It was always +4 though… o.o
Nvm misread that
B+HK now properly gains additional frame advantage on counterhit
HK Lynx Tail was changed somehow I don’t understand fully for hits 1-3 on air hit.
EX Scratch Wheel 1st hit Self hitstop and blockstun for opponent has been increased by 4F. Because of the self hitstop change it should be the same frame data as before on FADC. (Haven’t verified)
EX Scratch Wheel 2nd and 3rd hits self hitstop increased by 4F, opponents reduced by 1F. Blockstun increased by 5F. Elena now has the same hitstop as her opponent during EX Scratch Wheel. Should be no change to frame advantage/disadvantage on block.
UC1 now properly grants opponent meter on hit for every hit.
Unlisted changes for Elena.
Yea I got the bible on Friday and when I saw that hitbox, I was pleasantly surprised, also 5 active frames which is great, however 13 frames is too slow, and is only a great move if someone is silly enough to jump from a very far distance which don’t happen much. This move should be a 10 frame move and even though before I said they should buff her active frames on CRHP and CRHK, just making STHP a 10 frame move alone, they would be no need to buff CRHP and CRHK. I think now making it 10 frames and hit crouchers as well would make the move too good based on what have seen in the book.
Very happy that they added CH bonus to b.hk, definitely going to work on implementing that into my pressure even more and practice confirming off of it. I already got tons of mileage from b.hk the way it was before, excited. Seeing the hitboxes for a lot of her moves was pleasantly surprising for me as well, s.mp and cr.hp in particular have better hitboxes than I thought they did.
Honestly, even if I don’t think she’s a great character (I haven’t accepted bottom 5 yet though, I have some hope), I have to admit I’m really loving playing as Elena. I love the playing the slow, methodical ground game and dragging out the clock. I love being able to whiff punish things with cr.mp xx EX mallet for huge damage + pressure. I love getting in people’s faces with HK Lynx FADC and going for tick throws/b.hk nonsense, and annoying them to the point where they throw out an unsafe reversal which I block and proceed to punish with her excellent damage/stun output. The amount of stuns I’ve been getting lately have actually been surprising considering I’m just going for basic pressure and not extremely ambiguous/hard to block setups.
The more I play her, the more I think that she actually would have been an amazingly powerful character without her nerfs from arcade to console, though I must admit that this doesn’t take into account the buffs she got in compensation as I don’t know what it’s like playing her without them. Stuff like faster walkspeed, faster cr.mp, more invincibility on EX Scratch, hugely useful stuff.
I don’t think she needs a lot of changes, really, but there are the few things that I would like.
Would be nice to have a more reliable s.hp for combos, it’s kind of a chore having to remember every situation that it works and doesn’t work in, as far as stunned opponents, jump-ins, crumples, punishes… I’m starting to get it all drilled into my brain (doesn’t help that there are 44 matchups) but it’s honestly quite silly.
A better armor breaker would be great, whether that’s allowing EX Rhino Horn to hit crouchers or making mallet smash (or even just EX) armor break.
Better anti-air hitbox on either s.mp or s.lp. I want something that is reliable and will rarely trade, even if it’s extremely low reward.
A few improvements in her general frame data on her normals would make her much more accessible, but doesn’t feel absolutely necessary. cr.lk being +4 on hit is the only thing I’m really hoping for, I really hate unplinkable (assuming no asinine controller mod) one framers. An extra active frame here and there on her anti-airs/air normals maybe.
I would kill for FADCable Mallet Smash so I could retain that as a safe overhead option if I had the meter. I definitely feel like making EX Mallet Smash -2 or better would be going too far, though. If not, I would love it if LP and MP Mallet Smash were made more useful in some other way, they’re too unsafe the way it is for how easy they are to block + the low reward on hit IMO.
Make forward throw range match backward throw range. So annoying having to walk up and then karathrow with back + lk~lp. Not as annoying as doing kara backthrow with makoto using f.lk, though, that’s even sillier. Or you could just increase her throw damage a bit 
(completely uncalled for I know, I just love the tick throw game)
Rest is pretty much gravy to me.
Anyone know if the guide is correct with showing her having no hurt box for her crouching lk? Or is that just a mistake?
That’s an obvious mistake.
edit: HK Lynx was techable on airhit for 1-3 in vanilla. I misunderstood was misc flag 16 is. It’s a flag used in the hit box tables used on all hard knockdowns so I assumed when they removed it that it had been a hard knockdown. That was my bad. There was SOMETHING changed but I don’t fully understand what it is yet.
Something that i wanted to throw out there that i don’t see but is probably known. Elena’s target combo 3 can combo into st. Hp. It works best on taller characters but it’s something to note. Also if the block the first hit and not the 2nd you can still combo into st hp.
One thing that i disliked for a while is Elena not being able to juggle into sweep or slide from j.hk that makes no sense.
I would have thought so too before ultra dropped.
Nothing is obvious as it stands with ultra
Gave Elena some play for the first time. I’ve looked at her frame data but I want to ask anyway since application sometimes differs: does she have safe chip pressure? Thanks.
No. What you see is what you get, just about all of her specials are unsafe. Unless you either know how to screw with people or they don’t know the match-up, there’s no way to apply safe chip damage. Playing offense will more than likely get you killed.
Not really but when spaced SS can be harder to punish. Some can’t punish it.
A while back I posted a few pass through glitches and some combos where B+HK would hit meaty mid combo. Since no one said much I guess it wasn’t read. But I’ll compile a list of characters this works on after work.
Just for starters though lvl 2 FA > B.HK > cr.lp is a combo on Ryu
The only discussion we have around his is Elena’s placement on the tier list. I wouldn’t mind seeing a list. Anything that can help my Elena game
Played an Ibuki tonight got hit by her F+HK when I did cr.lp and cr.lk (and crouch block btw)… Yup I guess this Ibuki just must’ve been running an updated USF4 because that’s not what sprint said.
Dr Ray used Elena vs Cjtruth in order to qualify there was a lot of st.lk.
that move feels active as hell.
it’s 2 active frames…
f+HK is the split kick. It’s shit.
f+MK is the slow overhead.
Learn which move is which and read my posts again dumbass.
damn that’s it?