El Fuerte General Discussion Thread

Classic Fighting Games Ultra Street Fighter IV
541

I’m not a Fuerte expert, but how is this even possible? You can barely link another fierce after it unless you have lots of practice and pinpoint timing, but you can link a super high startup ultra?

I really want to get good with Fuerte, but I’m really intimidated by RSF. How long do people invest in this combo before they can do 4 or 5 iterations with 90% consistency? Does anyone have a video showing the hands of someone doing this? I can get 2 hits 99% of the time, but 3 hits 5% or so (sometimes I manage to link crouching fierce as the 3rd hit, though).

542

That combo doesn’t seem to work. I did it about as fast as humanly possible, and it was always jumpable by the training dummy. It’s not a matter of getting the ultra to come out fast enough, I can do that, it just doesn’t seem possible to combo the grab. If this does work I’d love to see a video of it.

Infil, it took me like an hour to be able to get it to 3. I was stuck at 3 for a long time but now I can get 5-6, though I usually just do 4 for safety and also to make sure I don’t actually dizzy them with it. You want the RSF to get them almost dizzy, but if you actually dizzy them with a 5 or 6 hit combo you won’t be able to do any damage cause everything will be scaled to shit. I only do 5 on the higher stun characters who are luckily also the easiest characters to do the combo on, generally. The only time that you want to do as many as you possibly can is on the post-dizzy combo, but after about 6 or 7 at the most I wouldn’t think it would be worth it at all to continue. Better to make sure you hit the slide and get the knockdown rather than mess up for one or two more pixels of health imo.

The trick to the RSF is that you actually have alot more time than you think you do. As long as you go from jab to fierce very very fast, you can run in for a bit longer than you probably think. QCF+jab, wait, jab~fierce(very fast, like a piano from one button to the next), repeat. The most common mistakes are not waiting long enough after the run to close distance, and not pianoing from jab to fierce fast enough. You don’t want your runs to be too short or you’ll get the dreaded far fierce, but if you dont go jab~fierce fast enough, youll drop your combo.

543

I’ve asked before, but never got a definitive response from someone who could do the combo.

Does it matter the strength of punch used for the run? At first I was using MP, but then I switched to LP because it seems easier to get the timing down, and you’re just alternating between two buttons instead of three.

Is it possible to piano the HP too fast after the run-stopping LP? I’m trying to find out where my combo stalls. Sometimes I’ll start running and nothing will come out. Sometimes I’ll end up doing the HP throw out of the run. Is it possible to press the run-stopping LP too fast? I guess this would indicate I’m approaching the combo wrong anyway, since I definitely want to wait until after the run is out for a while.

Like I say, I’m able to get two iterations almost always (9 times out of 10 for sure), providing I intentionally stop after 2 fierces and don’t try for a third, so I think I understand the timing, kinda. I watched that one vid where the guy gets it to 7, so I can hear the timing of the buttons. But going for that third iteration, I just lose it somewhere. I try to input the QCF for the run too fast (and get crouching fierce). Most of the time, trying the third loop, I just fierce and then run, and nothing follows it.

If you have insights as to what I’m doing wrong, it would be appreciated. Thanks for your help halcyon.

544

Infil:

Use jab to stop the run. IMO, the 3rd button overcomplicates things. Using jab and fierce alone is just a good habit as you can use the same RSF principles in lots of Fuerte’s game(run>blockstring>run etc.)

Yes, you can jab~fierce too fast. It’s pretty fast but not THAT fast.

Go into training mode and start RSF off with a run. Put em in the corner and run at a character…he runs at him for a long time. Gather your will, jab~fierce > run and repeat that till you get the rythmn. Once you get the timing down add the initial fierce > run.

… If you can get reversal’d by being a couple frames off in your RSF, I don’t see how you can combo fierce > run >ultra.

545

As shubacca has pointed out, I’ve discovered that you can indeed piano the jab to fierce too fast. In fact, as fast as I would like to do it seems to be too fast.

