Elena General Discussion

I usually don’t post on the forums because everyone here has the knowledge game covered but I feel compelled to post my thoughts on Elena.

Using Elena has been such a hate/ love experience to me. First I’ll go over the stuff I hate.

The hitbox of lynx tail is inconsistent. Needs to stretch a bit downward to be able to hit close and even far crouched opponents. I think of this move as like rekka except with rekka’s I know I’ll get my rewarded with my risks.

The wheel move is so inconsistent. Especially the HK version. I could never get the reps to connect even off a dizzied opponent. I feel like it a weird bug. Also this move is supposed to help keep the pressure but I can’t even rely on it as a decent bread and butter. I feel if they made the range similar to 3s, she would have a far stronger mixup game as you would have to guess between wheel/mallet smash.

Standing mp feels very up in the air. Sometimes it’s good as an anti air, sometimes as a poke, but the results are all over the place.

Her pokes could use improvement all around.

Rhino horn doesn’t hit forward at all. If anything the hitbox is above her foot. Who dropped the ball on this?

Jumping HK- I have no idea what to think of this. You have to do it early. It does have great priority but the range sucks. It just seems unfinished. You can juggle.

The stun- oh my god. Since when is Elena a glass jaw?
THE HORRIBLE MATCHUPS SO FAR:

Bison- My god. This matchup is the worst for Elena. From the few bisons that I fought. I didn’t have an answer for his standing mk range. Scissor kick pressure was tough to deal with and any counterattack had more risk then reward. Not the mention your mixup game is completely gone since he can just psycho crusher out anytime he wants. The only thing I didn’t try was red focusing the scissor pressure but all of his move beat U1 clean or trades. The main problem is Bison’s damage trades far exceeds yours. Combine this with the low stun and you’ll see why I hate this match.

Honda: Headbutt beats everything. This is one of my first Matchups with her so it could have been better, but her air normals have a weird range with Honda. If anyone has any tactics let me know but as far as I know I don’t have a solid counter attack and mixup game is gone due to Headbutt. Her only option is the cross up but that gets predictable.

Rose- I don’t have an answer for drill pressure. If they try it on wake up you can throw but other than that. Its tough since dp is not a good get off me.

Other match up notes

Decapre- This match surprisingly isn’t too bad for Elena. Thea good tool against her is rhino horn. I know! But a lot of air teleport moves/jump ins are the prime range for rhino horn. You can get the max damage which is decent (because the move is crap 99% of the time aside from ex for shotos). Also the best range I found is right outside her dp range. You can do overheads mix up with crouch HK or mallet smash combos. Not too bad so far.

Rolento- again. Not too bad. One thing you need is good defense but you either have the tools the evade his trickery or to keep him from doing whatever he wants. This is one of these fights where I would randomly poke with lk just to let him know he can’t move towards me whenever he wants to. Doing dp has gave me some results if you feel he’s going to do duck tales shenanigans. You wanna play the far close up game. If you are too close he has the better pressure.

Hugo- HK is your friend all day. It beats out most of that bear clap crap. Mix it up with slides from a distance. One note I do need to make. You can beat out his air attacks with crouch hp:/ mp/lp. DO NOT START KNOCK DOWN MIXUP WITH MALLET SMASH. It counts as an airborn move and back breaker will beat it out cleanly. HK or trip seems to work better. If you want to do malet smash, get the opponent thinking you’re going low or combo from HK. Also because Hugo is such a tall character, crouching hp becomes a great poke on the ground.

Poison- Match seems even to me. Keep close but not right up close. Slide under fireballs. Punish focus with horn or mp. They tend to focus often but Elena focus is decent but weird.

What I like

I like the potential I see. There are definite things that I see wrong that capcom can easily fix and should fix. I wish we had the chance to play her arcade version because I feel if she had some of the tools she had before she might of had an answer where as of right now it seems like she doesn’t. when I am on fire with her I really feel like the opponent doesn’t know what to do and it’s very satisfying. Most cases though I do feel like I’m doing a lot of work and risk for very little reward.

Random tips

If you want to make sure lp mallet smash doesn’t go over to the other side, you can use lk in a combo. It creates some space which should be enough to land the move. I haven’t played around in the lab with this yet but I definitely noticed the space it created whenever I used it.

Dash up and throw been working for me. Also mixing up mallet smash and throw. Throws all around.

Those are my thoughts so far. Anyone have match up advice for her?

@JstrikerX‌ I already went over her notable tools and button advice as far as matchup advice it’s really early in the games life but can say backdash Rose’s drill pressure your cr.mp beats hers and just throw her all day until she starts backdashing on wake up then switch to using HK or (ugh) B+HK to catch her backdash or crouch tech and you’re golden.

AAs I’m using are St. LP, St. MP. I haven’t tried but maybe cr. HP? I think it might be too slow though. I’m also having trouble getting lynx tail to come out consistently as well. It might be my controller, execution or both but it’s frustrating not getting the moves you want half the time.

