Do they exist? If not we could probably make one for analysis and because I am nerd for this kind of stuff hehe.
I like your marvel 3 team
R-action: Mitsuru god tier while normal Labrys is trash tier.
AoA: Chie’s is probably the best…seems to be the fastest and the visual cue is harder to react to, while Teddy and Mitsuru probably have the easiest to react to AoA’s…Kanji’s is very hard to react to but it has no range whatsoever
It’s going to be hard to compile a tierlist for this stuff.
Teddie’s A+B on paper sucks but it has the ability to cross you up, or not, depending on the distance. So what you do is you use it right before an item hits the opponent and you get a good, safe mixup.
Akihiko’s A+B can be canceled into from his kill rush and is meant to counter things other characters do to counter his usual followups.
So yeah there’s more to the general tools then just the raw data. Need to look at the character as a whole.
I think Kanji’s AoA is the safest (-5?). Chie’s is the fastest and has great range. Akihiko’s becomes the fastest AoA at LV.3.
I think for R-Actions you can have a tier list, but some are very hard to find a spot for as they exceed at different situations (Dia for instance).
That said, Kanji’s is prolly one of the best.
Kanji’s R-action can’t be safejumped right?
Mitsuru’s R-action I think is the best because you can’t run under it, if you roll it you don’t have enough time to punish, you can’t ground fatal counter it if she has meter (have to settle for hitting her out of the air) and it hits in all directions…there’s also the fact that if it counterhits, she can followup with ice super for huge damage and if it doesn’t counterhit and you tech early, she can do air unblockable super.
Rolls are all the same except for their distance.
A+: Mitsuru, Chie
A: Teddie, Yu, Yukiko
B: Elizabeth, Naoto, SLab
Unsure: Akihiko, Yosuke, Aigis
SLab should definitely be in A or A+(though if it’s A+ then Mitsuru should go higher). She can save herself somewhat thanks to her persona. The main issue is that if the opponent’s reactions are very good, they can cancel their normals into their own R-action.
I don’t really see Chie’s being that good…
Dude, Yosuke’s DP is godlike. Probably the best, with Mitsuru following right after it and then Chie right after it.
Yosuke’s DP can stop anything and is pretty safe and able to be spammed repetitively at a quick rate, even if it whiffs. So you’d have to be immediate in punishing or you’ll get hit with another one. Only characters who can honestly stop it, are those with range that can hit it and then punish right after. (Mitsuru.)
Akihiko’s is shit if you don’t have a one more or burst on deck. Highly punishable and slow in recovery.
I also personally think Kanji’s is pretty shit as well. It can be blocked and easily baited. A simple back dash and punish can stop it. And some people’s AoA’s can cancel it out and punish thereafter. If they’re not jumping in and blocking, you can use it to punish, but you have better options with kanji than resorting to that. (Such as the persona’s anti-air grab.) The recovery is awful, which makes me not one to consider it S+.
AoA - Chie’s is fastest, as well as Teddie’s. However, I don’t know how EVERY AoA for every character works, but Akihiko’s AoA is pretty amazing. It’s not the fastest, but it will whiff/cancel out almost any other character’s DP. (Excusing only Yosuke’s and Labrys’. And only Labrys’ depending on the timing that hers is shot out.) I’m not sure if everyone else’s AoA can do this yet, as I don’t play them, but if they do, then nevermind.
Roll is universal.
Roll frame data is universal, but Ia m pretty sure distance is different.
Akihiko’s DP is not that good. Lot of time to punish and only safe when blocked because you can’t cancel into power-up super if whiffed.
People are really undermining Yosuke’s DP. that thing is almost second rate to none. It can counter through anything. Chie’s can’t even do that.
Recovery is swift and the only person I’ve seen that can honestly punish it is mitsuru.
The problem is the reward for hitting it is low…
Honestly, that depends on the key moments it’s done, as with any DP. Yosuke players I know, who are very VERY good at him usually know the best times to do it and it mostly always work against various characters.
but then again you can combo with it…
as I said, it’s difficult to fit some into a general list. you can do a tier list for every situation and you’d have a complete different list every time,
if we speak about “momentum stealer” / “defense” / “fend off” type of DPs then yukiko for instance would be surely last even tho it shines in other moments.