And now I can’t seem to find that rhythm I found earlier. Seems I’m able to get about 6 or so loops down (they’re being blocked, but at least I keep the pattern going and am not running or doing the HP throw or what have you), but sometimes I even get the fierce to come out after the run and it whiffs entirely, even in the corner! Like, my fierce comes out while they opponent is still reeling, but it just misses entirely. What’s going on here? Am I not running far enough, but am close enough to get close fierce? This seems weird now. I can’t find the timing anymore. For what it’s worth, I’m practicing on a Ken dummy.

Strangely enough, I can only seem to get that (blocked) sequence of 6 RSFs if I deliberately focus on not inputting the QCF for the run until I’ve input the fierce (playing a ton of shotos and cr.mk xx fireball, where your normal is input with down held, will get you into this habit)… and the only way I can keep this focus is to look at my hands. As soon as I try it looking at the screen, there’s some barrier which prevents me from doing it, heh. Oh well, this part I’m not as concerned with, I just need to find that timing again.

I really feel a high-quality video showing 5 or 6 loops + slide at the end (because the timing is different there), with hands visible, would really, really help me - and the rest of the community too I’m sure. I’ll stop mentioning it because I’ve probably asked one too many times already. Just feel like this aid would really help us aspiring Fuerte players.

546

what character is best to learn RSF on? some seem easier than others – are they just different or would it be wise to learn the most strict?

547

Learn it on the harder people. Once you get good at doing it on them then when you have to do it to sagat or balrog or zangief it’ll seem like easy mode. Luckily, most of the top tier chars/hard fuerte matchups are also the easiest people to do the combo on. Dudes like Abel who fuerte aces for free(imo) are the harder ones to do it on, go figure.

548

yeah i was glad to see it was easier on blanka haha. i used to think abel was an easy matchup until i met a couple very solid players. i think it has more to do with me not knowing how to defend against abel though.

549

Theres a video of a guy doing seven hits of the loop somewhere on youtube, called “what you know about seven” or something like that. You can hear the button presses. You can probably find it if you hunt around.

550

idk if this is this is old or not, but i recorded what i think is a EX Run Kara Ultra.
[media=youtube]gRmSQwQD7jw&fmt=18[/media]
sorry about the quality it tends to skip often, but you can still see whats going on there.

551

^^ Fuerte NEVER looked cooler doing Christ the Redeemer pose than when absorbing that fireball. I want a screen shot of that for my wallpaper. What are the inputs? QCF+PP ~ QCF + KKK?

552

It’s primarily the ex armor absorb into ultra from that Rog video a few months ago.

It’s possible to do, but I don’t think it’s something to rely on in a match unless you’re confident. I’m sure there’s a bunch of instances to do this on, but it takes nerves of steel and some psychicness on your part.

It’s flashy as fuck though, definitely.

Yeah shubacca that’s the input; just an ex run canceled into ultra when you absorb the first hit. Your range has to be good. I like how he did it in the video though, Sagat is a reasonable opponent to do this on.

I guess this is just another chance for me to drop “moves to do against Guile’s c.HK antics”. But again, it can theoretically be done to any move that doesn’t break armor.

Anyway, nice video and thanks for uploading it.

EDIT:
you have to do qcf x2 KKK during the absorb, to my knowledge, but the system has proven lenient on lots of other shit, so maybe Skywalker can confirm his method.

553

nah if you do qcf+pp then qcf+kkk you will just get the slide kick.

the way i did it was: qcf down PP ~qcf KKK.

hope i explained it well enough.

heres a new vid, better quality no skips and you can hear the buttons aslo.
http://www.zshare.net/video/574955735a9d8f81/

youtube was acting up srry

554

that is amazing. i shall practice that at once

555

That is wicked… I hope I can incorporate this…

556

Damn, awesome find, guys!! So wicked.

557

That’s pretty neat. I would like to point that have it has very particular applications. This is like balrog’s Kara EX Ultra, only much less useful imo because you must totally commit to the input anyway. In pretty much every case where Kara EX would hit, random ultra would hit as well, but the Kara EX is an option select so it grants you a bit of time to confirm an ultra. The problem is, the extra complicated input required to perform it with Fuerte takes it from a ghetto hitconfirm to a crazy flashy set up. I would personally just guess the Ultra if I’m going to be guessing anyway. It’s not totally useless, of course if someone is very poke happy or meaty happy you could use it, but the complicated input I think definitely detracts.