For meterless damage punish you should end with MK Scratch Wheel as it does more damage and keeps the stun. From what I’ve noticed her heavy lynx tail and scratch wheel both do less damage than their MK ones and they don’t let people fall out as much. I don’t see a reason to even use the Heavy versions of the move. I wonder if it is suppose to be like that or not?

i noticed that too, thought it was strange. Maybe there are other properties to it?

I wonder why Elena was nerf’d so hard… Was she really that great before the console release? All I truly want from her is a good anti air and some of her weird bugs fixed… If she had that I’d be more than willing to grind it out with her. I’m currently the number 2 on psn, but I’m rarely happy with any if my victories…

Yea she’s shit. I feel like any wins I get are undeserved and are from my opponents making mistakes rather than myself playing well. So bad.

I played Elena during the Japanese loktest and she was wonderful. Really, really fun to play as. Cancellable st.HK was great and that alone might make her not as terrible as she is now. Also, her slide was much better and made matchups like Guile firmly in her favor. It was really fun seeing Japanese dudes get salty as hell, but now I’ll be the one getting salty.

I mean, being completely honest, she feels much stronger in 3S than she does in this game. And god knows was the bar set low for her there.

It’s so sad how many of her specials are not that reliable due to them whiffing in so many different situations. Her main BnB I just found out always whiffs on Gen, Cammy, and Yang when crouching. Even if you try and variate the combo with a Scratch Wheel, it can still whiff depending on your range and if the variation whiffs it will be an absolutely guaranteed punish with pretty much anything they want(ultra included)

Well, on the Honda matchup, especially the headbutt and how hard it is to deal with:
I’ve noticed that Rhino Horn will, on occasion, beat it. It seems like you have to react to the headbutt in a kinda weird way, as it seems to be during the animation where her legs are spinning that it can beat - as in, the part before she starts lunging forward. Can sometimes beat it during the lunge itself, but you’d pretty much have to predict the headbutt for that and they’d have to do it full screen. It’s really hard to do this in practice, but it has happened on rare occasions. I’ve even beaten an EX Headbutt like this.

A more valid reactionary measure is EX Scratch Wheel. The timing is still pretty weird, though. If you wanna blow all your meter, her super will also very cleanly beat headbutt.

Brave Dance will ‘trade’, which is a really bad trade so don’t do it.

Also, if they are full screen and do headbutt, try st.MK or st.MP. If you time it right, it’ll stuff it. Time it wrong, and it’ll trade.

St.HK, cr.MP, and cr.HP all trade, I can never get them to cleanly beat headbutt at any position.

Pretty much all this stuff will work on EX headbutt just as it does the normal one.

Note: I just tried with Bison’s Psycho Crusher and noticed a lot of this holds true for that as well, although I was able to get cr.HP to cleanly beat that with proper timing. Looks like the above info should be a good starting point for most characters who have similar moves, like Blanka and such.

I’d say Elena has improved compared to past versions.

c.LK, c.LK, c.MP xx EX Mallet (x4) into full Ultra= 340 dmg. Pitiful.

/thread

She has by far one of the floatiest jumps in the game. Top 3 or 5 for sure

If you’re doing a hit confirm, going into ultra is not a good option unless you want to kill or are in the corner, it’s much better to burn meter instead

Okay, i’ve been playing around with Elena(lol) for a while in the training room, and I’m pretty sure I’ve finally came up to a conclusion on her most efficient BnBs, cuz she’s got so many damn specials. I’ve been lurking around the SRK forums for a while now but I decided I might as well share what I’ve found. So here goes, Elena’s BnBs :

0 Bars

cr.lp, cr.lp, cr.mp xx M spin scythe extension (214 dmg, 322 stun)
HP mallet smash, cr.mp xx M spin scythe extension (312dmg, 404 stun)
St.hk, cr.lp, cr.mp xx M spin scythe extension (good for catching techs) (284 dmg, 472 stun)

Bascially, you’re gonna want to end in a cr.mp xx M spin scythe. That’s gonna be her basic punish combo as well, unfortunately. Depending whether or not you have enough time to put a HP mallet smash before.

