because of skill and it had nothing to do with tiers or match up,” shows you either really don’t understand the end game or you whore the top tier and this is what you tell yourself to sleep at night.
you say that, but what you posted above is something you can do the exact same way with chun, but with better results. tiers have nothing to do with what i’m aiming at, its just efficiency. if thats how you want to play, play chun. you haven’t really described what it is about elena that you like.
also if you’re picking a weaker character the fact that you have to work harder is a forgone conclusion; its something you already know. At a certain level, you’re not playing the characters(or tiers), you’re playing the person; at this point whoever outplays the other wins. That’s what impresses me the most, no matter what character people play. You can find Rikamaru and Yamazaki equally impressive, despite the characters they play. My point being, you don’t lose to characters, you lose to people. If you can’t see the truth in this then you probably just need more experience. People need to start shedding this attitude that winning with character A is somehow more glorious than winning with others. At the end of the day, all it does is limit your own gameplay.
I know ramza really well through playing with him at a lot of tourneys and he knows what he’s talking about. As much as I love to use the crazy ninja lady (mainly because she fits my style of play, I like her character and I don’t like using characters that everyone else plays) there’s too many people that throw around the words “tier whore” whenever someone wins with a top tier character. Not saying that you do this yourself, but when you play enough in tounaments you start to realize that there’s people who will pick Ken everytime you see them in a tournament and you’ll beat them everytime. Then there are those who pick Ken and will beat you just about everytime. I’m not going to sit there and go “you only beat me because you picked Ken” but Ken simply has really good tools to win matches with and someone who utilizes those tools well is going to…win matches.
The great thing about high level play is that a smart player can find tools and win with just about any character. Yet…picking a strong character is part of the strategy and in some ways being the guy that’s really good with YCK is sometimes tough because everyone already knows what to expect with those characters. You really have to be on top of your game and know how to keep the opponent guessing with a character that has been seen time and time again.
Especially in a game where a couple correct guesses can turn things around significantly. At that point…it’s not so much about tiers when someone wins as it is who is simply playing smarter. It’s just the player using the better character will obviously have overall stronger tools available to them. From there if you’re using a weaker character it’s on you to overcome the tools of your opponent and create opportunities and tools of your own to win. Making it more of a game of wits than a game of who is picking the better character. Like you say though…the tiers can not be ignored and Yun brute forcing a win in when he has no health against a 70 percent + health opponent is not necessarily the most uncommon thing in the game. All it really takes is a couple good guesses with the tools that Yun has and that is definitely a factor at high level play.
In the end though…picking a character with strong tools is part of the strategy and if someone is winning matches because they are using the correct tools…there’s nothing wrong with that. You either level up your game with the character you are using or pick up a character with better tools or tools that better fit your play style.
I don’t understand not giving people like yamazaki, (old) kuroda, YSB, Hayao, and even Pinoab7 extra respect. I consider myself pretty good and one time this dude beat me with twelve. I thought it was fucking awesome/amazing. If a guy beats me with YCK i would also respect him/it. But if someone does it with Twelve, Hugo, Q, or Sean I give them that much more respect for not only challenge the conceptions of who is competitive/tier listing and becoming good with a low tier character, but also just for beating me with a low tier character.
I’ve played YCK (and I will add MD) and that shit just doesn’t really impress me too much anymore.
Showing respect to someone being good with a lesser character…I mean there’s nothing wrong with that. Especially outside of Japan where not as many people are inclined to use anything other than top 3 in a tourney in the first place. I mean you can give respect or not give respect to whoever the hell you want…it’s video games. I’m just saying there’s no reason to look down upon a player’s skill level based on the fact that they are using characters that are statistically better in the game. There’s a lot of people who’ll watch a skilled Chun Li or Ken player run through players and just blow him off simply because of the character he’s using and act as if he’s not much better than they are. You see it all the time from random ass posters on message forums or commenters on YouTube. The player picking the right tools to win and win consistantly is part of what it means to be skilled in the first place.
Personally if someone beats me with Twelve or Q I would definitely give them respect for that but not necessarily more than someone who won with any other character. Mainly because I understand that in a tournament situation…picking the right character to win with is part of the skill and I know players who could beat me in some matches with low tiers but use top tiers in tourneys. They just understand what will better their game in a tournament situation and there’s nothing wrong with that.
I’m all for challenging conceptions, but I think a lot of people have realized by now which characters are stronger in situations where you must win consistantly. Especially for a 10 year old game.
You know I’ma be there. I know what u mean tho…I’m usually at about every C3 so when I miss one it feels like an eternity. Doesn’t really feel that long to me since I go to so many tourneys as it is. I haven’t even really played a whole lot since one of the wires in my stick got loose. I only fixed it like yesterday. The next C3 is basically in mark in history as far as east coast fighting gaming is concerned so I’ll have to be there. I’ve never made it to ECC before and now that C3 is taking over it’s place and close to where I live…there’s no way I can miss it. Two whole days of hardcore fighting gaming.