HOWEVER, this is something that perhaps everyone hasn’t noticed, but you can do pretty much the same thing with Run~Stop~Ultra, being as how stop has (almost?) no recovery… I don’t think RSUltra is any faster than Kara EX Ultra, but with Kara EX Ultra as stated basically you just insert more buttons into the Ultra sequence you would’ve performed anyway. I think that RSUltra can be potentially as fast as Kara EX Ultra, but there is more leniency too.

So there’s two ways to do RSUltra. There’s a quick version, and a long version.

Quick version is done in the early frames of the run. It’s a lot like Kara EX Ultra but there’s much more leniency for a true confirmation. It goes QCF~PP, QCF+LP, QCF+KKK. Here you basically buffer the first motion of the ultra into the stop, and then just do another fireball + KKK for ultra. This is imo the best way to do the Ultra in close quarters because you should be able to react to most things within half screen pretty easily. Pretty direct.

Next way is a little more interesting. QCF~PP, QCF, QCF, LP~KKK. Obviously, you buffer the full Ultra, so it makes sense to do this one a little later in the run. In this you get an even easier hit confirm, just mash 3 buttons. I think this nice sprinkled in offensively, works vs laggy moves/some fireballs.

The main benefit of both of these versions is, they are pretty much safe because you just stop if you don’t want to commit to the ultra. There’s no crazy super input involved for little reward, instead, you have a low risk/high reward offensive maneuver to sprinkle into your game. Use it all at your own discretion.

Anyway, coincidentally this method brings me back to Mechanica’s “no focus combo into ultra”

Lol credibility squashed. Go back to the wiki. We also had this conversation months ago in this thread. (Shit dont work doggy, cant combo grabs)

558

Hi Skisonic, if you don’t mind - I’m copying and pasting your excellent explanation on other forums for people interested in Fuerte. (acknowledging you of course) :slight_smile:

This kind of stuffs just make Fuerte’s ultra even more powerful and the forward EX dash run even more dangerous.

559

Using El Fuerte, I found out how many dummies exists in the online world. On average, I probably x-over body splash just about anything waking up about 4 times in a row.

560

[media=youtube]9M3wabknCfA[/media]

[sorry srk guys, all this was meant for the youtube description, but it proved to be too long I guess? so disregard anything you guys already know haha]

xbox gamgertag: whiteframes
shoryken.com: mouko

A lot of people have been asking for a video showing the hands of someone doing El Fuerte’s Loop combo.

In this video, I do 4 loops into a slide.

First, sorry about the video not being able to the screen and the hands. I have one of those mini HD cameras, so I had to put it in my mouth to take a shot of the stick while making sure it was in the frame and watch ELF while trying the combo. You can imagine how hard it was.

For those that are interested in learning, here are some tips on how I learned it.

First, start out doing RunStopFierce (RSF) using this sequence:

QCF + Jab -> Jab ~ Fierce

Do that over and over until your fingers remember the timing. El Fuerte should run and slide into his close fierce (which is a backhand).

After you get used to doing that, start it off with a close S.Fierce xx RSF. Just try doing one loop to see if you get a 2 hit combo. The first RSF after a S.fierce tends to be the trickiest, if you stop to early, his fierce will miss If you do it too late it won’t combo. If you press the buttons too fast, you’ll usually end up doing his throw.

The rest should be self explainatory. After you get the first run loop down, just keep doing it.

Most people have been reporting they can get around 9 loops, max as skisonic pointed out. My highest has been 7. I don’t like to try for more than 4 or 5 in a real match. I almost always end with a slide. The combo will look like this.

s.fierce -> RSF x 4 -> QCF + jab -> rh (slide)

You can start the loop after a Focus (focus -> dash -> s.fierce -> rsf) or jump ins (great for punishing whiffed DP!)

If you screw up the loop and they end up blocking, you can change it up to a splash or better yet, a throw, but that will take some getting used to / improving your reactions with the combo.

Also, a friend of mine, Ohayo1234 (who is one of the top Bison[dic] in Japan) told me that the top Fuerte player almost never ends the Loop with a slide if the opp is in the corner. I’m not 100% why, but I think it might be harder to combo. He just does the loop until he stops comboing. I haven’t had time to really test this out though, so if you figure it out post a comment.

Hope this helps.