1 Bar

HP mallet smash, cr.mp xx L rhino horn, EX scratch wheel (391 dmg, 486 stun) its really amazing how much damage this does.
cr.lp, cr.lp, cr.mp xx EX mallet smash, cr.lp, cr.mp xx M spin scythe extension (270 dmg, 410 stun)
cr.lp, cr.mp, EX lynx tail, U1 (437 dmg, 278 stun)
cr.lp, cr.lp, cr.mp, EX spin scythe, U1 (near corner) ( 416 dmg, stun 320)

2 Bars
HP mallet smash, cr.mp xx H lynx tail FADC cr.mp xx M spin scythe (386 dmg, 488 stun)
cr.lp, cr.lp, cr.mp EX spin scythe, EX scratch wheel (corner) (282 dmg, 428 stun)
cr.lp, cr.lp, cr.mp xx EX mallet smash, cr.lp, cr.mp EX Lynx Tail, U1 (342 dmg,394 stun)

Then there are 3 bar combos that are not worth doing at all imo, as you can get almost the same damage with probably 2 bars, maybe even 1 depending on the mixups. But just for fun

3 Bars
HP mallet smash, cr.mp xx H lynx tail FADC cr.mp xx L rhino horn, ex Scratch wheel (443 dmg, 546 stun)
HP mallet smash, cr.mp xx H lynx tail FADC cr.mp xx EX lynx tail, U1 (533 dmg, 462 stun)

Also EX Red focus that I didn’t bother testing. It’s not like she needs more methods of getting into her U1 or big damage.

If I made any mistakes or anyone found anything that does more damage for less better, and is viable in a match, please let me know.

training mode testing conclusions:

-ken can meterless punish all of elenas specials regardless of spacing EXCEPT hp mallet smash
—either reversal hp shoryu / c.mk / sweep on block
—when spaced to be safe from hp shoryu (due to range), specials (eg. ex spin scythe) leave gaps or do not land their final hits on block/hit leaving you open
—ken can punish c.mp with raw super, c.mp -> spin scythe is not a true blockstring

-hp mallet smash
—basically all normals will beat it
—ken can beat it on reaction easily w/ stand/c.jab/c.hp etc.
—hp mallet even loses to a well timed c.mk and sweep once elena’s way in the air …

Honda is such a hard match up its not even fair but what i do is that cr.LP will actually beat out headbutts all the time if spaced well. It will only trade with EX headbutt so just dont even try its a bad trade clearly. Also neutral jump MK will help if you predict a Command Grab from him and it keeps pressure up.

That works? I didn’t realize cr.lk combos into itself or cr. Mp.

Improved relative to what? Elena is ass dude. Why even mention HP mallet combos it’s a slow as dirt overhead that gets beaten by every cr.mp in the game. Her hitboxes on her specials suck. Her hurtboxes in general suck. Compared to xT she’s ass and compared to 3rd strike she’s relatively similar, which is terrible. All of her buttons are negative except for cr.lp and cr.lk (+2 non chainable and 0 respectively) safest special she has leaves her at -1 and is slow as dirt. Ryu can punish almost everything with shoryu or shinku. Gief can SPD 90% of her moves Hugo can Back breaker on wake up because her anti crouch tech buttons are also considered airborne and command grab everything else. She has a floaty jump and her EX Rhino doesn’t hit crouchers, which is huge in the Juri and sagat match up. Her EX Rhino can’t even focus break Juri, Rose, Sakura and Akuma properly. She sucks ass. All capcom had to do was tone down her damage from xT, remove juggles and remove projectile invulnerability on EX lynx and Mallet smash and she would’ve been great. They need to make edition select Elena so you can pick one of her earlier loki test iterations.

Edit: She can’t even fucking frame trap properly because all of her shit is negative except for 1 move. Her main AAs do trash damage because of damage distribution or the fact that it’s a light which means you need to utilize another slow as dirt move that trades as well. Oh and did I mention people drop out of most of your fucking moves? She’s just terrible with no redeeming qualities.

Just poppin’ in to say, Rhino Horn may be one of the most god tier anti-airs in the game. Its first couple of hits attack extremely high in the air and pretty far horizontally. If someone jumps in the corner and you tag em with Horn they are gonna take 300-450+ damage. Pretty sure you can get at least 300 mid-screen as well; I need to go back to check that.

My fav combo is RH Horn > EX Horn > EX DP. SO GROSS. All versions can combo into ultra. EX can combo into ultra from over half a screen away if you time it correctly. MK is the most effective it seems due to its average, range, speed, and damage.

EX Rhino Horn can punish jumps from absurdly far away. Everyone, training mode! GOGOGO! Her anti-air punishes may be more brutal than Rufus’ j.RH into EX snake.

Don’t get me wrong though, I still think she’s trash, lol. Top players don’t jump much anyways, so good luck landing this in the top 10 of a tournament.

No it’s not because it loses to everything. It punishes empty jumps but try to beat out something common like Ryu’s jHK, and Juri’s jHk or god forbid Rog’s jHP. Make the dummy less telegraphed with varying heights of when it does moves. Pay special attention to the apex of their jump arc when most people use jump attacks. It’s situation and it’s ass.

Edit and just to be more productive her best AA is probably st.mk and EX scratch wheel anything else just trades or is ass

There is one good thing about Elena. No matter what character you are fighting against, you know that if you won, you were hands down the better player at that moment. The game didn’t give you anything. You earned that victory.