S Kanji Mitsuru Yu
A Yosuke Chie Teddie
B Shadow-Labrys Akihiko Aigis
C Yukiko Elizabeth
**Kanji’**s DP is 1f startup armor, can never be safejumped. Leads to shock and is super cancelable on block into chair super (Kind of safe) or grab super (If they try to punish it too early) Completely destroys oki setups and is a game changing momentum breaker when you throw this out in neutral and they stick a poke into it and get shocked.
Mitsuru’s DP is super quick and invincible, but the reason this move is S is due to the hitbox on the damn thing. As for punishing it, you have the general super/no super bait. 8f moves and faster can punish her before she even lands. Hooray Akihiko.
Yu’s is pretty much the same as Mitsuru’s without the hitbox. Also first hit is air unblockable. Also sets up his comeback damage due to 1-hit B+D making a perfect cross slash crossup.
Yosuke’s is great but it can be safejumped on certain setups, does 500 damage only (Can combo off certain situations from a really really meaty hit) and can NEVER KILL his opponent. But the reason it’s A tier, is the same as Chie’s. It’s a great reversal for stopping momentum, and it is very quick so it makes it easier for Yosuke to whiff B+D to get into awakening.
Chie’s actually does damage as opposed to Yosuke’s but it suffers from the fact that a lot of characters can just jump cancel activate it and get away. Luckily, Chie can just cancel to power charge anyway as soon as it activates so woohoo free reversal into damage buff Chie! Also can be used in the air to get meteor combos.
Teddie’s is up there due to the fact he shuts a lot of oki down (Which is what 6 characters in this game rely on to win) and causes Rage. If his B+D hits, the opponent is put into a mixup right there of (Do I get hit by Bearscrew? Or do I try to hit him? Or jump away? Roll through 5B?) Teddie is in perfect range to do a mixup of hit or don’t hit so it scares the opponent since they are unable to block now. Also, very quick on whiff for good awakening activation.
Shadow Labrys’ is Mid tier because her’s is a bad reversal itself, but it’s often buffered with 5C anyway so it’s + on block most of the time. Of course because it’s infinite armor people who are expecting it can B+D it back after sticking a 5A out and take a persona card usually, but if they aren’t then that’s an easy way out.
Akihiko’s isn’t a reversal, so it’s not really the same as anyone else’s. It’s mainly used in combos or for AA since the first hit of Double Upper is Air Unblockable. With 50 meter it’s safe since you can cancel to Thunder Fists super and continue pressure or get out and try to bait their DP. Respectable for it’s non reversal priority, poop range as a reversal though.
Aigis’s is the penultimate “I’d better guess right with this” Probably -100 or worse, but the real part where this shines is that it activates/deactivates Orgia. If it had nothing to do with Orgia, it’d definitely be the worst B+D in the game based on risk reward (Worse than Elizabeth’s by far in terms of reversal options) The fact she can combo into it to save herself from overheating, or use it to reset momentum and restart her Orgia engine is scary. It’s pretty fast and has decent range too.
Yukiko’s gets the job done. 1 hit armor, full screen blowback/wallbounce in the corner. Heals too making it cost less health. Very nice if you manage to hit awakening with it and heal 10% extra life. Unfortunately, very slow, poor hitbox, 50 damage. It’s a DP with little reward and very high risk if they block it.
Elizabeth’s is the hardest to judge, but I’ll say it’s pretty crappy. It’s a techable throw which only does a status ailment. It’s best moments are 0-50 meter and 100-150 meter when you get Charm or Fear. Poison and Confusion are pretty useless for her overall gameplay since she can’t really mix up. Very unsafe on whiff. Generally is good for trying to apply fear if your persona is in danger of being broken.
Labrys’ can be charged, making it slower. Gives a combo on counterhit so it gives a small reward. Then there’s the problem in that it feels like it’s 20~ frames before the armor hitstop occurs and the opponent realizes they can just block or B+D it back. Horrible move otherwise. Not even a true blockstring into gear super to make it safe.
Naoto’s should almost never be used except against Elizabeth and Yukiko persona strings. The move itself is really poor and really low reward. It can be low profiled by a few things on reaction, can be reaction B+D’d. Hell, some characters can just move through her shield after activating it. It’s really bad and using this normally leads to Naoto dying for trying to wake up with anything not named Riot! or B Double Fangs.
At least, these are my opinions.
You can link almost every character’s DP, excusing naoto’s, aigis (Not completely sure.), Teddie’s and Yukiko’s.
Yu’s is totally not the same…you can run under it and punish it and if he cancels to super it goes the wrong way. You can’t do this against Mitsuru’s. Yu’s should be a tier lower than hers atleast.